(04-11-2021, 11:27 AM)PDub80 Wrote: You need to dive into these statistics a little further. You're telling me how good the cake tastes bases off of the icing.

According to Nextgenstats...

Only 12 of Tee Higgins 67 catches were over 15 yards in thenair last season. Only 8 of which were in the air over 20 yards... None of which traveled 30.

The Bengals ranked 31st in the NFL in deep passes completed (balls that traveled 20 yards in the air or more) ZERO of which came past 30 yards and the majority of which were 20-25 yards.

The Bengals also had the WORST trio of WRs in terms of avg yards of separation per catch. AJ Green 1.7, Higgins 2.5, Boyd 2.7.

The Bengals have NO ONE as a deep threat. Literally no one on the roster. Every Bengals podcast has touched on this the last 4 years. This is killing Taylor's offensive scheme AND Joe Mixon because teams cheat up and do not hold numbers back to respect anything deep.

Here's a link to nextgen https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/ to verify the WR stats. Who is reolacing AJ Green for you? Michael Thomas? Tate? UDFA Stan Morgan?

You drafting Bateman as your replacement for AJ Green? A late round flier on a WR to do it? You think Higgins is going to be prime AJ Green at some point?

Tee Higgins is not a deep ball guy. Not in the NFL. He doesn't have the speed or quickness. Can he grab jump balls and be a threat deep? YES. As the main guy getting doubled? Probably not.

You cannot run a 4 and 5 wide offense based around Tee Higgins and a great slot guy. Literally every piece of data on Bengals WR performance from last season and the prior seasons points to the Bengals not having anything (reliable... looking at YOU, John Ross) to take the top off of an NFL defense.

You disagree? Based on what? I showed you what I based my conclusions off of. What are you basing yours on?

(04-11-2021, 11:27 AM)PDub80 Wrote: You need to dive into these statistics a little further. You're telling me how good the cake tastes bases off of the icing.

According to Nextgenstats...

Only 12 of Tee Higgins 67 catches were over 15 yards in thenair last season. Only 8 of which were in the air over 20 yards... None of which traveled 30.

The Bengals ranked 31st in the NFL in deep passes completed (balls that traveled 20 yards in the air or more) ZERO of which came past 30 yards and the majority of which were 20-25 yards.

The Bengals also had the WORST trio of WRs in terms of avg yards of separation per catch. AJ Green 1.7, Higgins 2.5, Boyd 2.7.

The Bengals have NO ONE as a deep threat. Literally no one on the roster. Every Bengals podcast has touched on this the last 4 years. This is killing Taylor's offensive scheme AND Joe Mixon because teams cheat up and do not hold numbers back to respect anything deep.

Here's a link to nextgen https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/ to verify the WR stats. Who is reolacing AJ Green for you? Michael Thomas? Tate? UDFA Stan Morgan?

You drafting Bateman as your replacement for AJ Green? A late round flier on a WR to do it? You think Higgins is going to be prime AJ Green at some point?

Tee Higgins is not a deep ball guy. Not in the NFL. He doesn't have the speed or quickness. Can he grab jump balls and be a threat deep? YES. As the main guy getting doubled? Probably not.

You cannot run a 4 and 5 wide offense based around Tee Higgins and a great slot guy. Literally every piece of data on Bengals WR performance from last season and the prior seasons points to the Bengals not having anything (reliable... looking at YOU, John Ross) to take the top off of an NFL defense.

You disagree? Based on what? I showed you what I based my conclusions off of. What are you basing yours on?

(04-11-2021, 10:29 AM)bfine32 Wrote: I guess I'm not seeing the "oline or bust" mentality that some feel is getting out of hand. I've seen many debates on Pitts, Sewell, or Chase. I don't think I've seen much of any "we gotta take Slater, Darrisaw,..." at #5OA. I have seen quite a bit of "Chase or bust because Joe wants him". 

The only thing I've ever heard Joe say directly when asked about Chase is "I wouldn't mind throwing to him". Really not the all all want that Albert Brier "reported" and folks around here have jumped on. 

To be honest, knowing Joe's mentality, I'd be highly surprised if he's going out of his way to stump for anyone at this point in his career. He's always had a "respect must be earned" mentality. I doubt he's trying to be the biggest voice in the room going into his 2nd season. 

(04-11-2021, 11:23 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Very good point.

Based on the fact that they played together and Chase is an incredible talent I am sure Joe would love to have him as a WR.  But I doubt he is actually flexing or trying to force the team to draft him.

If media asked Joe how he felt about Sewell he would probably say he would be happy to play with him also.  Same with Pitts.

No matter what happens it looks like Burrow is guaranteed to get an elite player added to his offense.  I have argued strongly for Sewell, but I am not going to freak out if we take Pitts or Chase.  

(04-11-2021, 12:01 PM)bfine32 Wrote: When you're 6'4" 215 you create your own separation. Tee is an outside threat (contrary to what Mora Jr said) and has always has been a huge YPC receiver. I don't need next Gen to tell me why it "doesn't count". I'm not drafting anyone to replace AJ prime; we've got that in Higgins. I'm looking for a Z that can replace/improve on the 47 catches, 500 yards AJ gave us last year. That can easily be found later in the draft.

What's this fascination with "separation"?  You want that, draft Devonta Smith. 

(04-11-2021, 11:27 AM)PDub80 Wrote: You disagree? Based on what? I showed you what I based my conclusions off of. What are you basing yours on?

(04-11-2021, 01:05 PM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: Agree with both takes. Any one if the three are going to upgrade the offense. It's really a win,win,win IMO.

(04-11-2021, 03:24 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Only on the Bengals boards will you see people hyping up late round scrubs like Armon Binns and Cody Core, then trash a guy who just had one of the best rookie seasons in team history. All so they can justify taking another WR a year after the star QB got his knee shredded due to bad blocking.

Only on Bengals boards will people rip the starting QB for needing to be "surrounded by weapons", then when we get an elite QB (potentially), they want him to be surrounded by weapons.

Only on Bengals boards will people swear by PFF, then ignore that our top WR graded out as (IIRC) the 2nd or 3rd best player on the entire team.

(04-11-2021, 04:10 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Yup

Many of those posters think you WR corps needs to be Jerry Rice, Randy Moss, and Terrell Owens. Your RB's Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, and Earl Campbell. Your TE's Rob Gronkowski, Tony Gonzalez, and Antonio Gates. Then all your problems are solved.

To much play station. You know that world where you can trade your 3rd string guard for Randy Moss.

(04-11-2021, 03:47 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Anyone else starting to feel like Red at this point wrt who we take at 5?



Man, this board can really wear you down.

(04-11-2021, 03:24 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Only on the Bengals boards will you see people hyping up late round scrubs like Armon Binns and Cody Core, then trash a guy who just had one of the best rookie seasons in team history. All so they can justify taking another WR a year after the star QB got his knee shredded due to bad blocking.

Only on Bengals boards will people rip the starting QB for needing to be "surrounded by weapons", then when we get an elite QB (potentially), they want him to be surrounded by weapons.

Only on Bengals boards will people swear by PFF, then ignore that our top WR graded out as (IIRC) the 2nd or 3rd best player on the entire team.

(04-11-2021, 04:23 PM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: Debating is all you can do here. Some people are better at debating than others and they can get rather deflating and tiresome.

In the end I think as long as they take a player we all expect them to take, only a few posters will get upset if it’s not Sewell.

(04-11-2021, 04:22 PM)blt4584 Wrote: I mean, it's also a Playstaion move to take a LT in Jonah Williams or Sewell and just move them around the line and expect it to just work out.

I think Sewell would be a good pick, but I also think Williams played well and will be a good LT. The problem with the line from what I could see was the interior. Taking a guy who is considered by some to be a generational talent at LT and hope that it fixes the OG would kinda be the most Bengal way to solve a problem possible. 

To really fix the line the best way might to be trade down and try to get enough to pick a guy who looks to be more of a true OG in Vera-Tucker and get enough assets to try to trade back up for Marshall, but I don't think the Bengals will be quite that active.

(04-11-2021, 04:51 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: The problem with the line is depth. One injury at Tackle and then Fred Johnson or Akeem Andeniji is all they have to fill in. Lack of depth is what led to Jordan playing guard.

(04-11-2021, 03:24 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Only on the Bengals boards will you see people hyping up late round scrubs like Armon Binns and Cody Core, then trash a guy who just had one of the best rookie seasons in team history. All so they can justify taking another WR a year after the star QB got his knee shredded due to bad blocking.

Only on Bengals boards will people rip the starting QB for needing to be "surrounded by weapons", then when we get an elite QB (potentially), they want him to be surrounded by weapons.

Only on Bengals boards will people swear by PFF, then ignore that our top WR graded out as (IIRC) the 2nd or 3rd best player on the entire team.

(04-10-2021, 07:24 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: 1. What I said holds true. I guarantee that if you looked at each individual snap, it isn't going to be super consistent. There's going to be plenty of deviations. Plenty more blown up plays with the bad o-lines. Plenty more big plays for the team with good blocking. Are you really going to argue against this? It's common sense, brother.

2. Tom Brady is an exception, as he has always run a timing based offense predicated on short throws. He doesn't represent the average NFL offense. Also, guys can be schemed open. You bring up Ben Roethlisburger. Well how many times have we seen his guys WIDE open through the years? Not via speed, but some guy just somehow got lost in coverage.

Juju isn't a speed guy. He ran a 4.5 and a 4.54 leading up to the draft. Johnson ran a 4.53. So basically you're arguing against yourself. The Steelers are getting separation with a pair of 4.5 guys and little time to throw. That just proves what I said about scheme is on point.

3. Adding talent is never a bad thing, and Reiff himself has played multiple positions and has said he'd be fine with moving. If he felt he'd struggle, why would he offer? You think he wants to tank his next contract after 1 year at an awkward position? You've got to be the first person I've seen argue that adding Sewell could somehow make us worse. Amazing.

4. It's just true regardless. I don't know what to tell ya. Having the ability to scan for open receivers is ALWAYS going to lead to the QB hitting open receivers more frequently. You're over-thinking a very simple truth. We don't have turtles playing WR. They are going to be open sometimes. If Burrow doesn't have time, he'll find that open guy less often.


We really don't want to lock ourselves into only looking at one position in the 2nd though...and when you look at WR depth overall in this draft, most sites have it as being deeper than o-line.

Many sites still have Marshall going in the 2nd.