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Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - jj22 - 06-03-2022
2021 leaders weren't making threats to Mike Brown mid season during a dominant start....
https://www.cincyjungle.com/2022/6/3/23152489/andrew-whitworth-threatened-to-leave-bengals-2015-letter-mike-brown
Quote:n the offseason leading up to the 2015 season, Andrew Whitworth wanted assurances from the Cincinnati Bengals.
He expressed such concerns to management leading up to the NFL Draft, as he explained on The Pivot Podcast, and what he got in return was the team drafting two offensive tackles (Cedric Ogbuehi, Jake Fisher) in the first two rounds of the NFL Draft.
Whitworth, who was entering the last year of his contract, was not pleased, but he also didn’t make a mess of the situation. Instead, he put pen to paper and wrote team owner Mike Brown a letter during the start of the season.
“About mid-season next year [2015], I wrote Mike Brown a letter, and I said look, I’ve reached a point where I’m frustrated. We’re having an awesome start to our season and the only thing I can think about is that for 10 years I’ve done what I’ve done for you, being the leader you needed and a captain and all this stuff, and now I’m at a point where I’m begging you to treat me right. You have the choice to make the decision you made. But I got the choice to and my choice is, at our bye week, I’ll have made enough money to pay you back a prorated part of my contract. And I walk away and I don’t have to think about this anymore. Or you can do the right thing and take care of me the way you should.”
Whitworth’s letter was more than just a plea to Brown, it was a threat to leave altogether. And that threat is what earned him the one-year extension he signed during that season.
“And basically his response to my letter was, here’s a one-year extension for around the number you signed your last extension for and if you want it, I think you’re correct and you deserve that opportunity. So it took me a minute. And I went back to him and I respected that one. He was honest with me from the front. And then to that he was willing to admit like, you know what, I probably didn’t handle it the best way and you definitely deserve that opportunity. And so I signed the one year extension, mainly because my family needed it and it was what’s best for us. And so I did it.”
It’s wild to think that in the midst of the Bengals’ 8-0 start to 2015, one of their best players and their biggest leader was planning on leaving the team. But that was how upset Whitworth was at the situation. At the time, the 33-year-old left tackle was coming off his highest-graded season in 2014 per Pro Football Focus, but the front office truly believed he wasn’t going to provide them any more value beyond 2015.
They didn’t make it to October of that year before caving to Whitworth’s demands; you’d think they realized how wrong they were.
But they did eventually stick to their guns after that contract expired in 2017. Whitworth moved on to the Los Angeles Rams, and Ogbuehi and Fisher quickly proved they weren’t up to the challenge in replacing him.
Much respect goes out to Whitworth for the way he handled the situation when he was in his right to make it worse, and to his point, Brown deserves at least some credit for giving Whitworth another year. The situation will never sit right with the future Hall of Fame tackle, but this silver lining should make things a bit easier for fans.
First you can work to mid season and retire with enough to pay the prorated signing bonus back.... Then you sign a one year extension for the same pay because your family needed it?
He was proud of this story tho. His play did drop off and maybe this is why most fans thought he was done.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - KillerGoose - 06-04-2022
(06-03-2022, 08:45 PM)jj22 Wrote: 2021 leaders weren't making threats to Mike Brown mid season during a dominant start....
https://www.cincyjungle.com/2022/6/3/23152489/andrew-whitworth-threatened-to-leave-bengals-2015-letter-mike-brown
First you can work to mid season and retire with enough to pay the prorated signing bonus back.... Then you sign a one year extension for the same pay because your family needed it?
He was proud of this story tho. His play did drop off and maybe this is why most fans thought he was done.
I would argue that his play had not dropped off. It was a fairly normal season for Whitworth. Combing through his career data via PFF, I have that as his seventh best season, but comparing him to league peers he was borderline elite at worst.
Maybe my perspective is off base here, but I don't really have an issue with this. This doesn't come across as much different than a normal business conversation. I think the corporate/normal workforce equivalent would be "Give me a raise, or I am leaving." I've known plenty of people to have those types of conversations, including myself. He was a high level producer asking for an extension. If he wasn't going to get it, he was going to walk. That would frustrate me as a fan, but man, football is a job at the end of the day. If I look at like that instead of this awesome sport with all of the fun adjectives I can think of, it doesn't strike me as a big deal.
Also, one last thing - I agree that no one in the locker room was probably doing anything like this. However, it is worth noting that we are just now hearing about this....seven years later. We never really know what is happening in that locker room.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - Sled21 - 06-04-2022
I don't think what Bates did last season is all that different. He dogged it half the season because he was mad he didn't get his multi year deal done.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - J24 - 06-04-2022
Whit was right and I don't recall it being a major problem at that time. Also Daltons thumb injury cost us a Championship that year.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - Sled21 - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:07 AM)J24 Wrote: Whit was right and I don't recall it being a major problem at that time. Also Daltons thumb injury cost us a Championship that year.
Whit was right in his thinking that he was still playing at a high level. The Bengals were right in their thinking that he was at the age where players would normally go into a freefall and drop off. Whit beat the odds, he was an outlier.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - bfine32 - 06-04-2022
Now that's how an adult handles a situation.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - fredtoast - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:32 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Now that's how an adult handles a situation.
Yep, Mike showed he was the bigger man the way he dealt with a player threatening to quit in the middle of a contract he signed.
Too bad Mike didn't have more control of the Dunlap situation. Carlos wanted to play and help the team while Whit wanted to quit and hurt the team.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - J24 - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:12 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Whit was right in his thinking that he was still playing at a high level. The Bengals were right in their thinking that he was at the age where players would normally go into a freefall and drop off. Whit beat the odds, he was an outlier.
The front office wasn't right and really screwed the team for years to come because of how badly they handled the situation.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - fredtoast - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:54 AM)J24 Wrote: The front office wasn't right and really screwed the team for years to come because of how badly they handled the situation.
Most teams would have done the same as the Bengals. People here always complain about Mike Brown being "too loyal" and praise the Patriots for letting a player go "a year too early" instead of "a year too late". Then they do a 180 spin and complain about Mike Brown not being loyal enough.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - Frank Booth - 06-04-2022
*cough* Jessie Bates
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - jj22 - 06-04-2022
Jessie might have worked through some mental issues while playing. He didn't work through mental issues while playing AND send a letter to MB threatening to quit in the middle of an 8-0 start like Whit. After 8 games our record wasn't nearly as good as the 2015 record. Whit thought that was a great time to be pressuring MB. That should have been his agent's job at that point of the year. Just my opinion. Or at least if you are going to be focused on that instead of closing out what looked to be an exceptional season, don't sign a one year deal for the same amount after claiming you can quit with enough to pay back the prorated signing bonus. He would have done better finishing off the season strong and getting tagged, or the long term deal he wanted elsewhere.... MB definitely got the better of him. Which you hate to see from a player supposedly calling his shot.
I think that was lame for him to make threats mid season and get nothing really out of it. But Whit clearly has/had some financial issues (Maybe why he's played so long).
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - fredtoast - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 12:11 PM)jj22 Wrote: Jessie might have worked through some mental issues while playing. He didn't work through mental issues while playing AND send a letter to MB threatening to quit in the middle of an 8-0 start like Whit.
We have no idea what was communicated by Bates to Brown.
Just like none of us knew about the letter Whit wrote to Mike Brown.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - fredtoast - 06-04-2022
Threatening to quit in the middle of the season is even more cowardly than holding out. When a player holds out he allows the team to make moves to accommodate for his absence. But to just quit in the middle of the season really screws the entire team.
I am actually kind of shocked that Whit did this
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - KillerGoose - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 12:11 PM)jj22 Wrote: But Whit clearly has/had some financial issues (Maybe why he's played so long).
This is a massive assumption based off of one comment from a man who has made over $87m in his career. I feel safe that he didn't genuinely mean his family "needed it". Lol.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - bfine32 - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:42 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Yep, Mike showed he was the bigger man the way he dealt with a player threatening to quit in the middle of a contract he signed.
Too bad Mike didn't have more control of the Dunlap situation. Carlos wanted to play and help the team while Whit wanted to quit and hurt the team.
![[Image: Please-just-stop-Stop-Meme.jpg]](https://www.tech-mag.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Please-just-stop-Stop-Meme.jpg)
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:06 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I don't think what Bates did last season is all that different. He dogged it half the season because he was mad he didn't get his multi year deal done.
Thinking the same, very similar except Whit played better lol
(06-04-2022, 10:07 AM)J24 Wrote: Whit was right and I don't recall it being a major problem at that time. Also Daltons thumb injury cost us a Championship that year.
Truth, the Dalton thumb injury I think at the very least cost us a Playoff win over the Steelers.
Still believe we win that game if we had Dalton instead of McCarron.
Oh well, spilt milk.
(06-04-2022, 10:12 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Whit was right in his thinking that he was still playing at a high level. The Bengals were right in their thinking that he was at the age where players would normally go into a freefall and drop off. Whit beat the odds, he was an outlier.
More truth. Whit is special, most OL fall off a cliff at that age. Shows how good of shape he keeps in through hard work.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - rfaulk34 - 06-04-2022
![[Image: and-so-it-begins.jpg]](https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/56900955/and-so-it-begins.jpg)
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:54 AM)J24 Wrote: The front office wasn't right and really screwed the team for years to come because of how badly they handled the situation.
For sure, destroyed us not bringing back Whit but who knew he had THAT much left in the tank?
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - Sled21 - 06-04-2022
(06-04-2022, 10:42 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Yep, Mike showed he was the bigger man the way he dealt with a player threatening to quit in the middle of a contract he signed.
Too bad Mike didn't have more control of the Dunlap situation. Carlos wanted to play and help the team while Whit wanted to quit and hurt the team.
Whit played within the system that the team was using. Dunlap just wanted to freelance and rush the passer on every play.
RE: Difference between 2015 team and 2021 team? - puddycat - 06-04-2022
What a player threatens to do to the front office is almost completely divorced from what they do on the field. Whitworth had never hit free agency without signing an extension until that last 1 year extension with the Bengals. He valued the security and the Bengals didn't want to give it to him. As the Bengals now know, a player without a future contract might have great contract year play, and might have insecure unfocused play. Every player is different.
Whitworth didn't mail it in his last year in Cincinnati. The Bengals got exactly what they wanted, and what they deserved. The Rams signed the 4th highest contract for an LT the 2017 offseason(about 10th highest LT per year overall) and got an All-Pro. Get over it.