The major monkey wrench in the plan

[samhain]

I feel like on either side of the so called "Civil War", the expected path in the draft is largely the same. People who want Chase usually want an OL in 2. People who want Sewell want a receiver in 2. It has to be a WR and a OL in the first 2 rounds, the only x-factor is in what order.

It seems that as we near the draft, the possibility of a highly regarded pass rusher slipping to us in 2 grows. Rousseau was once the guy that many thought was number 1 in terms of the position. Now he's in apparent free fall. Paye is dropping a bit, too. Wrs like Marshall are rising. A run on OL is expected. There are only so many slots.

What do you do if you're sitting there with the 5th pick in round 2 and one of these guys is still out there?

[Gdale_Bengal]

(04-02-2021, 08:06 PM)samhain Wrote: I feel like on either side of the so called "Civil War", the expected path in the draft is largely the same. People who want Chase usually want an OL in 2. People who want Sewell want a receiver in 2. It has to be a WR and a OL in the first 2 rounds, the only x-factor is in what order.

It seems that as we near the draft, the possibility of a highly regarded pass rusher slipping to us in 2 grows. Rousseau was once the guy that many thought was number 1 in terms of the position. Now he's in apparent free fall. Paye is dropping a bit, too. Wrs like Marshall are rising. A run on OL is expected. There are only so many slots.

What do you do if you're sitting there with the 5th pick in round 2 and one of these guys is still out there?

You trust your big board and draft appropriately

[NATI BENGALS]

Considering we just signed our 4th DE the other day and it is Amani Bledsoe I think you... trade back in 1 so we have more early picks and fill all our needs with top prospects

[Burma]

Personally? I laugh manically as I turn in the card for Quinn Meinerz.

As a team I hope they stick to a BPA influenced by need approach. Ideally with Quinn Meinerz BPA

[BURROWorBUST]

If we go Sewell at 5, I'm not opposed to going Wyatt Davis, or Tucker (USC), or Dickerson at 38. Building a dominant OLine would be a good thing, would it not?

I remain on team Chase only because Malik Wright has reported that the Bengals won't consider taking Pitts. He could be wrong and I hope he is, but I am not going to be mad if we take Sewell. I just don't think it means that we then have to go WR in 2. Going all in on the Oline would be fine with me,

[Burma]

(04-02-2021, 10:26 PM)BURROWorBUST Wrote: If we go Sewell at 5, I'm not opposed to going Wyatt Davis, or Tucker (USC), or Dickerson at 38. Building a dominant OLine would be a good thing, would it not?

I remain on team Chase only because Malik Wright has reported that the Bengals won't consider taking Pitts. He could be wrong and I hope he is, but I am not going to be mad if we take Sewell. I just don't think it means that we then have to go WR in 2.  Going all in on the Oline would be fine with me,

Tucker would be awesome as well if he is there.  Dickerson I really like but that injury history worries me.

As to Chase, we should all be mad at the Bengals for putting themselves in this situation due to the Oline. Any other year and I would beyond stoked to have a chance to grap Chase.

[samhain]

(04-02-2021, 10:41 PM)Burma Wrote: Tucker would be awesome as well if he is there.  Dickerson I really like but that injury history worries me.

As to Chase, we should all be mad at the Bengals for putting themselves in this situation due to the Oline. Any other year and I would beyond stoked to have a chance to grap Chase.

I'm still stoked at the chance to get him or either of the other 2 of the big 3.  I'm pissed that the team is still sitting there with a decent bit of cap with no FA guard additions other than Spain.  Honestly, the team needed an established vet guard more than a rookie.  A rookie is a potential liability on the line, as it's probably as tough a position as any to adjust to for kids making the jump.  Dealing with grown NFL man strength versus college strength is an adjustment, even for a prospect that wil eventually be very good.  They messed up by not stepping up an paying an established OG.  

[Essex Johnson]

(04-02-2021, 10:41 PM)Burma Wrote: Tucker would be awesome as well if he is there.  Dickerson I really like but that injury history worries me.

As to Chase, we should all be mad at the Bengals for putting themselves in this situation due to the Oline. Any other year and I would beyond stoked to have a chance to grap Chase.

but why mad.. an exceptional tackle is more important than an exceptional wr, since there are fewer of them plus #1 Wrs are becoming very watered down with the spread offense more and more plus  RPO's are becoming more and more common in NFL this has created a throw the ball around mentality and the old true #1s are not as valued as before.  This also has emphasised the tackle position even more with the increase in passing, just look at Top End FA tackles are commanding...

[samhain]

(04-02-2021, 08:53 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Considering we just signed our 4th DE the other day and it is Amani Bledsoe I think you... trade back in 1 so we have more early picks and fill all our needs with top prospects

If we could trade with Carolina and get 2 seconds AND have one of Chase, Sewell, or Pitts fall to us, then I'd be all over that.  I love the idea of 3 picks in the first 2 rounds.  I do not love losing a shot at one of the big 3.  Every draft has really enticing prospects like them, but you rarely are in a position to get one.  We need to get one.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-02-2021, 11:44 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: but why mad.. an exceptional tackle is more important than an exceptional wr, since there are fewer of them plus #1 Wrs are becoming very watered down with the spread offense more and more plus  RPO's are becoming more and more common in NFL this has created a throw the ball around mentality and the old true #1s are not as valued as before. This also has emphasised the tackle position even more with the increase in passing, just look at Top End FA tackles are commanding...

The bold is not even remotely true. Look at the overpay the Giants just gave Kenny Golladay ($72 million for 4 years).

Top 5 WR salaries (per spotrac)

DeAndre Hopkins - $27,250,000
Julio Jones - $22,000,000
Keenan Allen - $20,025,000
Amari Cooper - $20,000,000
Michael Thomas - $19,250,000

Top 5 OT’s:

Trent Williams - $23,010,000
David Bakhitari - $23,000,000
Larry Tunsil - $22,000,000
Ronnie Stanley - $19,750,000
Kolton Miller - $18,005,000

Certainly seems like they’re still highly “valued” to me.

[WVUHomer]

(04-03-2021, 12:09 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: The bold is not even remotely true. Look at the overpay the Giants just gave Kenny Golladay ($72 million for 4 years).

Top 5 WR salaries (per spotrac)

DeAndre Hopkins - $27,250,000
Julio Jones - $22,000,000
Keenan Allen - $20,025,000
Amari Cooper - $20,000,000
Michael Thomas - $19,250,000

Top 5 OT’s:

Trent Williams - $23,010,000
David Bakhitari - $23,000,000
Larry Tunsil - $22,000,000
Ronnie Stanley - $19,750,000
Kolton Miller - $18,005,000

Certainly seems like they’re still highly “valued” to me.

While I'm team Chase for argument point but this seems to contradict that argument.

1 WR from top 5 on a play off team while you have 2 OTs with at least 2 if not the 3 remaining that be on playoff contenders (leaning towards Hou being an outlier year).

[pulses]

(04-02-2021, 10:26 PM)BURROWorBUST Wrote: If we go Sewell at 5, I'm not opposed to going Wyatt Davis, or Tucker (USC), or Dickerson at 38. Building a dominant OLine would be a good thing, would it not?

I remain on team Chase only because Malik Wright has reported that the Bengals won't consider taking Pitts. He could be wrong and I hope he is, but I am not going to be mad if we take Sewell. I just don't think it means that we then have to go WR in 2.  Going all in on the Oline would be fine with me,

Who are you comfortable with in round 3 at WR if it goes down like that? and please don't say Schwartz!!

[Essex Johnson]

(04-03-2021, 12:09 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: The bold is not even remotely true. Look at the overpay the Giants just gave Kenny Golladay ($72 million for 4 years).

Top 5 WR salaries (per spotrac)

DeAndre Hopkins - $27,250,000
Julio Jones - $22,000,000
Keenan Allen - $20,025,000
Amari Cooper - $20,000,000
Michael Thomas - $19,250,000

Top 5 OT’s:

Trent Williams - $23,010,000
David Bakhitari - $23,000,000
Larry Tunsil - $22,000,000
Ronnie Stanley - $19,750,000
Kolton Miller - $18,005,000

Certainly seems like they’re still highly “valued” to me.

I never said they were not highly valued  but when you compare the importance across the board, Oline have been rising even more in recent years. I read where in 2018 there were more Olineman (27) making over 10 million than Wrs (18). and as I stated in my post, and tackles value has been moving up with the changing of the game who knows maybe in the next decade top tackles will be above top WRs ,

[BURROWorBUST]

(04-03-2021, 12:01 PM)pulses Wrote: Who are you comfortable with in round 3 at WR if it goes down like that? and please don't say Schwartz!!

Yeah, not Schwartz. Best value in 3 for us at that point would probably be a DLine/Edge guy. Maybe Milton Williams or one of the guys from Pitt (Jones or Weaver). We could also triple dip for the OLine and take Q. Meinerz. 

There are some WRs who'll be there in 4 or 5 that intrigue me. Tamorrion Terry from Florida State is one of them. And the kid from Iowa – Ihmir Smith-Marsette.  They could be sleepers. You never know.

[pulses]

(04-03-2021, 04:17 PM)BURROWorBUST Wrote: Yeah, not Schwartz. Best value in 3 for us at that point would probably be a DLine/Edge guy. Maybe Milton Williams or one of the guys from Pitt (Jones or Weaver). We could also triple dip for the OLine and take Q. Meinerz. 

There are some WRs who'll be there in 4 or 5 that intrigue me. Tamorrion Terry from Florida State is one of them. And the kid from Iowa – Ihmir Smith-Marsette.  They could be sleepers. You never know.

Yeah I was asking specifically for WR's at that point.  People forget we lost AJ and Erickson and Ross and have signed NOBODY to replace them. We're going to double dip at WR most likely and they're not gonna wait till the 5th to find a 3rd WR to start.

[*rfaulk34*]

(04-02-2021, 08:06 PM)samhain Wrote: I feel like on either side of the so called "Civil War", the expected path in the draft is largely the same.  People who want Chase usually want an OL in 2.  People who want Sewell want a receiver in 2.  It has to be a WR and a OL in the first 2 rounds, the only x-factor is in what order.

It seems that as we near the draft, the possibility of a highly regarded pass rusher slipping to us in 2 grows.  Rousseau was once the guy that many thought was number 1 in terms of the position.  Now he's in apparent free fall.  Paye is dropping a bit, too.  Wrs like Marshall are rising.  A run on OL is expected.  There are only so many slots.  

What do you do if you're sitting there with the 5th pick in round 2 and one of these guys is still out there?

Pass on them and take whichever you didn't take in rd1. WR1, OL2. OL1, WR2. Those two areas are above ED and DL in WAR. 

[J24]

(04-04-2021, 12:08 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Pass on them and take whichever you didn't take in rd1. WR1, OL2. OL1, WR2. Those two areas are above ED and DL in WAR. 

Really? Definitely would have thought Edge and a 3T would be ahead of Wr2 and OL2. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(04-04-2021, 07:25 PM)J24 Wrote: Really? Definitely would have thought Edge and a 3T would be ahead of Wr2 and OL2. 

Bengals have 2 WRs and 2 starting EDs. At least 1 OL is needed and 2 would be optimal. I would assume they view LO as the #1 3T. 

I wouldn't touch the D until the 5th round. I'd be looking for 1WR, 2OL and a TE before i looked anywhere else. 

[*bengalfan74*]

(04-04-2021, 07:34 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Bengals have 2 WRs and 2 starting EDs. At least 1 OL is needed and 2 would be optimal. I would assume they view LO as the #1 3T. 

I wouldn't touch the D until the 5th round. I'd be looking for 1WR, 2OL and a TE before i looked anywhere else. 

Sure hoping this is an offense heavy draft. We were awful in the red zone last season and that has to change.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-02-2021, 08:06 PM)samhain Wrote: I feel like on either side of the so called "Civil War", the expected path in the draft is largely the same.  People who want Chase usually want an OL in 2.  People who want Sewell want a receiver in 2.  It has to be a WR and a OL in the first 2 rounds, the only x-factor is in what order.

It seems that as we near the draft, the possibility of a highly regarded pass rusher slipping to us in 2 grows.  Rousseau was once the guy that many thought was number 1 in terms of the position.  Now he's in apparent free fall.  Paye is dropping a bit, too.  Wrs like Marshall are rising.  A run on OL is expected.  There are only so many slots.  

What do you do if you're sitting there with the 5th pick in round 2 and one of these guys is still out there?

Or you are like me with no wrench because you think that by sheer value available in the top of the 2nd round, OL needs to be the pick in the 2nd round regardless of who is chosen in the 1st round.

In no particular order... Hill, Jenkins, Dickerson, Davis, Hudson, Mayfield, T Smith, Cosmi, Eichenburg, and S Brown... are all 2nd round guys where a couple of them probably could have been 1st round guys in a less deep draft. I would much rather grab another OL with a value pick than take a WR off need just because they're the next best guy available.

Honestly I would then trade up with my 3rd to the end of the 2nd and take another one of those guys, too.

Sewell
OL
(trade up to end of 2nd) OL 

Is my ideal draft this year. If Sewell is gone and Chase is the pick, I wouldn't be upset over Chase/OL/OL, but if Sewell is there, he should be the pick.


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Not really important for the spirit of the thread, but just as an aside, the Bengals have the 6th pick in the 2nd round, not the 5th.