For Team Sewell

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 11:12 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: Whitworth went from tackle (in college) to Guard and back to tackle (in the NFL).

Sure did, and Odgen as well.  Those are two of the best to play the game.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but it's going to take some adjustment.  It's not just a slide the guy in at OG and he'll be comfortable.  It's a different game.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-03-2021, 11:07 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Maybe because Pollack said it?   He said it's going to take some work, things come faster on the inside.  

I'm sorry, but it's tough enough to come in and start in the NFL, to switch positions on the line is going to make it a little harder.

I think he can get it done, but we've seen this before,.

Pollack did not say Carman wouldn’t be ready to start day one. Don’t make things up.

[CKwi88]

I was content with either, though I leaned Sewell.

Much like all drafts, time will tell. I was thrilled when we went O-Line back to back with Ogbuehi and Fisher. Now you can look to the 2015 draft as one that set the franchise back 5 years.

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 11:19 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Pollack did not say Carman wouldn’t be ready to start day one. Don’t make things up.

Your're right.  He said he would have to make adjustments, learn how to handle those things and he could compete for a starting job.

"Well, the action is going to happen a lot faster when you go inside. He's going to have to take on guys sooner, a little quicker — he's not going to have the time and space he's used to working with. He's going to have to anchor a lot faster. He's going to be dealing with a little more powerful, stronger players inside. He's shown to have all the strengths to be able to make that transition."

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 11:14 AM)impactplaya Wrote: Its funny how the Sewell fan club was ok with moving Sewell
To OG if need be but when it comes to.Carnen all of a sudden
Its a issue with that.
All the people banging the table for Sewell kept.on.saying he
Has to be the choice, yet.they never have a reason(s)
Specifically why it had to be him other because
Thats what the "experts"

I was never in the camp that Sewell would play OG.  He would have kicked one of the other guys inside.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-03-2021, 11:25 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Your're right.  He said he would have to make adjustments, learn how to handle those things and he could compete for a starting job.

"Well, the action is going to happen a lot faster when you go inside. He's going to have to take on guys sooner, a little quicker — he's not going to have the time and space he's used to working with. He's going to have to anchor a lot faster. He's going to be dealing with a little more powerful, stronger players inside. He's shown to have all the strengths to be able to make that transition."

Right, so not sure why Benton keeps presenting it as fact that Carman won’t be ready to start at OG. It’s very, very likely he’s the staring RG week one.

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 11:27 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Right, so not sure why Benton keeps presenting it as fact that Carman won’t be ready to start at OG. It’s very, very likely he’s the staring RG week one.

And I think that's a problem.  

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-03-2021, 11:26 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I was never in the camp that Sewell would play OG.  He would have kicked one of the other guys inside.

Which would not have been ideal in a division with TJ Watt and Myles Garrett. Sewell has never went up against guys like that. At least Jonah had the SEC experience, and was a little older before being thrown into the fire against top tier pass rushers. With all of Reiff’s experience, I would have definitely kicked Sewell inside for his first year.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-03-2021, 11:28 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: And I think that's a problem.  

I don’t. He’s built perfectly to play OG, and he’s best against strength and power. Not to mention he’s going to help out in the running big time at RG. He’s a better run blocker than he is at pass protection at this point.

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 11:35 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I don’t. He’s built perfectly to play OG, and he’s best against strength and power. Not to mention he’s going to help out in the running big time at RG. He’s a better run blocker than he is at pass protection at this point.

Zero experience at OG.  

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-03-2021, 12:11 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Zero experience at OG.  

And?

“He’s an AFC North physical, powerful offensive lineman who is very athletic,” director of college scouting Mike Potts said. “The way this division is set up, this is a physical line of scrimmage division. He’s got a lot of things going for him. He’s a tackle with guard flexibility. He’s extremely intelligent. People say, ‘You’ve never seen him play guard.’ But with all the research we did on him, we know he’s smart enough to do it.”

[*Synric*]

(05-03-2021, 12:11 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: Zero experience at OG.  

Alot of the Tackles will become Guards that's the way it works. As for Carman Clemson cross trains all of their linemen so hes had practice reps at both tackle and both guard spots.

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 12:40 PM)Synric Wrote: Alot of the Tackles will become Guards that's the way it works. As for Carman Clemson cross trains all of their linemen so hes had practice reps at both tackle and both guard spots.

I get it.  I'm hoping for the best.  

This pick was considered a reach by a lot of people.  I just hope that our gamble of not picking up any legit OG in free agency doesn't come back to haunt us.

I feel like we are ok at T when Jonah misses games, but I'm still very concerned about Hopkins and his ACL as well as the general ability of the OGs we have on the roster right now.  I hope it plays out ok, but it's a pretty big gamble.

[Beaker]

(05-03-2021, 11:28 AM)Hammerstripes Wrote: And I think that's a problem.  

Willie Anderson doesn't think its a problem. In fact, he recommended Carman to the Bengals. If big Willie is high on the kid, Im ok with the pick.

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 01:17 PM)Beaker Wrote: Willie Anderson doesn't think its a problem. In fact, he recommended Carman to the Bengals. If big Willie is high on the kid, Im ok with the pick.

When i mean that it's a problem, I'm saying any rookie switching positions and starting in the NFL is a problem.  I don't doubt he's going to be pretty good at some point, but I'll be worried if he's the starter day 1.

[*Synric*]

(05-03-2021, 01:16 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I get it.  I'm hoping for the best.  

This pick was considered a reach by a lot of people.  I just hope that our gamble of not picking up any legit OG in free agency doesn't come back to haunt us.

I feel like we are ok at T when Jonah misses games, but I'm still very concerned about Hopkins and his ACL as well as the general ability of the OGs we have on the roster right now.  I hope it plays out ok, but it's a pretty big gamble.

To me he wasnt a reach. I had Jackson as a mid to late second and actually took him in the Bengsls board mock at #69. I had him as someone that slipped out of the second round and said as much.

[SErebel11]

(05-03-2021, 01:17 PM)Beaker Wrote: Willie Anderson doesn't think its a problem. In fact, he recommended Carman to the Bengals. If big Willie is high on the kid, Im ok with the pick.

Bengals' great makes clear passing on Penei Sewell would be mistake (fansided.com)

Former Cincinnati Bengals Great Cris Collinsworth Gives His Thoughts on Penei Sewell and Ja'Marr Chase Debate - Sports Illustrated Cincinnati Bengals News, Analysis and More

This is actually something else Willie Anderson said.

The fact is there have been some recent darling OL targets .... Dalton Risner and Cody Ford both come to mind that have transitioned to G. Risner has been a below average guard ( a decent pass protector) and Ford has struggled in both run and pass blocking. I think most people here would have each of those rated a touch higher than Jackson Carman coming out of college. It is definitely no sure thing that Carman is plug and play. I am definitely not rooting against the kid but the likeliness of him being better than both the current starting guards in year one is not in his favor historically.

[Whatever]

(05-03-2021, 12:54 AM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Still feels like they did punt on several till next year though.

We have a sort of LT... and a one year rental RT. 

I get that Jonah might still develop but at this point we have to really be considering the possibility that he is made of glass and will be broken every year like Eifert.

At RT, Reiff is here this year and if he plays at a high level, the bidding war begins. Maybe we re-sign him but that's at best a 50/50 chance. 

The only guy we got for tackle is a project that had much lower competition level then Sewell, comes with his own medical red flags (missed two seasons) and is far from a sure thing.

We have a very real possibility that the 2022 OL has zero tackles. I'd be okay with a step down from Chase at X for a season, knowing that we had a tackle on the team that was going to hold down one of the two spots long term. 

That is and will always be my issue with this draft. Now, maybe Jonah proves me wrong and magically gets off the IR and plays at a high level, and Reiff at age 32 coming off a foot injury locks down RT and re-signs and bam... problem is solved. If those two things happen then the Chase pick is fine but that is huge gamble to take when you literally had the guaranteed solution available.

And the biggest thing is this, the Bengals shouldn't be drafting like 2021 is a playoff year. Taylor is still here, Lou is still here, this team is probably a 7 win team. Which is half a game enough to ruin my bet. If you know you are going to rebuild and be down, get the tackle, groom him and get him ready, then hit the 2022 draft with the need of a X and not the need on the line still.

I get why people are concerned with Jonah, but I am personally not.  He came in with a shoulder issue that he played through at Alabama that they decided to get fixed.  Last year, he got rolled up on from behind while engaged with a defender, which sucks, but happens.  When it shook out, he was hurt nowhere near as badly as it looked.  If he was having similar injuries over and over that were ending his season, I would worry, but they're unrelated.

Reiff has never missed more than 3 games in a season.  I'm not terribly concerned about him staying healthy.

If we're talking injury history, it's also fair to point out that Sewell missed 6 games with injury as a freshman.  If Sewell gets rolled up on the way Jonah did last year, he's going to miss time, too.

Jmo, but I didn't see Sewell as a guaranteed fix.  He has tremendous upside and I wouldn't have quibbled if he was the pick, but I think he's more boom/bust than a lot of others do.  He's a guy that I can see Jonathan Ogden as his ceiling, but DJ Fluker as his floor.  Some work ethic concerns were raised and he is a guy that has always been far more naturally gifted than the guy across from him.  I have to question what happens now that he's going to playing guys he can't just handle with natural talent.  Will he double down and put in the work or will he have his confidence shattered when he has his welcome to the NFL moment?  

I don't think the Bengals were in a position to punt on this year.  You don't want to waste a year of Burrow's rookie deal and you don't want to be forced to give Zac another year because you wrote the year off to rebuilding if he isn't the guy.  Honestly looking at it, while there are a couple of holes, the starting lineup looks pretty solid and could compete for a playoff spot if they can avoid injuries in some of their thinner position groups(WR, LB).  

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

None of this is an issue if the Bengals don't just sit there with their thumbs up their asses in FA with $26m in cap space. You grab one of Corey Linsley, Joe Thuney, or even a Kevin Zeitler/Matt Feiler to go with your one year rental of Reiff and all of a sudden it feels less dire. Not like they didn't have the money for it.

If they had kicked ass on FA OL, I would have been all-in on Team Chase when the draft rolled around. Probably still wouldn't have loved the choice they made for 2nd round OL, but I would have been cheering the Chase pick.

[Hammerstripes]

(05-03-2021, 07:58 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: None of this is an issue if the Bengals don't just sit there with their thumbs up their asses in FA with $26m in cap space. You grab one of Corey Linsley, Joe Thuney, or even a Kevin Zeitler/Matt Feiler to go with your one year rental of Reiff and all of a sudden it feels less dire. Not like they didn't have the money for it.

If they had kicked ass on FA OL, I would have been all-in on Team Chase when the draft rolled around. Probably still wouldn't have loved the choice they made for 2nd round OL, but I would have been cheering the Chase pick.

100% correct.  I was praying that they spent good money on an interior guy so that we wouldn't have to rely on a rookie or last year's guys.  

Contrast that with what the Chargers did to protect Burrow and it's a completely different philosophy.

I do worry about Jonah.  If his shoulder was truly an issue from Bama it would have been operated on immediately.  Instead he re-injured it in camp and was gone for the year.  He also missed time last year with a neck/shoulder issue.  I think it's safe to say that he will miss some time this year.

As for Reiff, he's been durable, but he's in his 30s and the body isn't kind to guys that carry around that amount of mass.

I feel like we will have a very deep line in 2022, but we will need some luck to avoid having to turn to some of these guys too early.