(03-07-2021, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: As most of you probably remember I was against tagging Green to play in 2020.  Now the team is facing the same situation with Geno.  The facts are not identical, but there are a lot of similarities.

Both Green and Atkins had proven to be elite players in their prime.  These type of players get more consideration when they start aging and dealing with injuries because even if they only return at 80%-90% of their previous level they would still be good, above-average players.

Green was a much bigger concern to me because there appeared to be complications with his recovery.  Geno had shoulder surgery 3 months ago.  The entire decision about what to do with him depends on what the doctors are saying about his shoulder.  And that is something us fans will really know nothing about.

However at the time Green was injured in 2018 he was still at the top of his game.  He was averaging a career high 15.1 per catch and his 85 yards per game average was the second best in his career.  On the other hand Atkins appeared to be on the decline in 2019.  Even though he was selected to the Pro Bowl his production dropped dramatically from 2018.  He had about half as many sacks (4.5 to 10) and QB Hits (10 to 19), and less than a third as many TFL (4 to 13).  Even if he did not deserve the Pro Bowl selection he was obviously still a good, above average starter.  But it appeared he was in decline and in 2021 he will be two years older coming off shoulder surgery.

Despite all the questions about Atkins, if we had not just wasted $18 million on A J Green I would almost guarantee that the front office would keep Atkins under his current contract for 2021.  But I'll bet the burn of that $18 mistake is still fresh in their minds.

(03-07-2021, 01:05 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am not sure other than age and being very good in the past there are any other similarities between Green and Geno. Green had not really played for 2 years and was not under contract, so they tagged him to keep him.

Geno is under contract and not a FA so they could cut him, restructure him adding years, but loosening guarantees lowering hos cap hit for 2021. I think Geno's play in 2020 showed he does not deserve for the Bengals to ignore his poor performance + his injuries. If Geno wants to stay a Bengal, his agent should be offering a new deal lowering his compensation. In my opinion, has nothing to do with AJ's play falling off a cliff in 2020 after being tagged.

(03-07-2021, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: As most of you probably remember I was against tagging Green to play in 2020. Now the team is facing the same situation with Geno. The facts are not identical, but there are a lot of similarities.

Both Green and Atkins had proven to be elite players in their prime. These type of players get more consideration when they start aging and dealing with injuries because even if they only return at 80%-90% of their previous level they would still be good, above-average players.

Green was a much bigger concern to me because there appeared to be complications with his recovery. Geno had shoulder surgery 3 months ago. The entire decision about what to do with him depends on what the doctors are saying about his shoulder. And that is something us fans will really know nothing about.

However at the time Green was injured in 2018 he was still at the top of his game. He was averaging a career high 15.1 per catch and his 85 yards per game average was the second best in his career. On the other hand Atkins appeared to be on the decline in 2019. Even though he was selected to the Pro Bowl his production dropped dramatically from 2018. He had about half as many sacks (4.5 to 10) and QB Hits (10 to 19), and less than a third as many TFL (4 to 13). Even if he did not deserve the Pro Bowl selection he was obviously still a good, above average starter. But it appeared he was in decline and in 2021 he will be two years older coming off shoulder surgery.

Despite all the questions about Atkins, if we had not just wasted $18 million on A J Green I would almost guarantee that the front office would keep Atkins under his current contract for 2021. But I'll bet the burn of that $18 mistake is still fresh in their minds.

(03-07-2021, 12:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: As most of you probably remember I was against tagging Green to play in 2020.  Now the team is facing the same situation with Geno.  The facts are not identical, but there are a lot of similarities.

Both Green and Atkins had proven to be elite players in their prime.  These type of players get more consideration when they start aging and dealing with injuries because even if they only return at 80%-90% of their previous level they would still be good, above-average players.

Green was a much bigger concern to me because there appeared to be complications with his recovery.  Geno had shoulder surgery 3 months ago.  The entire decision about what to do with him depends on what the doctors are saying about his shoulder.  And that is something us fans will really know nothing about.

However at the time Green was injured in 2018 he was still at the top of his game.  He was averaging a career high 15.1 per catch and his 85 yards per game average was the second best in his career.  On the other hand Atkins appeared to be on the decline in 2019.  Even though he was selected to the Pro Bowl his production dropped dramatically from 2018.  He had about half as many sacks (4.5 to 10) and QB Hits (10 to 19), and less than a third as many TFL (4 to 13).  Even if he did not deserve the Pro Bowl selection he was obviously still a good, above average starter.  But it appeared he was in decline and in 2021 he will be two years older coming off shoulder surgery.

Despite all the questions about Atkins, if we had not just wasted $18 million on A J Green I would almost guarantee that the front office would keep Atkins under his current contract for 2021.  But I'll bet the burn of that $18 mistake is still fresh in their minds.

(03-07-2021, 06:13 PM)Bengalstripes9 Wrote: Hobson definitely hinted at either a Geno restructuring or release in his latest Hobson Choice. If that’s the case, he’s very likely not playing out his contract.

Geno has been one of my favorites of the last ten years. Sad to see him and Green go, but players get older I guess. Geno doesn’t fit the new scheme as well as he did the 4-3.

I’m sure Green’s season weighs in on their decision somewhat. Also a big factor is we suck, and need a youth movement.

(03-08-2021, 10:41 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Do they have to wait for new league year to start to cut Atkins if they are going to use the post-June 1 designation?
I thought they did, but not sure.

If they don't, I don't understand why they haven't moved on from Atkins already. Cutting him after FA starts is kind of crap because that player likely isn't going to get as good of a deal compared to if he was available on Day 1 of FA.

(03-08-2021, 10:45 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: geno was hurt to finish the year correct? maybe they have to wait till healthy to cut to avoid an injury settlement  or maybe they havent decided to move on and are exploring an extension

(03-08-2021, 10:58 AM)ochocincos Wrote: When you say extension, do you mean a restructure? I ask because Atkins still has 2 years left on his deal. No need to extend.

(03-08-2021, 12:52 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Yeah or you can say add 1 year at the same total contract price.. However they want to do it.  

(03-08-2021, 01:35 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If I'm Atkins, I'm not adding more years without adding more money. He could go to an actual contender if cut, which might be desirable given his age. Bengals probably aren't truly competing until at least 2022.