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+--- Thread: Andy the Bear. (/thread-23168.html)
Andy the Bear. - Chezaugie - 02-28-2020
Sorry for the obscure movie reference, but, it looks like Andy is now in play. Good sign as other teams may feel a sense of urgency to talk about a trade. Just need two interested teams competing to increase his value.
https://bengalswire.usatoday.com/2020/02/28/andy-dalton-trade-bears-bengals-discussions/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=NFLdraftmaverickJeff&fbclid=IwAR1lNFeSlHxiDkJ-bejCQnUntizTmS-hMI0QctQbof-8fdUrDLZB-vQ9XcY
RE: Andy the Bear. - bengaloo - 02-28-2020
Would love to see this happen. Peace of mind for all.
RE: Andy the Bear. - Gdale_Bengal - 02-28-2020
Good gravy could we suck a 2nd from the bears lol
RE: Andy the Bear. - Captain Happy Pants - 02-29-2020
If Mitch Trubisky is worth trading up for, Andy is worth a second round pick at least. Do the Bears have a second?
Andy the Bear. - BenZoo2 - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 01:14 AM)Captain Happy Pants Wrote: If Mitch Trubisky is worth trading up for, Andy is worth a second round pick at least. Do the Bears have a second?
They have 43 and 50
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RE: Andy the Bear. - NATI BENGALS - 02-29-2020
Can NFL trades do like MLB trades and the team trading away the player also pay some of the players salary?
Like could we trade the Bears Cordy and Dalton and instead of them taking on roughly 26 mil in cap hit (Cordy is about 9mil and Dalton about 17 I think) we say we will cover half?
RE: Andy the Bear. - Nately120 - 02-29-2020
Never say never when it comes to the stupidity of GMs, but I assume asking for a 2nd is a "high ask" so they can haggle to something more reasonable for Dalton. As bleh as Trubisky is he was better than Dalton statistically in 2019, he's 7 years younger, he's on a rookie contract, the Bears are already stuck with for him for free, and he came closer to lucking into a playoff win in 1 try than Dalton did in 4.
Basically, if the Bears need to evaluate if Dalton is worth a 2nd they should put Trubisky on the trade block for a 2nd round pick themselves and see how the response comes back. I can see how the Titans bringing in Tannehill for a song and riding his hot streak to the championship game has teams thinking about competition for ho-hum starters, but a 2nd for one year of Dalton? Ida know, even taking them having Lazor into account.
Also, Mike Brown saying a QB who won 2 games and had a bottom-tier stat line in 2019 is worth a 2nd round pick is tantamount to saying Dalton is way better than he looked last year...which would indicate that our team/coaching negatively impacted Dalton is quite a serious way. But again, I guess this is just starting with a high opening price.
RE: Andy the Bear. - SHRacerX - 02-29-2020
(02-28-2020, 09:32 PM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: Good gravy could we suck a 2nd from the bears lol
They do have two of them
RE: Andy the Bear. - SHRacerX - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 02:11 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Can NFL trades do like MLB trades and the team trading away the player also pay some of the players salary?
Like could we trade the Bears Cordy and Dalton and instead of them taking on roughly 26 mil in cap hit (Cordy is about 9mil and Dalton about 17 I think) we say we will cover half?
Not sure if we could do it, but we never SHOULD.
RE: Andy the Bear. - fredtoast - 02-29-2020
Bears have already said Trubisky would be their starter next year. Can't see them giving up a lot in trade in order to pay a back up QB $17 million.
RE: Andy the Bear. - HarleyDog - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 02:11 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Can NFL trades do like MLB trades and the team trading away the player also pay some of the players salary?
Like could we trade the Bears Cordy and Dalton and instead of them taking on roughly 26 mil in cap hit (Cordy is about 9mil and Dalton about 17 I think) we say we will cover half?
(02-29-2020, 11:26 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Not sure if we could do it, but we never SHOULD.
article I just read: https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/bengals-shouldn-t-hold-out-for-2nd-round-return-in-an-andy-dalton-trade/ar-BB10wBFk?ocid=hplocalnews
Quote:The idea of getting back a second-round pick for Andy Dalton sounds spectacular from a Cincinnati Bengals perspective.
But it might be a little too rich.
From a Bengals perspective, Dalton sounds worth such a return. He’s one of the better available veterans this offseason, he’s been nothing but a great representative for the team and city, holds many records, it goes on and on.
But from another team’s perspective, Dalton is over the age of 30 and represents a one-year rental at a cost of $17.7 million. With no guaranteed money left, he could just as easily be cut and available on the market without sacrificing any assets via trade.
Which makes rumors of Dalton’s value rough sledding. Lindsay Jonesof The Athletic, for example, cites an NFL general manager who suggested Dalton could command a second-round pick (was this general manager named Duke Tobin?).
That sounds great. And maybe in a normal offseason, it would be a sure thing. But consider some of the options teams have available to themselves this offseason via free agency and trade:
Tom Brady Drew Brees Dak Prescott Philip Rivers Teddy Bridgewater Jameis Winston Marcus Mariota Ryan Tannehill Cam Newton
Obviously, some of these names aren’t leaving their current teams and chatter around them is just leverage in negotiations.
But the point stands. Unless a team really falls in love with Dalton as the guy, they’ve got other options. And if the Bengals hold out for the best possible compensation, they run the risk of overplaying their hand as this passer-rich offseason fills all the vacancies and they’re left with merely cutting Dalton.
And keep in mind they want to do right by Dalton — cutting him after all the other vacancies fill doesn’t do that for a guy who still wants to start in the NFL.
Meaning, the Bengals have painted themselves in a corner. Teams know they can cut Dalton and will ultimately have to in order to shed the cap. Teams also know the unique approach in Cincinnati wants to do right by their former franchise passer.
So while reports of a big-time pick in the second round sound fun, the only way that happens is if the Bengals agree to eat a massive portion of Dalton’s contract during a trade.
Maybe that’s what ultimately happens — but the Bengals run a big risk by playing this game for too long during this particular offseason.
RE: Andy the Bear. - Gdale_Bengal - 02-29-2020
I think the bengals should aim high but expect a 3rd or 4th.
RE: Andy the Bear. - NATI BENGALS - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 11:26 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Not sure if we could do it, but we never SHOULD.
If we could we SHOULD. Without a doubt I would throw in cash considerations if it means we could get an early pick or two for some of these veterans.
RE: Andy the Bear. - Luvnit2 - 02-29-2020
I would watch Tom Brady FA move. If he leaves the Pats, then Pats will go after a vet QB and Dalton would be in play. Otherwise, I am not sure others will give up anything for him.
Will they cut AD if no trade is big question right now? I am not sure if they need to get the cap space. They may hold him to see if other teams get in dire straights once season starts. I hope not, but MB is stubborn.
RE: Andy the Bear. - Nicomo Cosca - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 11:33 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Bears have already said Trubisky would be their starter next year. Can't see them giving up a lot in trade in order to pay a back up QB $17 million.
That was before they hired Lazor though. Maybe he’d prefer Dalton?
RE: Andy the Bear. - Nicomo Cosca - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 11:49 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: If we could we SHOULD. Without a doubt I would throw in cash considerations if it means we could get an early pick or two for some of these veterans.
Yeah, teams do it all the time in the NHL. If you have plenty of cap room it makes a lot of sense.
Doesn’t seem like something Mike Brown would do though.
RE: Andy the Bear. - Wes Mantooth - 02-29-2020
If the Bears were to part with a 2nd in a deal for Dalton then I think we'd have to be including a pick as well. Something like Dalton + a 4th for their 2nd.
They'd be bringing him to compete with Trubinsky, not just handing him the job. And he wouldn't be considered a long term answer from day 1 either. So a 2nd straight up seems insanely high to me.
RE: Andy the Bear. - fredtoast - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 11:24 AM)Nately120 Wrote: As bleh as Trubisky is he was better than Dalton statistically in 2019, he's 7 years younger, he's on a rookie contract, the Bears are already stuck with for him for free, and he came closer to lucking into a playoff win in 1 try than Dalton did in 4.
This is why you need to actually watch a QB play to understand his numbers.
Last year Trubisky did not even attempt to throw the ball downfield. As bad as Dalton was he still averaged 6.6 yards per attempt and 11.1 yards per completion. Trubisky just averaged 6.1 and 9.6.
Bears fans blame the OC for changing the game plan. Trubisky was much more effective in 2018 when he ran the ball more and made plays outside the pocket.
Bears have two Pro Bowl O-linemen (Charles Leno, Cody Whitehair) and a great WR in Allen Robinson.
RE: Andy the Bear. - BenZoo2 - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 11:33 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Bears have already said Trubisky would be their starter next year. Can't see them giving up a lot in trade in order to pay a back up QB $17 million.
What do you expect them to say? The minute they say they're looking for a new starter they lose leverage and destroy any little confidence trubisky has. This way they keep their options open.
(02-29-2020, 12:20 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: If the Bears were to part with a 2nd in a deal for Dalton then I think we'd have to be including a pick as well. Something like Dalton + a 4th for their 2nd.
They'd be bringing him to compete with Trubinsky, not just handing him the job. And he wouldn't be considered a long term answer from day 1 either. So a 2nd straight up seems insanely high to me.
They could throw in a later pick. I could see them switching picks rd 5. Bears move to 129, we drop to 142ish.
RE: Andy the Bear. - Nately120 - 02-29-2020
(02-29-2020, 12:24 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is why you need to actually watch a QB play to understand his numbers.
Last year Trubisky did not even attempt to throw the ball downfield. As bad as Dalton was he still averaged 6.6 yards per attempt and 11.1 yards per completion. Trubisky just averaged 6.1 and 9.6.
Bears fans blame the OC for changing the game plan. Trubisky was much more effective in 2018 when he ran the ball more and made plays outside the pocket.
Bears have two Pro Bowl O-linemen (Charles Leno, Cody Whitehair) and a great WR in Allen Robinson.
Trubisky was in a better situation than Dalton was in 2019 that's for sure, but I'm still not sure even discounting Dalton's lousy stats makes up for him being older and more expensive than Trubisky. This isn't so much me being on the Trubisky train as saying outside of the Bears making a terrible blunder expecting them to use a 2nd round pick to upgrade from Mitch to Andy is a stretch.