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+--- Thread: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker (/thread-25753.html)
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This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Wes Mantooth - 11-20-2020
We need a big-time linebacker. A high level, versatile, play-making beast of LB. They don't have to be the 2nd coming of Brian Urlacher or Ray Lewis, but they do need to be much better than what we've had.
How long has it been since we've had a linebacker that fits this description? More importantly, how long as it been since we've had a well above average LB that we could count on from year to year?
You might want to throw out Burfict's name. He definitely fit the desciption at times. The problem with him is he only started 16 games once in his entire career. His other year he saw the field in every game was his rookie year, where he hadn't quite reached his peak level. After year 2, here are his games played totals for us: 5, 10, 11, 10, 7.
At times Burfict was elite, and a force. At other times he was slow, and out of shape. And most of the time we couldn't count on having him for a full season.
Before him, you have to go all the way back to 2005 to find Odell Thurman. He has a fantastic rookie campaign with 105 tackles, 5 INT's, and 5 FF's. Of course, we all know the problem here. He only played one season. Such a shame, because he could've and should've been someone we could count on year-in and year-out.
The one player that comes to mind, that I think fits my description, is Takeo Spikes, who played here from '98 to '02. You have to go back almost 20 years to find an above average LB we've had that was a full-time starter over a stretch of years.
Guys, that's a big problem.
We need to find that guy again. They don't have to be all-world, just a top 1/3 of the league guy that can make some big plays.
The guys we recently drafted could be decent. I'm not writing them off or anything like that. Although, I have way more faith in Logan Wilson to be a legitimate starter than Davis-Geather (dude looks so slow). But I don't think either of these guys fit my description either.
I hope we either go out and pay a chunck of a change to legitimate FA, or we target a LB early in the 2nd or late in the first (we could trade up). I know we have a lot of holes, but we continue to run out a garbage LB core year after year. We need to do better here.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - kalibengal - 11-20-2020
maybe they can get Patrick Willis to come out of retirement. he was a beast....
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - impactplaya - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 02:55 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: We need a big-time linebacker. A high level, versatile, play-making beast of LB. They don't have to be the 2nd coming of Brian Urlacher or Ray Lewis, but they do need to be much better than what we've had.
How long has it been since we've had a linebacker that fits this description? More importantly, how long as it been since we've had a well above average LB that we could count on from year to year?
You might want to throw out Burfict's name. He definitely fit the desciption at times. The problem with him is he only started 16 games once in his entire career. His other year he saw the field in every game was his rookie year, where he hadn't quite reached his peak level. After year 2, here are his games played totals for us: 5, 10, 11, 10, 7.
At times Burfict was elite, and a force. At other times he was slow, and out of shape. And most of the time we couldn't count on having him for a full season.
Before him, you have to go all the way back to 2005 to find Odell Thurman. He has a fantastic rookie campaign with 105 tackles, 5 INT's, and 5 FF's. Of course, we all know the problem here. He only played one season. Such a shame, because he could've and should've been someone we could count on year-in and year-out.
The one player that comes to mind, that I think fits my description, is Takeo Spikes, who played here from '98 to '02. You have to go back almost 20 years to find an above average LB we've had that was a full-time starter over a stretch of years.
Guys, that's a big problem.
We need to find that guy again. They don't have to be all-world, just a top 1/3 of the league guy that can make some big plays.
The guys we recently drafted could be decent. I'm not writing them off or anything like that. Although, I have way more faith in Logan Wilson to be a legitimate starter than Davis-Geather (dude looks so slow). But I don't think either of these guys fit my description either.
I hope we either go out and pay a chunck of a change to legitimate FA, or we target a LB early in the 2nd or late in the first (we could trade up). I know we have a lot of holes, but we continue to run out a garbage LB core year after year. We need to do better here.
I dont understand how vs the Titans I watch Logan Wilson
Blitz and sack Ryan Tannehill.
Then vs the Steelers I dont even hear his named called.
At the most he is the most complete LB the Bengals
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - TheLeonardLeap - 11-20-2020
This is the most environmentally kind thread topic there has ever been with how often it's been recycled. Lol
Pretty sure over the last 20 years there was 1 year of Odell, maybe 1 year where we felt good about the Howard/Maualuga combo, 1/2 of a year where we felt good about Keith Rivers, and then like 2 years where we felt great about Burfict.
No idea why this team struggles so hard in finding quality linebackers.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Gdale_Bengal - 11-20-2020
I feel like they don’t draft linebackers early. They took Blackman and spikes in the first round.
I don’t think they haven’t drafted linebacker first round after that draft since.
Guess Gaither is having a tougher time adjusting to the nfl than they thought.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - ochocincos - 11-20-2020
This team is really missing a run stopper at LB. I'd love for the Bengals to get Matt Milano in FA or get a LB in Rd 1 (Parsons, Moses) or Rd 2 (Nick Bolton).
With that said, I do believe if this team shifted to a full-time 3-4 with some better run stoppers up front, Pratt and Wilson/Bynes could be fine as the ILBs.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - TheLeonardLeap - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 03:29 PM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: I feel like they don’t draft linebackers early. They took Blackman and spikes in the first round.
I don’t think they haven’t drafted linebacker first round after that draft since.
Guess Gaither is having a tougher time adjusting to the nfl than they thought.
Keith Rivers in the 1st, 2008 (9th overall, 1st LB chosen, and just 1 pick before Jerod Mayo)
Rey Maualuga in the 2nd, 2009
- - - - - - - - - -
Since then they have just been hitting the 3rd Round hard for LB (and failing).
Dontay Moch in 2011
Paul Dawson in 2015
Nick Vigil in 2016
Malik Jefferson in 2018
Germaine Pratt in 2019
Logan Wilson in 2020
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - bfine32 - 11-20-2020
I know we all like to look back and say "I was calling for this guy" but I remember 2 of my favs going into the 2015 Draft were Benardrick McKinney and Eric Kendricks. We took Ced O.
It was also the year I was high on a couple UK LBs coming out:
Bud Dupree
ZaDarius Smith
I remember hating that they went to the Steelers and Ravens.
But hey, we got PJ Dawson in the 3rd.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Wes Mantooth - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 03:54 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Dontay Moch in 2011
Paul Dawson in 2015
Malik Jefferson in 2018
These three in particular are way up the list in terms of our worst draft picks ever. They make Jerome Simpson look like a steal.
If these guys had love of Marlboro's they'd be in the elite company of Sean Brewer.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - fredtoast - 11-20-2020
The argument has usually been that almost all of the LBs who are taken in the first round are 3-4 OLBs who will be edge rushers. All purpose 4-3 LBs are usually not rated that high. They are more like RBs. Only the very elite get a first round grade.
But we have all seen what a difference a stud LB can make even in a 4-3. Burfict was a game changer compared to Keith Rivers/Thomas Howard. And I don't really think Rivers was that bad of a LB. He just got trashed because he was drafted too high.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - fredtoast - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 03:59 PM)bfine32 Wrote: But hey, we got PJ Dawson in the 3rd.
And for some reason many people here were thrilled.
I never understand why some college players become favorites of Bengal fans, but there were a lot of guys who claimed PJ would be a star for us.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 03:29 PM)Gdale_Bengal Wrote: I feel like they don’t draft linebackers early. They took Blackman and spikes in the first round.
I don’t think they haven’t drafted linebacker first round after that draft since.
Guess Gaither is having a tougher time adjusting to the nfl than they thought.
They just don't draft D early.
Just one first round and one second round pick on D in the last 6 drafts.
Since 1991 they've only twice gone D with their first two picks (1998 and 2005 - incidentally all LBers).
In contrast they've double dipped on O in 1995, 1996, 2003, 2011, 2013, 2015, 2017, 2019, 2020
FWIW I think they need a stud pass-rusher.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Joelist - 11-20-2020
For al we know we might have the LBs we need but Lou's weird scheme is inhibiting their development.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Yogo - 11-20-2020
If you follow the money contracts, pass rushers are valued a lot more than an ILB or MLB. ILB/MLB seem to fit in the category of Safeties and Running Backs. Pass rushers affect the game a lot more than an inside LB. Best to get an IMPACTPLAYA on the edge.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - EatonFan - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 04:27 PM)Yogo Wrote: If you follow the money contracts, pass rushers are valued a lot more than an ILB or MLB. ILB/MLB seem to fit in the category of Safeties and Running Backs. Pass rushers affect the game a lot more than an inside LB. Best to get an IMPACTPLAYA on the edge.
I'm not so sure. LBs that can cover a TE or the 4th WR are incredibly valuable. That's a play that doesn't occure (a catch) and yet gives the DE time to get to the QB.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Tony - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 02:57 PM)kalibengal Wrote: maybe they can get Patrick Willis to come out of retirement. he was a beast....
Ya, I'm sure he would love to come out of retirement for Cincinnati's glorious organization... Seems legit...
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Gdale_Bengal - 11-20-2020
(11-20-2020, 03:54 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Keith Rivers in the 1st, 2008 (9th overall, 1st LB chosen, and just 1 pick before Jerod Mayo)
Rey Maualuga in the 2nd, 2009
- - - - - - - - - -
Since then they have just been hitting the 3rd Round hard for LB (and failing).
Dontay Moch in 2011
Paul Dawson in 2015
Nick Vigil in 2016
Malik Jefferson in 2018
Germaine Pratt in 2019
Logan Wilson in 2020
(11-20-2020, 04:20 PM)TJHoushmandzadehs Shiny Shoes Wrote: They just don't draft D early.I forgot about Rivers. Totally my bad.
Just one first round and one second round pick on D in the last 6 drafts.
Since 1991 they've only twice gone D with their first two picks (1998 and 2005 - incidentally all LBers).
In contrast they've double dipped on O in 1995, 1996, 2003, 2011, 2013, 2015, 2017, 2019, 2020
FWIW I think they need a stud pass-rusher.
It’s really not hard to understand that when you choose to not pick defensive talent early when you build through the draft that unit isn going to be very good. Until this year we never brought in quality FA either.
Maybe if they had this defensive guru who could scheme around there weaknesses and could manufacture pass rushes from almost nothing it would be different. Zimmer could do that with UDFA and one dimensional linebackers and some linemen off the streets. Ole Lou doesn’t seem to be doing it with tge Tony Browns of the NFL however.
100% agree they need a premium pass rusher.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - Murdock2420 - 11-20-2020
More then a LB, T, G, CB, WR, QB, etc, etc..
This team needs a stud GM
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - jfkbengals - 11-21-2020
Wilson has made some big plays on both the defensive and special teams units. It seems he has the skills to do the job, so let's give him the opportunity to learn from this rookie year and develop. I do think he will become a solid pro, the kind of guy who is never a liability on the field. I see him as being a (hopefully always healthy) Sean Lee type of player: not flashy, but always gets the job done.
But that still leaves room for someone alongside him who can make an elite tandem.
RE: This Team Needs a Stud Linebacker - bengalfan74 - 11-21-2020
And what's funny is Marvin considered himself the LBer king. And besides Burfict, which is debatable, and Thurman way back when, he pretty much struck out.