(05-27-2023, 08:49 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Another amateur response.

Not sure why you let this situation get in your feelings, the request was likely expected and not at all unreasonable.

Jonah has done nothing wrong, he had his agent respectfully request a trade because he thinks that is best for himself and his family.  Personally, I think fans that slam a guy for that request comes across as  kinda selfish.

I would love for Jonah to have attended OTAs, but it wasn't required.  If Jonah comes out with disrespectful language or threatens a hold out then I have no issues with people going negative, but this projection is so petty.  Multiple trade requests are made on every team, every year, we just dont see them.

(05-30-2023, 03:07 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nah, it isn't like switching careers completely. Maybe if the electrician had been a plumber before that thought would make sense.

Jonah HAS played RT before. His agent was the one that put out the tweet, I don't blame him or Jonah for pursuing better opportunities as 
he just got replaced at LT. But now it is time for Jonah to get to work as Carman is taking the starting RT snaps right now and Taylor the HC 
has said many times that Carman will get every opportunity to win the RT job. So will Jonah but him being injured all the time and getting
pushed around lately gives me pause about Jonah winning the RT job.

(05-30-2023, 09:02 PM)PDub80 Wrote: To clarify, he has every right to request a trade.

He is arrogant and delusional for thinking he deserves to still be the LT after his mediocre at best first 4 seasons at the spot and that he was beyond being replaced. He did make comments in an interview that he was "blindsided" by the signing of Brown Jr. How could he be surprised given that he just lead the entire league in sacks given up - shocking given that he once again missed games due to injury. Thus, to me, he's delusional or at least jaded in his performance/career so far.

Happy players/selfless players aren't making a trade request because of a position switch.

That's why I said he has every right to ask to be moved... but doing so instead of moving to a position he would probably  be better at is arrogant. Especially given that his teammates and culture of the locker room seems to have guys willing to do simmilar things to support and help the team.

I understand people supporting Jonah and his right as a man to pursue his goals. I support that, too. His goal of being the starting LT if the Bengals didn't pan out. I just think this is a selfish, jaded look on his part. He also has every right to be those last 2 things, too. That doesn't mean I agree with his choices.

(05-31-2023, 08:03 AM)bengaloo Wrote: Behind the scenes Jonah might be arrogant. Who really knows but he does seem ignorant. 

(05-31-2023, 11:29 AM)casear2727 Wrote: What is wrong with you guys?  Let me try to simplify how awful you guys sound:

The man has played LT for the last 7 years and this is his contract season.  The most important season of his entire career up until now.

The man has a family to think about and changing positions may not be the best career move in his mind.

The man has not said ONE word that has been negative toward the organization or stupid fans.

I do not see how any sane adult can call the man arrogant for asking for a trade that he thinks might be in the best interest of his family, that was likely expected and has done so in a respectful manner.

I am embarrassed for fans of our team that project bullsh!t like this and other disparaging remarks with zero reasoning.  It is not difficult to try to see things from his side.

Every single person doing this comes across as uninformed and I will remind them of these comments if Jonah plays for us this season and does well.  

If Jonah eventually makes negative comments or sits out, then fans would have reason to complain.  Otherwise let the man do what he thinks is best for his family while not disrespecting or hurting the team.

(05-31-2023, 01:05 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Brown, Carman, plus a healthy Jonah & Collins will be the best our OT room has looked in a LONG time.

IOL depth still scares me some. As does TE depth. I have faith in Lou making the new DBs fit in nicely, and I like the rookies, a lot.

Championship or bust, people.

(05-30-2023, 11:05 PM)samhain Wrote: Accurate as usual.  

Lots of people can view themselves as something they're not.  Cam Newton thinks he's better than half the starting qbs in the NFL.  Owners and coaches do not seem to agree, therefore he's at home with his thoughts instead of under center in OTAs.  Jonah can think he's whatever.  The coaches and ownership saw fit to upgrade him at LT, so he's not an LT so long as he's here and OBJ is healthy.  

I keep hearing about doing the best thing for his family and future or some crap, which is also silly.  The best thing for his future is for him to play well a RT and get a contract with another team next year.  He might identify as a LT, but he flat out is not in his current situation.  That's how the chips fell.  If he was dominant, then the team would have held his place rather than upgrading it with an outside free agent.

Suck it up, collect your paltry 12 mil, and try earn a big contract next year.  Or don't and watch Carman and Collins happily take the RT spot on a Super Bowl contender that you're too left-tackley to accept.

(05-31-2023, 08:03 AM)bengaloo Wrote: Behind the scenes Jonah might be arrogant. Who really knows but he does seem ignorant. Sadly for him he doesnt seem to have very good core strength and gets pushed around a lot. I think he is hard pressed to find a team willing to treat him like an above average LT. He should be headed into his best years, but instead seems to be exposed and regressing. I know he isnt terrible and he does certain things well, but I dont see a man strong enough in his core to handle being the LT of a super bowl contender NFL team. He definitely aint no glass eater.

(05-31-2023, 01:05 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Brown, Carman, plus a healthy Jonah & Collins will be the best our OT room has looked in a LONG time.

IOL depth still scares me some. As does TE depth. I have faith in Lou making the new DBs fit in nicely, and I like the rookies, a lot.

Championship or bust, people.

(05-31-2023, 01:34 PM)Memphis_Bengal Wrote: Definitely...which puts a lot of importance on G Jaxson Kirkland even though he's an UDFA. Could be huge for us If he develops and gives us legit IOL depth because we know there will be injuries. 

(05-30-2023, 10:54 PM)samhain Wrote: So basically you're speculating (with zero actual knowledge of the situation) that Jonah's agent just went rogue after the Brown signing, hopped onto social media without even contacting poor Jonah, and demanded a trade on his behalf.  That seems like something that a person who does that for a living would do.  Jonah can fire and hire any agent he wants, so an agent doing something he didn't ask him to do would probably put his job at risk.  

Agents do not act of their own volition.  I know you're the professional here, at something, anyway (or so you seem to claim), so I'd guess you'd know something that rudimentary to how NFL player/agent relationships work.

You make my point for me if what you say in the last sentence is valid.  "Multiple trade requests are made on every team, every year, we just don't see them."  I think this is probably bullshit, but if true, then Jonah's case is even more exceptionally arrogant and stupid.  He was one of the few that actually threw a public fit for all to see while all these other players you allege are doing the same thing manage to control their emotions and keep quiet.  Or his agent did without his knowledge, as you allege.  

Stop acting like a make believe insider.  We have enough of those here already.  You're worse than an amateur.  You just make shit up and pass it off as known fact.  That's called lying in most places, but I suppose it's professionalism where you come from.  

(05-31-2023, 01:05 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Brown, Carman, plus a healthy Jonah & Collins will be the best our OT room has looked in a LONG time.

IOL depth still scares me some. As does TE depth. I have faith in Lou making the new DBs fit in nicely, and I like the rookies, a lot.

Championship or bust, people.

(05-31-2023, 05:51 PM)casear2727 Wrote: I see my initial response to this garbage was deleted.  

I never insinuated that Jonah's agent went rogue, how can you even come to that conclusion?

I absolutely never said his agent did anything with his knowledge.  You are either lying or ignorant.

I don't profess to be an insider, but I was in the business for many years, rented to players, my son is friends with many players, so I get tidbits from time to time.

Your bashing of Jonah is without merit and childish.  Bash me all you want but at least try to do so honestly.

(05-31-2023, 05:59 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I mentioned in another thread: What's the difference between what Jonah has done and what Andy did? They both wanted out after we obtained their replacement. Seems folks were a lot more behind Andy than they are Jonah.

(05-31-2023, 07:52 PM)samhain Wrote: Tell me you think you're an insider without wanting the baggage that comes with lying about being and insider.  Got news for you, you're not.  

You've been putting distance between Jonah's wanting a trade and pinning it on the agent ever since we first discussed this.  The shortest distance between two points is a straight line, and the straight line, respectfully, not respectfully, whatever, is that Jonah Williams told the organization he'd rather not be here in 2023.  You've denied that this is an indication that he's dissatisfied, then you've backtracked.  There's zero reason to even mention the agent.  Jonah made a big boy decision, the agent carried it out.

Meanwhile, you're sitting here telling us to pity a man that's going to make 12 million, ie enough to be set for his entire life, in one season to do a job he's too good for.  I'm not in the business of feeling sorry for millionaires.  It's a business, it always was, and Jonah failed to read the room when he pulled this stunt.  

Act like this didn't happen all you want, and pretend you have sleepovers with Zac and Burrow if it makes you feel better.  It's pretty entertaining.  

(05-31-2023, 08:15 PM)samhain Wrote: Andy's official  exit was just a matter of formality when the Bengals secured the number 1 pick. Signing Brown did not necessarily spell the end for Jonah, at least not for 2023.  He's very likely still the second best tackle on this team.  Bringing in a new LT did not put Jonah on the street or even the bench. 

Fans were as ready fro Andy to play elsewhere as Andy was to go.

(05-31-2023, 01:31 AM)casear2727 Wrote: "He is arrogant and delusional for thinking he deserves to still be the LT", why are you projecting so much?  You have no idea what Jonah thinks.  This is what makes our fans look so ignorant.  Jonah has not said anything negative.

- Demanding a trade and skipping all offseason work after the team signs a better player at your position and asks you to switch sides - to a side he has played before in college, BTW - isn't a negative statement to you? Are you serious with that?

No one has any actual idea of what anyone thinks. That's how people get away with lying. You seem to need Jonah Williams to spoon feed you black and white comments about why he asked for a trade - even then, that could be a lie because you will never actually know what he is thinking. It's fine to be obtuse about it, but not everyone needs their hand held to draw an A to B to C conclusion.

As I stated, PLAYERS DO NOT ASK FOR A TRADE DUE TO POSITIVE FEELINGS ABOUT THE TEAM. The trade request was his statement. He doesn't need to say anything more. He wants to quit the Bengals because... Wah wah wah ... they signed a better player at his spot and he doesn't want to switch.

As I clearly said previously - HE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO DO SO. But that doesn't mean he is right to do so.

"How could he be surprised", you didnt just start watching the Bengals, they never do this, we were all blindsided, not one person thought this would happen.

- They never do what? Cut, sign, or trade for better players? Yes. They absolutely do. This coaching staff has said as much and done as much every year they've been here. Jonah has all 4 of his years with ZT. This shouldn't be a surprise to him. They benched AD on his B day. They traded Dunlap. They do whatever it takes to get better. Jonah is not from the Marvin era. He knows ZT is always looking for better talent... as he should be.

His "blindsided" comment about the Bengals siging OBjr leads me into....

"he's delusional or at least jaded in his performance/career so far", he was our best olinemen the year before last.  Again saying he is delusional without any knowledge of him personally is just so pretentious. 

- "He was the best O lineman in 2021" is like saying your kid is the smartest one on the short bus. He was an avg starter on one of the worst O lines in the league in 2021, which made him look good. Teams took advantage of abusing the weaker O linemen in 2021 - of which NONE of them started in 2022 but Jonah. Those guys were THAT bad. How did Jonah look with competent players around him in 2022? HE GAVE UP THE MOST SACKS IN THE LEAGUE.

I don't have to know him personally to know that his asking for a trade means that he was DELUSIONAL towards his 2022 performance - and general career in the league thus far. He clearly sees himself as better than what he is because he was caught off guard that the Bengals could find a better option at his position. It's a performance based business. His performance was: MOST SACKS GIVEN UP IN THE ENTIRE LEAGUE. His not knowing that if a better player was available that the Bengals could take action is... delusional about his own performance.

"Happy players/selfless players aren't making a trade request because of a position switch." Lol, players on every team do this every year, you just dont hear about them.   Geez, how can you NOT know this?

- I should get you a subscription to Hooked On Phonics. I didn't say players don't ask for trades every year. I said HAPPY/SELFLESS PLAYERS DON'T ASK FOR TRADES. Do you think Jonah Williams asked for a trade because he is HAPPY? Because he has POSITIVE FEELINIGS about the Bengals? Because he's a TEAM FIRST player? Because he is SELFLESS?

Of course not. He asked for a trade because Jonah WIlliams is about Jonah Williams. It's why he refused the switch to RT - a position he is better suited for in the NFL. It's why he refused to switch to C at Alabama when asked. Jonah Williams wants to be the LT because that's the most prestigious OLine spot and it makes the most money. Not because that's his best spot given the current roster of Olinemen on the team.

BTW, I'm not ignoring the fact that OBjr ALSO said he would only sign if he was going to play LT. The difference is that he is considerably BETTER at it than Jonah Williams. If the Bengals all of a sudden trade for Trent Williams I would say the same exact thing to OBjr: Go enjoy the right side of the line. Poor ol' Jonah Williams would have to set up shop at LG for a year.

"but doing so instead of moving to a position he would probably be better at is arrogant",  this is just getting stupid.  He never said he wouldn't play RT, asking for the trade is not arrogant, I cant believe how mid you are with this, very surprising.

- What does it mean when he told the Bengals to trade him after finding out he wasn't going to be the LT and had to move to RT? THAT IS TELLING THEM HE DOESN'T WANT TO DO IT. They signed a better player at LT than he is. He gave up the most sacks in the entire league in 2022. For Jonah to think he's safe and sound at his job and then demand a trade as if he's something special is arrogant. He stunk in 2022. Now, will he actually play RT if he has to to earn $12million? OF COURSE! But that doesn't mean he hasn't been arrogant in asking for a trade.

He didn't show up to OTAs, either. If he was all in on learning a new spot and competing, wouldn't he do so? I think it's fair to think that YES, HE WOULD if that were the case. Did he? NO, HE DIDN'T. How are these simple A to B to C cause and effect inferences hard for you to accept?

"I understand people supporting Jonah and his right as a man to pursue his goals." - "I just think this is a selfish, jaded look on his part."  Wow, what hypocritical statements.

- Again, reading comprehension issues on your end. How is my statement hypocritical? Just because he has the right to do something, doesn't mean it's right to do it.

"He has every right to pursue his goals. His goals are SELFISH."

^ Not a hypocritical statement. It's a factual statement based on Jonah asking for a trade when the best thing for the team is to go be the RT and still make his $12million. He is more concerned about what he wants to do for himself and the money he can make at LT on his next contract. Again, all SELFISH ideals & a terrible look on a team full of guys who are very very team first. But, he does have every right to do so.

This entire post reflects way too many of our ignorant fans whose feelings were hurt because Jonah requested a trade.

- The irony of you calling people ignorant amuses me.

For those of you saying Jonah is refusing to play RT, you are lying.  He never said that.

- Again - and, please feel free to answer - Do you think Joanh Williams immediately asked to be traded when told he was going to be the RT because he was agreeing to play RT?

Perhaps you think Jonah Williams wants traded to a different team so that he can play RT for them instead of the Bengals?

Those of you saying he is selfish for requesting a trade, I hope Jonah reprimands you on social media the next time you have to make a financial decision for your family.  Hint; he won't, because it would be stupid.

- A social media reprimand from Jonah Williams?!?! Ohhhhh nooooooo! Buddy, I'm not some lemming that follows athletes or tries to chat with them on social media. I couldn't care less about that.

To those of you that think Jonah is arrogant for wanting to play the postion he has played for the last 7 years in a contract season... you simply do not understand the NFL and shouldn't be commenting.

- This isn't pee wee football. "But little Johnny has been the best LT on the PeeWee team for 4 years. What do you mean a bigger, better kid just moved into the district?! No way Johnny is playing RT. We're moving to another district so little Johnny can have what he wants. Whaaaaaa   ".

No high level sport organization works like that. Sure, parents and players who underperform WANT it to, but this happens all the time in sports. The NFL is a performance based business. Jonah's performance after 4 years in the NFL isn't and hasn't been good enough. Period. The Bengals found a better guy and he has to change spots. This happens at literally EVERY competitive level of sport from select soccer to AAU basketball, to select baseball, and elite football, high school, & college. Jonah Williams got his dose of reality late in his career instead of having to perform, fight it out, and grow through adversity at a younger age. Now, we get to see who he really is.... A "trade me" quitter.

(05-31-2023, 05:59 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I mentioned in another thread: What's the difference between what Jonah has done and what Andy did? They both wanted out after we obtained their replacement. Seems folks were a lot more behind Andy than they are Jonah.

(06-01-2023, 10:01 AM)PDub80 Wrote: I responded to you in the same manner as you did me. You set that tone, not I.