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+--- Thread: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake (/thread-14322.html)
Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - wolfkaosaun - 01-03-2018
Many people view him as a much bigger upgrade to that of Ken Zampese. And while in 2017 they actually scored TDs under Lazor rather than Zampese, Lazor still isn't a good coach.
These stats are from Josh Kirkendall, using numbers and references from Pro Football Reference
![[Image: DSpX7rzWAAEQFZf.jpg:large]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DSpX7rzWAAEQFZf.jpg:large)
And here are the rushing yards and where they rank in the Bengals 50 year franchise
![[Image: DSpjKyQVMAA0GIo.jpg:large]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DSpjKyQVMAA0GIo.jpg:large)
Under Bill Lazor, the offense didn't score a TD in the second half in 5 games.
They ranked 31st in the NFL in points in the second half with only 7.
Sure. There were positives in the run game and in the final two games. But let's not forget how terrible they were against the Bears and Vikings two weeks prior. Or how they couldn't score more than 3 points against Pittsburgh in the 2nd half.
Bill Lazor is not a good coordinator. Even with other teams.
With the Dolphins in 2015, his offense ranked 28th in points in the 2nd half.
Resigning him is not a good move.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Trademark - 01-03-2018
Lazor will do just fine
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Bengalpool - 01-03-2018
Zampese also had Whit and Zeitler in 16 to help make himself look a little better, but regardless, Lazor was able to do SOMETHING with NOTHING... Unlike Zam... Lazor will have a full off-season to revamp.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 01-03-2018
Have to give him a pass coming in here without an Offseason and running a scheme that is not his and Marv
doing that to him in the 2nd halves of games. That is the deal, Marv needs to just let him do his damn job in
the 2nd half, cannot say this enough.
I will also add that i bet Lazor had a say in the change in blocking late in the year which resulted us in having
some semblance of a running game.
With a new O-line coach things will be much better i guarantee it. Not to mention an Offseason working with
the players running his own scheme.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Sweetness - 01-03-2018
I don't think any OC, QB, or RB would have a good year with that line. That said all of them can contribute to making it look better or worse. I would say the least amount of the responsibility would be on the RBs.
Let's also not forget Lazor didn't come into the season as the OC.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Benton - 01-03-2018
I was ok with giving him a shot... until Marvin seemed ok with giving him a shot. Now I think lazor must be an incompetent moron. Which sucks. He could be the best guy on the staff, but being endorsed by an idiot makes him questionable. And his ineffectiveness in the second half makes him waaaaay too much like Marvin for my liking.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - BoomerFan - 01-03-2018
When Jim Owczarski says that Zampese didn't have the locker room and that Lazor does, I'm persuaded by that. I'll add, Lazor was working without Whitworth, whom Zampese had. Give the guy an offensive line to work with then I'll judge Lazor.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Benton - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 07:58 PM)Sweetness Wrote: Let's also not forget Lazor didn't come into the season as the OC.
This is lazors second or third year with the team. I’d be ok with giving him more rope if he was with the team for his first season. But the guy knew the players and the scheme and the issues.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 08:03 PM)Benton Wrote: I was ok with giving him a shot... until Marvin seemed ok with giving him a shot. Now I think lazor must be an incompetent moron. Which sucks. He could be the best guy on the staff, but being endorsed by an idiot makes him questionable. And his ineffectiveness in the second half makes him waaaaay too much like Marvin for my liking.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - BengalYankee - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 07:56 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Have to give him a pass coming in here without an Offseason and running a scheme that is not his and Marv
doing that to him in the 2nd halves of games. That is the deal, Marv needs to just let him do his damn job in
the 2nd half, cannot say this enough.
I will also add that i bet Lazor had a say in the change in blocking late in the year which resulted us in having
some semblance of a running game.
With a new O-line coach things will be much better i guarantee it. Not to mention an Offseason working with
the players running his own scheme.
You got to be kidding me??
You blame Marv for the 2nd halves of games and not Lazor???
So, I assume you give Lazor the credit for the 1st half of games???
You also give Lazor the credit for the change in blocking late in the year??
Wow, just wow.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 08:07 PM)Benton Wrote: This is lazors second or third year with the team. I’d be ok with giving him more rope if he was with the team for his first season. But the guy knew the players and the scheme and the issues.
His first year he was the QB coach and this year he came in as OC 3 games into the season running Zampese's scheme.
Give the guy a chance at OC for a full year in his own scheme before judging the guy.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Essex Johnson - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 07:46 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: Many people view him as a much bigger upgrade to that of Ken Zampese. And while in 2017 they actually scored TDs under Lazor rather than Zampese, Lazor still isn't a good coach.
These stats are from Josh Kirkendall, using numbers and references from Pro Football Reference
And here are the rushing yards and where they rank in the Bengals 50 year franchise
Under Bill Lazor, the offense didn't score a TD in the second half in 5 games.
They ranked 31st in the NFL in points in the second half with only 7.
Sure. There were positives in the run game and in the final two games. But let's not forget how terrible they were against the Bears and Vikings two weeks prior. Or how they couldn't score more than 3 points against Pittsburgh in the 2nd half.
Bill Lazor is not a good coordinator. Even with other teams.
With the Dolphins in 2015, his offense ranked 28th in points in the 2nd half.
Resigning him is not a good move.
When we ran the ball under Lazor decent, we won.. Alexander just did not get it done on the Oline as a whole.. that was the biggest need for change now.. im ok with Lazor , Andy improved his play under him that is a good sign to me also
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Quantum Bengal - 01-03-2018
I'm ok giving Lazor a shot to incorporate his offense
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - McC - 01-03-2018
I look at it this way--when did we have our best defenses and our best offenses? When we had strong coordinators who were never gonna let Marvin tell them what to do.
Why were those units good? Because you never knew what was coming at you next.
Who were their replacements? Two guys grateful for the promotion. And then another one of those.
You can tell when Marvin left Paulie alone--that's when he got creative.
Think about the second half blues. Jay struggled with it, so did Hue, Zampese was just plain awful and then it ends up being Lazor's Achilles heel too. Coincidence of that magnitude is only seen on bad tv shows.
When Giggles says full control, he means it. He is gonna micromanage his team into oblivion.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Stonyhands - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 07:55 PM)Takedown Wrote: Zampese also had Whit and Zeitler in 16 to help make himself look a little better, but regardless, Lazor was able to do SOMETHING with NOTHING... Unlike Zam... Lazor will have a full off-season to revamp.
This x1000.
Do people not remember how many quarters it took for us to score a TD with Zampese as OC?
Plus how telling is it that Mike Brown of all people fires a coach that early in the football season...Mike Freaking Brown. I say give Lazor a chance. Marvin seems onboard with it, so utimately his decision will either earn him another extension or finally stamp his ticket out of Cincinnati.
But seriously thank God Alexander and Guenther are gone...talk about addition by subtraction.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 08:24 PM)McC Wrote: I look at it this way--when did we have our best defenses and our best offenses? When we had strong coordinators who were never gonna let Marvin tell them what to do.
Why were those units good? Because you never knew what was coming at you next.
Who were their replacements? Two guys grateful for the promotion. And then another one of those.
You can tell when Marvin left Paulie alone--that's when he got creative.
Think about the second half blues. Jay struggled with it, so did Hue, Zampese was just plain awful and then it ends up being Lazor's Achilles heel too. Coincidence of that magnitude is only seen on bad tv shows.
When Giggles says full control, he means it. He is gonna micromanage his team into oblivion.
Sadly you have history on your side and Marv seems too stubborn to ever change.
Just hoping the new O-line coach can coach up these guys so our running game can carry Marv's ineptness.
If he wasn't so stubborn he would know he is as big of the problem as anyone when he does these things.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - bengalsturntup926 - 01-03-2018
Do I think lazor is the best choice out there no. But I don't think he's bad ,and from the eye test he didn't do bad . Andy doesn't need a 4th oc so soon either. So I'm fine with lazor again and try to get a even better DC .
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - McC - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 08:42 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Sadly you have history on your side and Marv seems too stubborn to ever change.
Just hoping the new O-line coach can coach up these guys so our running game can carry Marv's ineptness.
If he wasn't so stubborn he would know he is as big of the problem as anyone when he does these things.
I see that as our best chance, if we can be the baddest running team in the league. That way, when he goes into offensive and defensive prevent at halftime, we can run it down people's throats and still be able to score.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - kevin - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 07:55 PM)Takedown Wrote: Zampese also had Whit and Zeitler in 16 to help make himself look a little better, but regardless, Lazor was able to do SOMETHING with NOTHING... Unlike Zam... Lazor will have a full off-season to revamp.
RE: Keeping Bill Lazor Is A Mistake - bengalfan74 - 01-03-2018
(01-03-2018, 07:56 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Have to give him a pass coming in here without an Offseason and running a scheme that is not his and Marv
doing that to him in the 2nd halves of games. That is the deal, Marv needs to just let him do his damn job in
the 2nd half, cannot say this enough.
I will also add that i bet Lazor had a say in the change in blocking late in the year which resulted us in having
some semblance of a running game.
With a new O-line coach things will be much better i guarantee it. Not to mention an Offseason working with
the players running his own scheme.
Agree,
I'm on the fence about Lazor considering the dumpster fire he came into.
I've been convinced for a long time one Paul Alexander has been instrumental in the failure of this team. I believe Mike Brown enabled him, put him in a position to run his own program within the team.
Allowed him to pick players and Paul's ego was to big to admit
I'm in no way taking up for Lewis ! But I think PA was a giant part of the problem here to. Will it make the difference in the end ?
We'll see