No Go Joe

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(08-17-2021, 05:22 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Palmer suffered a worse injury at a time when surgery wasn't as advanced as it is now, and he played the preseason. Not to mention he suffered the injury much later in the season than Burrow did.

Yeah, I don't get it. He's either healthy and should play.....or they're hiding something.

[*rfaulk34*]

(08-17-2021, 08:33 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Lap said the 2nd game is now the old 3rd game, ie the dress rehearsal, and the 3rd game is now the 4th for evaluating the back end of the roster. I see no reason to throw Burrow into the buzzsaw at Washington while Pollack is still putting together the best 5. Let him get the line  straight, give the starting 5 a week of reps together, then let Burrow play behind them at Miami for a couple of series. Or, don't put him in at all. A quarter of play is not going to make a huge difference either way, and if he were to get hurt in the pre-season this board would lose it's collective crap about why he was in there. I'm fine with sitting him until the Minnesota. Unleash him on Zim.

(08-17-2021, 08:37 AM)Sled21 Wrote: According to Lap, 3 is now 4, 2 is now 3.

I think Lap is just going strictly by 'last preseason game'. If that's the case, it's really dumb. The 2nd preseason game is 3 weeks from the opener. Games 1 and 2 should be for eval and game 3 should still be the dress rehearsal. The rest of the eval can still be done the week before the first real week of practice. 

[Big_Ern]

(08-17-2021, 05:22 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Palmer suffered a worse injury at a time when surgery wasn't as advanced as it is now, and he played the preseason. Not to mention he suffered the injury much later in the season than Burrow did.

I don't think Palmer's was worse. If it was, how so?

[NUGDUKWE]

(08-17-2021, 10:44 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I think Lap is just going strictly by 'last preseason game'. If that's the case, it's really dumb. The 2nd preseason game is 3 weeks from the opener. Games 1 and 2 should be for eval and game 3 should still be the dress rehearsal. The rest of the eval can still be done the week before the first real week of practice. 

Yeah but the old 3rd preseason dress rehearsal was also 3 weeks out of start of the regular season so the 2nd preseason game would time up right. You should have the starters set and give them ample time to work as a unit and the last preseason game to really hammer out the rest of the depth.

[*rfaulk34*]

(08-17-2021, 11:04 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Yeah but the old 3rd preseason dress rehearsal was also 3 weeks out of start of the regular season so the 2nd preseason game would time up right. You should have the starters set and give them ample time to work as a unit and the last preseason game to really hammer out the rest of the depth.

The old 3rd preseason game was the same week as the new 3rd preseason game--2 weeks to the opener. The old 4th preseason game was played on a Thursday, 10 days before the opener. 

[NUGDUKWE]

(08-17-2021, 11:10 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: The old 3rd preseason game was the same week as the new 3rd preseason game--2 weeks to the opener. The old 4th preseason game was played on a Thursday, 10 days before the opener. 

Okay its been a long time since we had preseason I know they had every team play the 4th game the same day I forgot it was Thursday. But I think it still makes sense to have game 2 to be the dress rehearsal. But it hasn't really been defined yet so I guess we'll just see how teams use the 3rd preseason game.

[*rfaulk34*]

(08-17-2021, 11:04 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Yeah but the old 3rd preseason dress rehearsal was also 3 weeks out of start of the regular season so the 2nd preseason game would time up right. You should have the starters set and give them ample time to work as a unit and the last preseason game to really hammer out the rest of the depth.

(08-17-2021, 11:10 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: The old 3rd preseason game was the same week as the new 3rd preseason game--2 weeks to the opener. The old 4th preseason game was played on a Thursday, 10 days before the opener. 

The typical format was,
1st preseason game on Friday, 4 weekends till opener. 
2nd preseason game on Saturday, 3 weekends till opener. 
3rd preseason game on Sunday, 2 weekends till opener. 
4th preseason game on Thursday, 10 days till opener (for all but the opening thursday teams)

There were a couple variations of that during the first 3 weeks if it conflicted with a baseball game, i believe. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(08-17-2021, 11:19 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: Okay its been a long time since we had preseason I know they had every team play the 4th game the same day I forgot it was Thursday. But I think it still makes sense to have game 2 to be the dress rehearsal. But it hasn't really been defined yet so I guess we'll just see how teams use the 3rd preseason game.

My only issue with it being the 2nd game is, it breaks up the "evaluation" games. Before, they would play 2 games with mostly backups, play a 3rd game with mostly starters then a 4th game for guys needing that last push to make a roster. 

If they do the dress rehearsal in the 2nd week now, they have backups week one, starters week 2, backups week 3 and then just a bunch of practices leading up to the week of game #1. 

Two weeks of backups, followed by a week of starters, then about 7 days of practice for the end of roster guys, before they start prepping for Minny, makes more sense to me. 

[Murdock2420]

(08-17-2021, 06:20 PM)Synric Wrote: Fans just want to see Burrow out there on the field healthy. The coaches just want to protect their most valuable asset.

I just want him under center Sept. 12th in the Jungle lighting up the Vikings.

(08-17-2021, 06:56 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: I wouldn't be ok with him getting hurt in preseason and think a little rust or jitters is the lesser of two evils. 

Here's the issue I have with him sitting out all preseason.

I have no clue how many people here have played competitive football at any level but once you play in college even at a division II or III school there is a huge difference between 11 on 11 practice against your teammates and going against another team. It's a totally different feel and a different speed. As a DB, I never went full throttle in practice against my own guys, didn't want to hurt a teammate in practice. Playing against another team, literally do whatever it takes to dislodge the ball.

Right now, there are multiple reports that Burrow is uncomfortable in pocket. He is uncomfortable in a pocket against his own team, when he, you, me and everyone on the planet knows he will not get touched. So, the time for him to try and get comfortable is now like against the Dolphins. They won't be going all out blitz trying to win a game, but he'll be touched and he'll realize he is okay. 

If the Bengals let him sit all preseason, they are painting a huge target on him for week 1. If I'm a coach or player for Minnesota and the kid doesn't play and you know they've seen the same reports about him being uncomfortable in the pocket, he'll end up getting a shot low, early. NFL teams aren't dumb, if they can rattle him, the offense is done. 

So, would you rather him get comfortable in a meaningless game, or watch him get his 1st live snaps week 1 with a defense playing for the win, and going for the kill.  

[Murdock2420]

(08-17-2021, 10:34 PM)Wyche Wrote: Yeah, I don't get it. He's either healthy and should play.....or they're hiding something.

Might be worried about him not being comfortable in the pocket in practice when he knows he can't be touched. Of course, the only solution to that is... game reps. 

Only other reason to keep him out is that he is still hurt.

[Murdock2420]

(08-17-2021, 06:19 PM)Rubekahn29 Wrote: When has this EVER happened? I generally curious

I don't know how many times or how often it happens, but I it happened to Andrew Luck. Ended I think it was 2014 injuried, missed the preseason and was hurt again week 1. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(08-17-2021, 11:43 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Right now, there are multiple reports that Burrow is uncomfortable in pocket. He is uncomfortable in a pocket against his own team, when he, you, me and everyone on the planet knows he will not get touched. So, the time for him to try and get comfortable is now like against the Dolphins. They won't be going all out blitz trying to win a game, but he'll be touched and he'll realize he is okay. 

No there’s not. Those were all from the first week of TC (which he himself admitted), but the difference since then has been night and day. Watch his interview with the guys from NFL Network, where he says he feels fully comfortable in the pocket again (and that has been evident in practice).

[Sled21]

(08-17-2021, 11:43 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Here's the issue I have with him sitting out all preseason.

I have no clue how many people here have played competitive football at any level but once you play in college even at a division II or III school there is a huge difference between 11 on 11 practice against your teammates and going against another team. It's a totally different feel and a different speed. As a DB, I never went full throttle in practice against my own guys, didn't want to hurt a teammate in practice. Playing against another team, literally do whatever it takes to dislodge the ball.

Right now, there are multiple reports that Burrow is uncomfortable in pocket. He is uncomfortable in a pocket against his own team, when he, you, me and everyone on the planet knows he will not get touched. So, the time for him to try and get comfortable is now like against the Dolphins. They won't be going all out blitz trying to win a game, but he'll be touched and he'll realize he is okay. 

If the Bengals let him sit all preseason, they are painting a huge target on him for week 1. If I'm a coach or player for Minnesota and the kid doesn't play and you know they've seen the same reports about him being uncomfortable in the pocket, he'll end up getting a shot low, early. NFL teams aren't dumb, if they can rattle him, the offense is done. 

So, would you rather him get comfortable in a meaningless game, or watch him get his 1st live snaps week 1 with a defense playing for the win, and going for the kill.  

I believe that is the plan and what they've said, reps against the Dolphins. People seem to be losing it because Taylor is not throwing him in against the WFT dline like it's that or nothing.

[Big_Ern]

(08-17-2021, 11:43 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Here's the issue I have with him sitting out all preseason.

I have no clue how many people here have played competitive football at any level but once you play in college even at a division II or III school there is a huge difference between 11 on 11 practice against your teammates and going against another team. It's a totally different feel and a different speed. As a DB, I never went full throttle in practice against my own guys, didn't want to hurt a teammate in practice. Playing against another team, literally do whatever it takes to dislodge the ball.

Right now, there are multiple reports that Burrow is uncomfortable in pocket. He is uncomfortable in a pocket against his own team, when he, you, me and everyone on the planet knows he will not get touched. So, the time for him to try and get comfortable is now like against the Dolphins. They won't be going all out blitz trying to win a game, but he'll be touched and he'll realize he is okay. 

If the Bengals let him sit all preseason, they are painting a huge target on him for week 1. If I'm a coach or player for Minnesota and the kid doesn't play and you know they've seen the same reports about him being uncomfortable in the pocket, he'll end up getting a shot low, early. NFL teams aren't dumb, if they can rattle him, the offense is done. 

So, would you rather him get comfortable in a meaningless game, or watch him get his 1st live snaps week 1 with a defense playing for the win, and going for the kill.  

I don't disagree with your logic but would still take the rust over risk any day.  Also, there is a chance he isn't ready yet and not 100%. If that is the case he should be held out of regular-season games too

[XenoMorph]

(08-18-2021, 08:16 AM)Big_Ern Wrote: I don't disagree with your logic but would still take the rust over risk any day.  Also, there is a chance he isn't ready yet and not 100%. If that is the case he should be held out of regular-season games too

their is a risk to being rusty too.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(08-17-2021, 11:46 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Might be worried about him not being comfortable in the pocket in practice when he knows he can't be touched. Of course, the only solution to that is... game reps. 

Only other reason to keep him out is that he is still hurt.

Pretty much my thoughts.... I'd get him at least a couple series against the Phins. 

[Rubekahn29]

(08-17-2021, 11:53 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I don't know how many times or how often it happens, but I it happened to Andrew Luck. Ended I think it was 2014 injuried, missed the preseason and was hurt again week 1. 

Due to jitters and nerves? Or again due to his poor O-line at the time?

[Rubekahn29]

(08-18-2021, 08:53 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: their is a risk to being rusty too.

Not generally a long-term risk though.

[*Nately120*]

I just hope Burrow isn't hurt or rusty enough that ZT gets another year before we can "find out" what we have in him. If Burrow misses regular season games then we are probably just back to hoping for a higer draft pick and treating 2021 like one giant preseason.

Ok maybe that's a bit melodramatic.

[Wes Mantooth]

(08-17-2021, 11:53 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: I don't know how many times or how often it happens, but I it happened to Andrew Luck. Ended I think it was 2014 injuried, missed the preseason and was hurt again week 1. 

Out of curiousity, I looked it up just to see if I could find it.  I'm not seeing it.

2012 - 16 games played
2013 - 16 games played
2014 - 16 games played
2015 - 7 games played
2016 - 15 games played
2017 - Missed entire season
2018 - 16 games played

At first look, I thought maybe you were referring to 2015.  But he didn't get hurt until week 4.  Up until that point he had never missed a game.  In 2017 he never saw action.  I can't find anywhere where he was held out of the preseason and then got hurt in week 1.

Also, the obvious question is, even if he was hurt in week 1 after sitting out, how can you prove that occurred because he was nervous, or jittery, or rusty, and it wasn't just like every other injury, pure chance?