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Running Backs - TheLeonardLeap - 12-04-2019
After Three Years In Each.....
Running Back A:
598 carries, 2437 rushing yards (4.1 AVG), 14 TD
99 catches, 773 receiving yards (7.8 AVG), 4 TD
Seasons of 3.5, 4.9, and 3.5 YPC.
0 rushing TDs of 20+ yards.
Running Back B:
667 carries, 2757 rushing yards (4.1 AVG), 29 TD
63 catches, 467 receiving yards (7.4 AVG), 1 TD
Seasons of 5.1, 3.6, and 3.8 YPC.
4 rushing TDs of 20+ yards.
Running Back C:
492 carries, 2105 rushing yards (4.3 AVG), 12 TD
148 catches, 1335 receiving yards (9.0 AVG), 5 TD
Seasons of 4.1, 4.0, and 4.7 YPC.
2 rushing TD of 20+ yards.
- - - - - - - - - - -
A is Joe Mixon
B is Jeremy Hill
C is Giovani Bernard
Mixon has been objectively the worst of the three. You can argue that he's had the worst OL to work behind of the three, but there have often been good/great RBs behind bad OL. It's not like Saquon Barkley or Todd Gurley inherited good OLs to run behind when they joined the league.
Anyway, I just was thinking about this because I saw some Bengals fans on the internet drooling over that Mixon run that got called back on the bad penalty (where he got caught from behind despite having a lead) and wondered about the actual numbers of the last three RBs to have significant carries for the Bengals.
If you just look at the numbers, Joe's isn't the level of production you want to give an extension to. One good year and two bad years, and RB is a position where it's really common for a guy to have one great season and never recreate it his entire career.
RE: Running Backs - Sanforbd - 12-04-2019
I don't think we should extend him, good teams don't pay RB's
RE: Running Backs - XenoMorph - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 05:39 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: After Three Years In Each.....
Running Back A:
598 carries, 2437 rushing yards (4.1 AVG), 14 TD
99 catches, 773 receiving yards (7.8 AVG), 4 TD
Seasons of 3.5, 4.9, and 3.5 YPC.
0 rushing TDs of 20+ yards.
Running Back B:
667 carries, 2757 rushing yards (4.1 AVG), 29 TD
63 catches, 467 receiving yards (7.4 AVG), 1 TD
Seasons of 5.1, 3.6, and 3.8 YPC.
4 rushing TDs of 20+ yards.
Running Back C:
492 carries, 2105 rushing yards (4.3 AVG), 12 TD
148 catches, 1335 receiving yards (9.0 AVG), 5 TD
Seasons of 4.1, 4.0, and 4.7 YPC.
2 rushing TD of 20+ yards.
- - - - - - - - - - -
A is Joe Mixon
B is Jeremy Hill
C is Giovani Bernard
Mixon has been objectively the worst of the three. You can argue that he's had the worst OL to work behind of the three, but there have often been good/great RBs behind bad OL. It's not like Saquon Barkley or Todd Gurley inherited good OLs to run behind when they joined the league.
Anyway, I just was thinking about this because I saw some Bengals fans on the internet drooling over that Mixon run that got called back on the bad penalty (where he got caught from behind despite having a lead) and wondered about the actual numbers of the last three RBs to have significant carries for the Bengals.
If you just look at the numbers, Joe's isn't the level of production you want to give an extension to. One good year and two bad years, and RB is a position where it's really common for a guy to have one great season and never recreate it his entire career.
Whats the OL Rankings each of them 3 years for each lol
RE: Running Backs - J24 - 12-04-2019
1.) Gio & Hill did have a lot better lines there first three seasons it isn't even close
2.) Mixon lead the AFC in rushing last year
3.) Mixon career has been disappointing but the coaching staff hasn't used him the right way yet. Particularly in the passing game.
RE: Running Backs - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 06:56 PM)J24 Wrote: 1.) Gio & Hill did have a lot better lines there first three seasons it isn't even close
2.) Mixon lead the AFC in rushing last year
3.) Mixon career has been disappointing but the coaching staff hasn't used him the right way yet. Particularly in the passing game.
All true. Mixon is the best RB out of the 3 no question and should be used in the passing game much more.
I am in the pay the man camp myself. Mixon behind a decent O-line and getting used in the passing game lots would
be a nightmare for Defenses, once he catches the ball he is much harder to tackle then a Wideout. Makes defenders
miss, can go over, around or through defenders etc.
RE: Running Backs - SunsetBengal - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 07:06 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: All true. Mixon is the best RB out of the 3 no question and should be used in the passing game much more.
I am in the pay the man camp myself. Mixon behind a decent O-line and getting used in the passing game lots would
be a nightmare for Defenses, once he catches the ball he is much harder to tackle then a Wideout. Makes defenders
miss, can go over, around or through defenders etc.
Mixon has 4 games to gain 321 yards, to pass Hill's 3 year total. If he has one dominant game, where he busts for 150+, I think he surpasses Hill's total.
The real difference is that Mixon hasn't had the blocking, in order to allow him to reach the 2nd level of defenders at full speed, and then be able to run over or run past defenders from the secondary.
RE: Running Backs - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 07:38 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Mixon has 4 games to gain 321 yards, to pass Hill's 3 year total. If he has one dominant game, where he busts for 150+, I think he surpasses Hill's total.
The real difference is that Mixon hasn't had the blocking, in order to allow him to reach the 2nd level of defenders at full speed, and then be able to run over or run past defenders from the secondary.
I think he can do that even with this shitty run blocking O-line. Glenn might not help though, we all know Glenn is a good pass
blocker but man is he soft in the run game. I want to see what Mixon can do behind a good run blocking O-line, bet behind a
good one he could lead the league in rushing and if you use him more in the passing game he could lead the league combined
yards as well. Dude is crazy talented, this is just another thread that proves a point I have stressed over the years that stats
don't tell it all.
RE: Running Backs - Yojimbo - 12-04-2019
What are the fumble numbers?
RE: Running Backs - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 08:43 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: What are the fumble numbers?
Good question.
RE: Running Backs - SunsetBengal - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 08:38 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I think he can do that even with this shitty run blocking O-line. Glenn might not help though, we all know Glenn is a good pass
blocker but man is he soft in the run game. I want to see what Mixon can do behind a good run blocking O-line, bet behind a
good one he could lead the league in rushing and if you use him more in the passing game he could lead the league combined
yards as well. Dude is crazy talented, this is just another thread that proves a point I have stressed over the years that stats
don't tell it all.
Here's the thing about using him more in the passing game. Science has shown that the human body can only hold up for so many football collisions (mini car crashes, if you will). The number that the football world seems to agree upon for RBs is under 250, if you want the guy to hold up for next year, as well. If you give that RB say 80 receptions in the passing game, you might want to limit his carries for the year to around 170 or less. And on the converse, if you have a "bell cow" type of back, and you want to feed him the ball 230 times in the running game, you might want to limit his pass receptions to around 20 for the season.
Yes, I know that I didn't back any of that up with statistical citations. I have read things over the years, and draw from that accumulated knowledge to form general opinions.
RE: Running Backs - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 08:49 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Here's the thing about using him more in the passing game. Science has shown that the human body can only hold up for so many football collisions (mini car crashes, if you will). The number that the football world seems to agree upon for RBs is under 250, if you want the guy to hold up for next year, as well. If you give that RB say 80 receptions in the passing game, you might want to limit his carries for the year to around 170 or less. And on the converse, if you have a "bell cow" type of back, and you want to feed him the ball 230 times in the running game, you might want to limit his pass receptions to around 20 for the season.
Yes, I know that I didn't back any of that up with statistical citations. I have read things over the years, and draw from that accumulated knowledge to form general opinions.
That sounds like a safe conclusion. I wouldn't mind seeing Gio more on running downs and switching it up and using Mixon
more on passing downs either. There are ways to mitigate the abuse our RB's take.
RE: Running Backs - bfine32 - 12-04-2019
Oh, I clearly remember how many folks applauded our Oline during Jeremy's tenure........
OK, that was a joke.
RE: Running Backs - jason - 12-04-2019
(12-04-2019, 06:56 PM)J24 Wrote: 1.) Gio & Hill did have a lot better lines there first three seasons it isn't even close
2.) Mixon lead the AFC in rushing last year
3.) Mixon career has been disappointing but the coaching staff hasn't used him the right way yet. Particularly in the passing game.
The o line was awful in 2016 too, and Ken Zampese was the OC... That was Hill's 3rd season. Gio split carries with the Law Firm as a rookie, and was the 3rd down back behind Hill from the middle of 2014 onward. I think we make too many excuses for Mixon. Quite frankly I'm shocked that he has run for that many yards, and averages over 4 per carry. I see a lot of games where he's right around 2.
RE: Running Backs - scorp1974 - 12-04-2019
Dont forget the stat of fumbling in a playoff game with under 2 mins to go while Cincy is ahead.
That belongs to J. Hill. Thanks again for the loss Hill.
RE: Running Backs - J24 - 12-05-2019
(12-04-2019, 10:55 PM)jason Wrote: The o line was awful in 2016 too, and Ken Zampese was the OC... That was Hill's 3rd season. Gio split carries with the Law Firm as a rookie, and was the 3rd down back behind Hill from the middle of 2014 onward. I think we make too many excuses for Mixon. Quite frankly I'm shocked that he has run for that many yards, and averages over 4 per carry. I see a lot of games where he's right around 2.
2016 we had Zeitler and Whitworth on the line two premier players at their position.
This season our best lineman is Trey Hopkins.
RE: Running Backs - Bilbo Saggins - 12-05-2019
People used to say that Marshawn Lynch wasn't anything special in Buffalo. He was constantly hit in the backfield and had to wrestle after first contact in order to grind out minimal yardage. Mixon's situation reminds me of that. The eyeball test lets you know that the dude can flat out play. He has catches where he looks like a receiver. He has blocks where he looks as mean as any blocking RB. He has jukes and angles that make good defenders look silly. Mixon can't be judged based upon yards alone imo. It's also my opinion that the coaching staff is doing things ass backwards by rotating Mixon out on passing downs - what they should do is rotate by series, not downs. Let Gio bang some runs between the tackles and let Mixon show off his passing game chops every once in a while. They're both flexible enough to pull that off.
RE: Running Backs - SHRacerX - 12-05-2019
(12-04-2019, 06:18 PM)Sanforbd Wrote: I don't think we should extend him, good teams don't pay RB's
There is a lot of truth here, but I do like his drive/competitiveness. That being said, I think the two late round RBs added last year signaled some of this...I also can't help but think a bulldozer like a Derrick Henry might serve this offense better.
Couldn't you just see Mixon becoming an outstanding offensive weapon being targeted as a receiver a lot if he went to a team like KC or NE?
RE: Running Backs - jason - 12-05-2019
(12-05-2019, 02:20 AM)J24 Wrote: 2016 we had Zeitler and Whitworth on the line two premier players at their position.
This season our best lineman is Trey Hopkins.
Fair enough... But they weren't good as a unit that year. That was the year we played the Jets in the opener, and they teed off on Andy, and I remember someone posting a photo on here of every single lineman collapsed around Dalton vs the Giants. Outside of AJ (and he missed a lot of games) the passing game was anemic. The defense fell off a cliff, and Zampese was calling the offense. I'm not saying Hill was good... He wasn't. He wasn't particularly good the year before either. A lot of TDs, and fumbles.
RE: Running Backs - SadFaceBengal15 - 12-05-2019
Hahahaha Hahahah the offensive line for hill and gio compared to what we have now isn’t even comparable. This thread is knee slap worthy
RE: Running Backs - Bengalitis - 12-05-2019
I been happy with our QBs & RBs the last 15 yrs. All good enough to get us in the playoffs.