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Burrow has been amazing, but... - Shake n Blake - 10-04-2021
Can we take a second to talk about how ridiculous passing has become?
Burrow is completing a whopping 72.9% of his throws. I know Steve Young held the record for like 20 years at 70.3% before Drew Brees broke it. Now we have 7 QBs at 70% or better, and Burrow is only 3rd.
Kyler Murray is completing 76.1%...which would be a good free throw percentage in the NBA.
Burrow is also averaging 9.2 yards/attempt, which is also incredible, and would easily lead the league most years I've been alive. Yet Burrow only ranks 4th in that stat, with 5 QBs averaging 9.1 or better.
In passer rating, Burrow is sitting pretty at 113.8, which used to be a staggering number. Montana and Steve Young once held that record at a shade over 112. Now Burrow's number is only good for 7th...which is insane.
15 qualifying QBs are currently sporting a 100 passer rating or better.
-------------------
I'm not trying to cheapen Burrow's accomplishments at all. He still ranks highly and is playing great football. I'm just wondering if the league shifted a little too far towards offense with some of the rule changes through the years.
...and please for the love of God, don't say this is evolution. The stats have been skyrocketing just over the last few years.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - JaggedJimmyJay - 10-04-2021
This isn't exactly a new development. It's been happening for a decade or longer. The game must necessarily soften unless the NFL wants CTE to ruin it from within (they don't), and passing numbers have exploded as a result. I don't mind it. Records mean nothing anymore, but if we're honest: they never meant anything in the first place.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - KillerGoose - 10-04-2021
I agree with you Shake. I personally would like to see something that gives a bump to defensive play. Maybe extend the physical contact to first 10 yards instead of 5? Genuinely have no idea. I enjoy a more offensive oriented football but a strong defense can be enjoyable as well.
That being said, I do expect these numbers to even out as the season goes on.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - XenoMorph - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:35 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Can we take a second to talk about how ridiculous passing has become?
Burrow is completing a whopping 72.9% of his throws. I know Steve Young held the record for like 20 years at 70.3% before Drew Brees broke it. Now we have 7 QBs at 70% or better, and Burrow is only 3rd.
Kyler Murray is completing 76.1%...which would be a good free throw percentage in the NBA.
Burrow is also averaging 9.2 yards/attempt, which is also incredible, and would easily lead the league most years I've been alive. Yet Burrow only ranks 4th in that stat, with 5 QBs averaging 9.1 or better.
In passer rating, Burrow is sitting pretty at 113.8, which used to be a staggering number. Montana and Steve Young once held that record at a shade over 112. Now Burrow's number is only good for 7th...which is insane.
15 qualifying QBs are currently sporting a 100 passer rating or better.
-------------------
I'm not trying to cheapen Burrow's accomplishments at all. He still ranks highly and is playing great football. I'm just wondering if the league shifted a little too far towards offense with some of the rule changes through the years.
...and please for the love of God, don't say this is evolution. The stats have been skyrocketing just over the last few years.
The rules and the game have changed to put more exciting products on the field to raise viewership and incoming cash.
Great Defenses are extremely rare now.
This is why they are talking about Brady playing till hes 50 now...
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - Joelist - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:52 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: I agree with you Shake. I personally would like to see something that gives a bump to defensive play. Maybe extend the physical contact to first 10 yards instead of 5? Genuinely have no idea. I enjoy a more offensive oriented football but a strong defense can be enjoyable as well.
That being said, I do expect these numbers to even out as the season goes on.
I do agree it has gotten too easy for passing. In the Pats - Bucs game they even noted some routes that because of the rules are undefendable. I would support extending physical contact to 10 or even 15 yards to allow the old style "bump and cover" defenses to be used again.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - Shake n Blake - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:52 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: I agree with you Shake. I personally would like to see something that gives a bump to defensive play. Maybe extend the physical contact to first 10 yards instead of 5? Genuinely have no idea. I enjoy a more offensive oriented football but a strong defense can be enjoyable as well.
That being said, I do expect these numbers to even out as the season goes on.
I'm not asking for 1980s type of defensive play, but the game starts to feel a bit cheap when fantastic offensive output is so common. Everyone is playing like the 99 Rams now.
(10-04-2021, 04:55 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: The rules and the game have changed to put more exciting products on the field to raise viewership and incoming cash.
Great Defenses are extremely rare now.
They want to lure in Gen Z with tons of offense. That's why they're allowing zany celebrations now, too. I guess I'm just an old head that misses old style football. All sports are falling victim to this mentality, so the NFL is not alone. The NBA has changed a ton as well, and all rule changes over the last 20 years have favored offense.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - J24 - 10-04-2021
Honestly I think the reason why the numbers are exploding has more to do with offensive philosophy then the rules itself. Teams were not running spread offenses in the 80s, 90s, and 2000s now it is common place.
Also QBs are a lot more skilled today than they were previously. I mean let's look at Kyler Murray for example the dude has the running skills of Barry Sanders but the arm of Jay Cutler. Dudes are just on another level right now.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - XenoMorph - 10-04-2021
Ive always loved Hard Hitting low scoring games.
Games where both teams score 30+ has to be an a black eye to both defenses.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - J24 - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:52 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: I agree with you Shake. I personally would like to see something that gives a bump to defensive play. Maybe extend the physical contact to first 10 yards instead of 5? Genuinely have no idea. I enjoy a more offensive oriented football but a strong defense can be enjoyable as well.
That being said, I do expect these numbers to even out as the season goes on.
Wouldn't mind seeing this.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - Shake n Blake - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 05:02 PM)J24 Wrote: Honestly I think the reason why the numbers are exploding has more to do with offensive philosophy then the rules itself. Teams were not running spread offenses in the 80s, 90s, and 2000s now it is common place.
Also QBs are a lot more skilled today than they were previously. I mean let's look at Kyler Murray for example the dude has the running skills of Barry Sanders but the arm of Jay Cutler. Dudes are just on another level right now.
We've always had guys like that in the league.
Mike Vick ran a 4.3 and could throw 70 yards from his knees.
Randall Cunningham. Steve Young. Donavan McNabb. Steve McNair.
None or these guys were completing 75% with a 120 rating though, and tbh, these physical traits don't directly link to being super efficient anyway. Most of the best QBs in league history were actually very unathletic. Tom Brady was such a guy at 25 years old. Here he is at 44 and dominating with his slow self.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - IndyTiger - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:35 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Can we take a second to talk about how ridiculous passing has become?
Burrow is completing a whopping 72.9% of his throws. I know Steve Young held the record for like 20 years at 70.3% before Drew Brees broke it. Now we have 7 QBs at 70% or better, and Burrow is only 3rd.
Kyler Murray is completing 76.1%...which would be a good free throw percentage in the NBA.
Burrow is also averaging 9.2 yards/attempt, which is also incredible, and would easily lead the league most years I've been alive. Yet Burrow only ranks 4th in that stat, with5 QBs averaging 9.1 or better.
In passer rating, Burrow is sitting pretty at 113.8, which used to be a staggering number. Montana and Steve Young once held that record at a shade over 112. Now Burrow's number is only good for 7th...which is insane.
15 qualifying QBs are currently sporting a 100 passer rating or better.
-------------------
I'm not trying to cheapen Burrow's accomplishments at all. He still ranks highly and is playing great football. I'm just wondering if the league shifted a little too far towards offense with some of the rule changes through the years.
...and please for the love of God, don't say this is evolution. The stats have been skyrocketing just over the last few years.
I agree that offensive systems are getting more complex with teams running multiple sets, 5 wideouts, and other schemes that make throwing the ball easier. But Burrow is different from a lot of those quarterbacks, and here's why:
1.) He's not a system player. He doesn't get the play from the sideline and run it. He is clearly in control of the offense, and changes up the play as needed. Not just that he knows what to do, but he hasn't even played a full season, yet, and he is already running the offense like a 10 year Pro-Bowl veteran. I know they tried to run an offense similar to what Burrow ran at LSU, but honestly, other than the Wishbone, is there an offense that Joe Burrow would not run at a high level?
2.) He always seems to make the right throw at the right time. Obviously, that is impossible, but he does it way more often than not. It's more than just throwing accurately on a slant route. He is very successful throwing down field, because he understands when to and when not to make those throws. His processing speed and decisiveness when he makes his reads is phenomenal. This helps him make great plays when off schedule, like he did in the last TD pass to Uzomah.
3.) He's inexperienced, so think how good he will be at 1 and 2 with a few more years under his belt.
4.) He's a natural leader, who inspires his teammates. This will also get better as time goes on and he is actually a veteran.
The traits that he has are the difference between being a decent quarterback and being a perennial All-Pro.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - rfaulk34 - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:35 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Can we take a second to talk about how ridiculous passing has become?
Burrow is completing a whopping 72.9% of his throws. I know Steve Young held the record for like 20 years at 70.3% before Drew Brees broke it. Now we have 7 QBs at 70% or better, and Burrow is only 3rd.
Kyler Murray is completing 76.1%...which would be a good free throw percentage in the NBA.
Burrow is also averaging 9.2 yards/attempt, which is also incredible, and would easily lead the league most years I've been alive. Yet Burrow only ranks 4th in that stat, with 5 QBs averaging 9.1 or better.
In passer rating, Burrow is sitting pretty at 113.8, which used to be a staggering number. Montana and Steve Young once held that record at a shade over 112. Now Burrow's number is only good for 7th...which is insane.
15 qualifying QBs are currently sporting a 100 passer rating or better.
-------------------
I'm not trying to cheapen Burrow's accomplishments at all. He still ranks highly and is playing great football. I'm just wondering if the league shifted a little too far towards offense with some of the rule changes through the years.
...and please for the love of God, don't say this is evolution. The stats have been skyrocketing just over the last few years.
I was just looking at stats on PFF about deep, intermediate and short passing for a few different QBs. Most will remember that Burrow was way up at the top in intermediate passing last year, which, they say, is the best indicator of future sustained success.
I think i'm gonna do a breakdown on that later on tonight or in the next couple days. A couple things stood out to me about intermediate passing. Mahomes and Herbert are terrible at it this year. Mahomes deep passing was ok, intermediate was terrible and short passing was good off the charts.
More to come...
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - rfaulk34 - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:52 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: I agree with you Shake. I personally would like to see something that gives a bump to defensive play. Maybe extend the physical contact to first 10 yards instead of 5? Genuinely have no idea. I enjoy a more offensive oriented football but a strong defense can be enjoyable as well.
That being said, I do expect these numbers to even out as the season goes on.
The number will even out by the end of the year, but they are slowly trending up, year after year.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - grampahol - 10-04-2021
It's not all QB talent. The guys catching the ball have a say in a QB rating as well as do offensive lines. QBR means nothing if the QB is laying in a hospital bed getting his knee reconstructed.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - KillerGoose - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 05:32 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: The number will even out by the end of the year, but they are slowly trending up, year after year.
This is also true. A buddy of mine mentioned getting rid of the automatic first down rules, at least on 5 yard penalties. Could be something to look at as well.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - rfaulk34 - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 05:41 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: This is also true. A buddy of mine mentioned getting rid of the automatic first down rules, at least on 5 yard penalties. Could be something to look at as well.
I was thinking that exact same thing while watching a game last week.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - rfaulk34 - 10-04-2021
Just for shitz and gigglz, Burrow threw an uncharacteristic 3 picks (in a row) against Chicago and he stands at 9 tds and 4 ints. Give him only 2 ints without adding anything more in and he leads the NFL with a 121.6 rating.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - J24 - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 05:41 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: This is also true. A buddy of mine mentioned getting rid of the automatic first down rules, at least on 5 yard penalties. Could be something to look at as well.
(10-04-2021, 05:54 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I was thinking that exact same thing while watching a game last week.
That or why not make every offensive foul a lost of down penalty ? Specifically holding and OPI.
Also while we're on this subject. Why are QBs allowed to throw the Ball when the defense has them in the grasp? That rule needs to change ASAP!
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - Bryan - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:35 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Can we take a second to talk about how ridiculous passing has become?Ken Anderson held that record for 27 years before Brees broke it
Burrow is completing a whopping 72.9% of his throws. I know Steve Young held the record for like 20 years at 70.3% before Drew Brees broke it. Now we have 7 QBs at 70% or better, and Burrow is only 3rd.
Kyler Murray is completing 76.1%...which would be a good free throw percentage in the NBA.
Burrow is also averaging 9.2 yards/attempt, which is also incredible, and would easily lead the league most years I've been alive. Yet Burrow only ranks 4th in that stat, with 5 QBs averaging 9.1 or better.
In passer rating, Burrow is sitting pretty at 113.8, which used to be a staggering number. Montana and Steve Young once held that record at a shade over 112. Now Burrow's number is only good for 7th...which is insane.
15 qualifying QBs are currently sporting a 100 passer rating or better.
-------------------
I'm not trying to cheapen Burrow's accomplishments at all. He still ranks highly and is playing great football. I'm just wondering if the league shifted a little too far towards offense with some of the rule changes through the years.
...and please for the love of God, don't say this is evolution. The stats have been skyrocketing just over the last few years.
RE: Burrow has been amazing, but... - Wyche'sWarrior - 10-04-2021
(10-04-2021, 04:57 PM)Joelist Wrote: I do agree it has gotten too easy for passing. In the Pats - Bucs game they even noted some routes that because of the rules are undefendable. I would support extending physical contact to 10 or even 15 yards to allow the old style "bump and cover" defenses to be used again.
Ah yes, the ol bump and run. Bring it back, to bring some semblance of pass coverage while still minimizing head injuries.