+- Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise (https://thebengalsboard.com)
+-- Forum: Cincinnati Bengals / NFL (https://thebengalsboard.com/forum-3.html)
+--- Forum: JUNGLE NOISE (https://thebengalsboard.com/forum-2.html)
+--- Thread: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! (/thread-36402.html)
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Nately120 - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 10:14 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Lamar is 7-2 vs the Bengals too.
It seems like every year at least one backup QB beats him for us, too.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Soonerpeace - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 09:54 AM)Sled21 Wrote: You mean like Sean Peyton, who everyone was clamoring to bring here???
I so laugh at those that clamored for him. Geez win an AFC title since forever ago and make it back again and barely lose. Beat the best NFL team 3-4. Lose the opener and barely the second game to a good Ravens team and now Taylor is Shula.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - THE PISTONS - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 11:15 AM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I so laugh at those that clamored for him. Geez win an AFC title since forever ago and make it back again and barely lose. Beat the best NFL team 3-4. Lose the opener and barely the second game to a good Ravens team and now Taylor is Shula.
I don't think anyone is saying Taylor is trash. I think they're saying he's a bad playcaller/OC. I think that, generally he's regarded as atleast an above average+ Head Coach.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - bfine32 - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 08:28 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Because it's hard to give those accomplishments to Zac when he won 6 games in two years before he got Burrow/Chase/Higgins to carry him. Plus he's always been an "offensive focused" coach and the offense has never looked close to what it could potentially be with legit a top 2-3 QB and best weapons in the league. It's hard to not look at Taylor when he has a better roster than the Chiefs and hasn't been as successful.
It is terrible that Zac didn't go to the Superbowl his first two years as an HC, while he was completely turning over the roster and building a new culture. The dude is such a bad HC that it took him until year 3 to get to the Superbowl.
Two things can be true>
1. At this point in their HC careers Andy Reid is a better HC than Zac Taylor
2. Zac Taylor is a successful you HC how has built the only team to compete with the current NFL dynasty
Just like these 2 things can be true:
1. At this point in their NFL Careers Pat Mahomes is a better and more durable QB than Joe Burrow
2. Joe Burrow is an elite, young NFL QB
Remember when Joe Burrow was asked how long is the Super Bowl window and his answer was 'The window is my whole career"?
Many around here think the window is 2 games into one season.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Brownshoe - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 11:21 AM)bfine32 Wrote: It is terrible that Zac didn't go to the Superbowl his first two years as an HC, while he was completely turning over the roster and building a new culture. The dude is such a bad HC that it took him until year 3 to get to the Superbowl.
Two things can be true>
1. At this point in their HC careers Andy Reid is a better HC than Zac Taylor
2. Zac Taylor is a successful you HC how has built the only team to compete with the current NFL dynasty
Just like these 2 things can be true:
1. At this point in their NFL Careers Pat Mahomes is a better and more durable QB than Joe Burrow
2. Joe Burrow is an elite, young NFL QB
Remember when Joe Burrow was asked how long is the Super Bowl window and his answer was 'The window is my whole career"?
Many around here think the window is 2 games into one season.
Taylor took Marvin's roster and did worse than what Marvin was doing. Taylor is getting carried by Burrow and Co. If Taylor didn't have a QB that was considered the consensus #2 QB in the league with the best receiving units in the league he would be a 2-4 win coach, like he shown that he is.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Soonerpeace - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 12:10 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Taylor took Marvin's roster and did worse than what Marvin was doing. Taylor is getting carried by Burrow and Co. If Taylor didn't have a QB that was considered the consensus #2 QB in the league with the best receiving units in the league he would be a 2-4 win coach, like he shown that he is.
We really trying to say Marvin was better? Oh my! What a cess pool. This fan base really is fractured even after a coach brings them the best success in a quarter century
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Wyche'sWarrior - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 12:56 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: We really trying to say Marvin was better? Oh my! What a cess pool. This fan base really is fractured even after a coach brings them the best success in a quarter century
It's nothing new....the way they treat Zac now, is the way they treated Andy Dalton. Now the script is flipped, and everyone loves the QB, so someone has to be the scapegoat. Zac it is.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - WeezyBengal - 09-25-2023
I posted this in another thread but thought it could belong here as well. Contracry to what many of you think, the Bengals actually do have some good play calls/design at times.
Traditional motion is a man/zone tell.
The Bengals used motion last week at times the way that Miami does. They actually had some good play designs at times, but no one wants to give them credit.
The first one below is a play that they reversed what they did against Cleveland in week 1 (gave the ball to Chase). Instead they faked to chase and went to Mixon for a chunk play. They were banking on the Ravens watching the week 1 tape, saw Chase in the backfield, and counted on the ball going to him.
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8">Love this design to get Mixon wide ass open in the flat. Ja'Marr Chase draws all the attention while Mixon slips behind them. pic.twitter.com/RngjEqmdmJ
— mike (@bengals_sans) September 18, 2023
This is another play where they use Irv in pre snap motion. First to tell man/zone, then use him in full sprint motion up until the ball is snapped to give him a head start and advantage against his defender to pick up the first:
Bengals make things easy in short yardage. Shift Smith left to right to see man then shift him back and jet motion him to out leverage his defender. pic.twitter.com/46uyoXeXDm
— mike (@bengals_sans) September 18, 2023
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Wyche'sWarrior - 09-25-2023
Good stuff Weezy. I'd rep that post but it's not giving me the option to even quote it for some reason. Anyway, as is usually the case, the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Is Zac Taylor the second coming of Bill Walsh? No. Is he Richie Kotite reincarnated? Again, no. He's a good HC, and alright playcaller that has improved each year. No one wants to admit it, but with Joe's freedom in calling plays himself, comes growing pains each year because he has missed a lot of time practicing and scrimmaging. My one gripe with Zac is abandoning the run too soon at times. Then again, who's to say Joe isn't the one calling a lot of the pass plays and/or checking out of them.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - ochocincos - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 11:19 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I don't think anyone is saying Taylor is trash. I think they're saying he's a bad playcaller/OC. I think that, generally he's regarded as atleast an above average+ Head Coach.
This is the conundrum.
2021:
Points For - 7th in league
Total yards - 13th in league
Net passing yards per attempt - 3rd in league
Rushing yards per attempt - 26th in league
2022:
Points For - 7th in league
Total Yards - 8th in league
Net passing yards per attempt - 8th in league
Rushing yards per attempt - 29th in league
2023:
Points For - last in league
Total Yards - last in league
Net passing yards per attempt - last in league
Rushing yards per attempt - 18th in league
So when looking back to 2021-2022, the passing game was really good, but the running game was trash (in terms of efficiency).
With a hobbled Burrow through 2 games, the passing game is now trash in 2023.
If Burrow can get back to form and this run game can be around middle of the pack, this could be a Top 5 offense.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 02:29 PM)Wyche Wrote: Good stuff Weezy. I'd rep that post but it's not giving me the option to even quote it for some reason. Anyway, as is usually the case, the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Is Zac Taylor the second coming of Bill Walsh? No. Is he Richie Kotite reincarnated? Again, no. He's a good HC, and alright playcaller that has improved each year. No one wants to admit it, but with Joe's freedom in calling plays himself, comes growing pains each year because he has missed a lot of time practicing and scrimmaging. My one gripe with Zac is abandoning the run too soon at times. Then again, who's to say Joe isn't the one calling a lot of the pass plays and/or checking out of them.
Well said Wyche and yeah that film Weezy provided shows some beautiful motion that I hope to see a lot more of.
Zac is still learning and that is what is nice about having a young HC instead of an old dog.
I also think it is Burrow who checks to the pass a lot so cannot put all the blame on Zac here either.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - WeezyBengal - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 02:37 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Well said Wyche and yeah that film Weezy provided shows some beautiful motion that I hope to see a lot more of.
Zac is still learning and that is what is nice about having a young HC instead of an old dog.
I also think it is Burrow who checks to the pass a lot so cannot put all the blame on Zac here either.
I'd agree with this. It's hard to tell when it comes to run/pass what the original call was and what the check is. A lot of that is on Burrow.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - THE PISTONS - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 02:37 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Well said Wyche and yeah that film Weezy provided shows some beautiful motion that I hope to see a lot more of.
Zac is still learning and that is what is nice about having a young HC instead of an old dog.
I also think it is Burrow who checks to the pass a lot so cannot put all the blame on Zac here either.
I think that Katie really designed those plays!
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 02:38 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I'd agree with this. It's hard to tell when it comes to run/pass what the original call was and what the check is. A lot of that is on Burrow.
It is, Burrow loves his empty sets out of the shotgun and naturally is a pass first QB...
(09-25-2023, 02:39 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I think that Katie really designed those plays!
Have to give all the cred to Katie lol
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Brownshoe - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 12:56 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: We really trying to say Marvin was better? Oh my! What a cess pool. This fan base really is fractured even after a coach brings them the best success in a quarter century
Zac had Burrow, AJ Green, Higgins, Boyd and Mixon in 2020 and couldn't win more than 4 games. Marvin Lewis with backup QBs never lost as many games as Zacs first two years.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Soonerpeace - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 05:09 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Zac had Burrow, AJ Green, Higgins, Boyd and Mixon in 2020 and couldn't win more than 4 games. Marvin Lewis with backup QBs never lost as many games as Zacs first two years.Tee came with Joe the 33rd pick. . Give me a break. Burrow got hurt. Cincy doesn’t have more talent than KC and are 3-1 vs them. Give it up big boy go to another thread.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Brownshoe - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 05:26 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Tee came with Joe the 33rd pick. . Give me a break. Burrow got hurt. Cincy doesn’t have more talent than KC and are 3-1 vs them. Give it up big boy go to another thread.
Lol what are you talking about "Cincy doesn't have more talent than KC"? Our offensive weapons are miles ahead. Our defense isn't a bunch of 2nd year players. We're better in almost every aspect. They just have a better coach and that's the biggest difference. In what area is KC more talented than us?
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Soonerpeace - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 05:40 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Lol what are you talking about "Cincy doesn't have more talent than KC"? Our offensive weapons are miles ahead. Our defense isn't a bunch of 2nd year players. We're better in almost every aspect. They just have a better coach and that's the biggest difference. In what area is KC more talented than us?
OL by leaps and bounds and DL. Ever heard of Chris Jones lol? Creed Humphrey? KC 6 all pros last year Cincy 0. Give up! Yet Zac is 3-1 vs Andy Reid
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Destro - 09-25-2023
Could Burrow, Chase, Higgins and Boyd do as well somewhere else than the offensive coaching staff would do somewhere else? Spin the wheel and see what kind of results we could assume.
RE: Zac Taylor play calling is trash! - Brownshoe - 09-25-2023
(09-25-2023, 06:01 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: OL by leaps and bounds and DL. Ever heard of Chris Jones lol? Creed Humphrey? KC 6 all pros last year Cincy 0. Give up! Yet Zac is 3-1 vs Andy Reid
We have better DBs and LBs than KC. Our DL isn't that much worse than KC. Our OL is just as good this year. Our receiving core is one of the best and theirs is one of the worst. Mixon is a better back than anyone on their team.
So almost everything we have is better than or equal to KC. Their DL is the only thing that I would rank as better, and it's not even that much better.