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They need to resign Bell, Apple, and Hurst if possible. Goodbye to Bates and Pratt, hopefully Dax and ADG can fill in well enough.
FA we should look to retain our guys, and just look for decent depth to bring in for cheap.
Extend Burrow and Wilson. Higgins is probably a no go, I would look to draft a WR early to develop for next season, as we may need to replace Boyd as well.
Hopefully a good pass rush makes it to us at 28.
It's easy to see the world in black and white. Grey? I don't know what to do with grey.
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(01-31-2023, 12:22 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: My main wants:
1. Cut Mixon
Nothing against him, but we just arent a running team. Paying the third most money on the team (12 million) to a guy that barely touches the ball and isn't super effective when he does is asinine. Draft some speed out of the backfield or go pick up a FA for cheap.
2. Find a punter.
Christman was freaking awful on Sunday and field position has been a problem for us all year. I am over it. Either draft one or bring in one in FA. It's a cheap upgrade that can pay huge dividends.
3. Bring these guys back.
Eli Apple, Pratt, Vonn Bell, Perine, Hurst, Flowers. None of these guys will break the bank and have been solid players for us.
4. Upgrade the OL
What happened with injuries in the playoffs was unlucky. The OL was OK this year, but nothing special. Go out and get that elite guy on the OL that we need. Joe goes from a good to best QB on the planet when he has time to throw and is comfortable in the pocket.
5. Find that elite game wrecker on defense
The Chiefs have one in Chris Jones. We need a guy like that on defense. Our defense is solid, but it's missing that one guy that can just wreck a game.
None of these things are huge asks. The Bengals have 44 million in cap space right now - third most in the league. Bates leaving and cutting Mixon would free up another 20 million at least.
Agree with most of what you say,but OL by all means,should be at the top of the list.The one,and only reason,that the AFCCG turned out the way it did is because of the OL.
That game wouldn’t even have been close,had we had an OL as good or better than what Mahomes is playing behind.I re-watched the game on DVR,with quite a few of the plays in slo-mo,and it’s obvious that there were plays there to be had.(Including Ja’Maar Chase open downfield),that never had a chance because of the disastrous play of the OL.
On several occasions Burrow spiked the ball into the ground because the play broke down completely before it ever got started,due to the incompetent play of the OL.
With an Elite OL,comparable to what Mahommes has,this game wouldn’t have even been close.Just go watch the film for yourself,and you’ll see.
I would be willing to trade draft picks,players,or whatever it takes to accomplish this.With an ELITE OL,,,,,this team is unbeatable.
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(01-31-2023, 02:47 PM)ochocincos Wrote: TJ Watt was drafted 30th overall is easily in the Top 5 pass rushers in the NFL.
It's possible to find a really, really good pass rusher late in the 1st round.
OL they don't need a starter, they need good depth guys, which can be found on Day 2.
Not Watt level, but in 3 of the last 4 years there's been at least 1 productive pass rusher in the 26-32 range.
George Karlaftis 30th in 2022
Gregory Rousseau 30th in 2021
Montez Sweat 26th in 2019
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Disagree they don't need any starters on OL. I feel okay about exactly 2 players on the OL right now.
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(01-31-2023, 12:44 PM)higgy100 Wrote: Yes I do but based on how well they played for a dozen games after the initial start but ,more importantly, where are you finding the $$$ to go get these top guys with everybody else they need to pay? Very funny how fans like to play with monopoly money.
More than just going on a shopping spree, as they absolutely did last year, it's about development. KC has a couple drafted guys in the 2nd/6th round that have turned into all pro OL, phily has a 7th rounder they took a chance on who is a stud.You keep developing guys just as they're doing with Carman and you keep drafting.The RT on Cinci. had a bad game but lots of OL have bad games with Jones over them. He had a tremendous game against Buffalo and nobody wanted him cut after that game.You keep developing developing and developing.
In the voice of the Skinner guy that won AGT. I ain't real good at math. Most posters do not even take the money aspect into it they just point at shiny new toys and say I want. Just slap their hand like a kid and say no.
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TBH if there is an available proven game wrecker on the market I think really hard about trying to trade for them. We sorely need a defender who can take over a game. Otherwise at 28 we are hoping for luck as this is a deepish edge class but the top end are not necessarily game wreckers. Maybe someone like Myles Murphy or Will McDonald in the draft?
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(01-31-2023, 12:22 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: My main wants:
1. Cut Mixon
Nothing against him, but we just arent a running team. Paying the third most money on the team (12 million) to a guy that barely touches the ball and isn't super effective when he does is asinine. Draft some speed out of the backfield or go pick up a FA for cheap.
2. Find a punter.
Christman was freaking awful on Sunday and field position has been a problem for us all year. I am over it. Either draft one or bring in one in FA. It's a cheap upgrade that can pay huge dividends.
3. Bring these guys back.
Eli Apple, Pratt, Vonn Bell, Perine, Hurst, Flowers. None of these guys will break the bank and have been solid players for us.
4. Upgrade the OL
What happened with injuries in the playoffs was unlucky. The OL was OK this year, but nothing special. Go out and get that elite guy on the OL that we need. Joe goes from a good to best QB on the planet when he has time to throw and is comfortable in the pocket.
5. Find that elite game wrecker on defense
The Chiefs have one in Chris Jones. We need a guy like that on defense. Our defense is solid, but it's missing that one guy that can just wreck a game.
None of these things are huge asks. The Bengals have 44 million in cap space right now - third most in the league. Bates leaving and cutting Mixon would free up another 20 million at least.
I don't know if I would cut Mixon, trade him or let him take a discount if he wants to stay but we definitely need to shed
some dough there at the RB position. Keep Perine and Trayveon and maybe draft a RB if we trade Mixon and the guy we
bring in needs to be great in blitz pickup which is essential at RB and this is something Mixon struggled with at times.
Agree on everything else, nice thread Weezy. Time to move on, was a great season and we damn near got there but just
too many injuries and bad things against us to go all the way. Looking forward to FA and the draft. Fun times. 
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(01-31-2023, 03:16 PM)BengalsBong Wrote: In the voice of the Skinner guy that won AGT. I ain't real good at math. Most posters do not even take the money aspect into it they just point at shiny new toys and say I want. Just slap their hand like a kid and say no.
LOL. I have no idea how all this cap room works, defer, bonus, what's on/off the table, etc. and I'll be the first to admit it but I do know that really good players and especially a LT, if there's one even available because who really lets them leave, is going to cost mega dollars.
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If you're all confident in the current roster, including the O-line, then the strat is keep as many people as possible, run it back, and pray we don't have that many injuries on the o-line next year.
From there you draft BPA.
KC won because they've had better drafts in later rounds. Bengals front office needs to rethink how they evaluate talent in rounds 3-4.
Only position to ask for an upgrade on is punter and LS.
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It'll be sad to see Bates go. There's no way we can afford him.
Dax has had a rough year. He had a lot of penalties and so forth. But he got a lot of valuable playing time and I think he learned a lot.
I think Dax has more potential as far as man to man coverage of tight ends and so forth compared to Bates.
I think Dax will learn a ton this offseason and have a solid year next year as the starter.
I think the Bengals should re-sign Pratt and Vonn Bell for sure.
I think Hurst, Sample and Apple should be affordable, but I don't mind losing Apple if he wants too much money.
Perine should definitely be re-signed and is a better fit for what we do than Mixon. Don't see Mixon getting released as he's such a big part of our locker room and I don't see management cutting him--but I don't see him coming back the following year.
Definitely need to look for depth along the oline, corner, and dline. These are my top priorities, but depth everywhere is always good--and you absolutely cannot reach in the draft (BPA all the way).
Definitely lock up Burrow, Wilson, and Higgins (in that order of priority).
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(01-31-2023, 12:22 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: My main wants:
1. Cut Mixon
Nothing against him, but we just arent a running team. Paying the third most money on the team (12 million) to a guy that barely touches the ball and isn't super effective when he does is asinine. Draft some speed out of the backfield or go pick up a FA for cheap.
2. Find a punter.
Christman was freaking awful on Sunday and field position has been a problem for us all year. I am over it. Either draft one or bring in one in FA. It's a cheap upgrade that can pay huge dividends.
3. Bring these guys back.
Eli Apple, Pratt, Vonn Bell, Perine, Hurst, Flowers. None of these guys will break the bank and have been solid players for us.
4. Upgrade the OL
What happened with injuries in the playoffs was unlucky. The OL was OK this year, but nothing special. Go out and get that elite guy on the OL that we need. Joe goes from a good to best QB on the planet when he has time to throw and is comfortable in the pocket.
5. Find that elite game wrecker on defense
The Chiefs have one in Chris Jones. We need a guy like that on defense. Our defense is solid, but it's missing that one guy that can just wreck a game.
None of these things are huge asks. The Bengals have 44 million in cap space right now - third most in the league. Bates leaving and cutting Mixon would free up another 20 million at least.
I agree with most and this is a huge off season for them in which they could go in any number of ways
1) Extend Burrow, Wilson and possibly Higgins
2) If numbers are reasonable, bring back Hurst, Wilcox, Bell, Apple and Perine. Ideally short term deals that won't be on the books going into Burrow's 6th season (not sure how likely that is for Bell). I'd love to see Pratt back too but not sure that happens
3) Find replacement (early rd draft pick) for Mixon or Boyd this year and then consider moving on from one of them this off season (or see if Mixon will re do his deal at a lower salary to stay).
4) Figure out plan for OT next year between Carman, Williams and Collins. Do they move on from Collins contract this off season?
5) Use a 2nd or 3rd rd pick to continue building OL (OT) as I assume next year is Jonah's last as a Bengal
6) Consider future FA's - DJ, Chido, Sam and Trey. Any willingness from them to extend / rework their contract? Can't really push money forward given likely cap impacts on Burrow and other big contracts coming up.
7) Move on from Brandon Wilson - save the $2M on next years cap
The Bengals have cap space to work with this off season - will be interesting to see how they go about it
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(01-31-2023, 01:22 PM)Synric Wrote: The Bengals can designate Mixon as an after June 1st cut even in March if they do that they will save around 7.25m and have a dead cap hit of 2.75m. Joe Mixon will count 12.7m and 13.1m against the cap in 2023 and 2024 respectively. Big cap numbers for a running back.
Gotcha. Thanks. So yeah, presented with that information, I'd probably move on unless he takes a massive team friendly restructure.
"Better send those refunds..."
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(01-31-2023, 02:00 PM)Synric Wrote: I don't think Hurst will get the contract people expect. Tight Ends are the second least valued position group and the FA market isn't bad along with a solid looking draft class.
Plus Hurst loves it here which is a big deal. Turned his life around. I would give him a 2 year extension that wouldn't break the bank.
I do agree with TLL that Pratt might be on his way out though. Logan is the LB to keep and see how good ADG can be...
I think ADG could be even better than Pratt.
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(01-31-2023, 01:51 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Pratt and Hurst are both likely going to cost more than you think.
Pratt already sounds like he's gone, he was upset earlier in the year he wasn't playing 3rd down because "too much money left on the table".
Hurst I wouldn't be surprised if he gets something like a CJ Uzomah deal which the Bengals should not match, the same as they didn't the Uzomah deal. Either draft a TE, or sign the next Uzomah/Hurst that will come here on the cheap because he saw Burrow get 2 other guys who weren't anything special at his position paid.
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That cap space is with Bates already gone. He's a FA. Him signing elsewhere doesn't add any extra cap space.
With how much Hurst said he likes it here, i'd be real surprised if he asks for money like that.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
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(01-31-2023, 03:42 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: With how much Hurst said he likes it here, i'd be real surprised if he asks for money like that.
It's probably going to be the last contract of his career. A lot of players say they like it here... they still want paid.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/jessie-bates-on-re-signing-with-bengals-id-love-to-be-here-but-thats-out-of-my-control/ar-AA16V4Lr
(But it doesn't mean he wants less than $18m/yr)
Uzomah said he was going to bathe in Skyline if the Bengals won the SB.
Higgins said he would love to stay around here for more years.
At the end of the day it's a business, though, and players are going to want to (rightfully) get paid. Hurst might be looking at getting the last payday of his life. At his age it might also come down less to money per year and more to guaranteed money.
Does he like Cincinnati enough to turn down $9m more ($3m/yr over 3 yrs, or maybe the Bengals only offer 2 years and another team offers 3) from a different team? Potentially a different team in a state without income tax? Or perhaps say $3m less signing bonus, which is $3m that would go right into his pocket then and there?
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I've read, I don't remember where, that Mixon said he's willing to renegotiate his contract to stay here. If so, keep him here, if not, cut him.
Bates had a meh year and I don't think anyone is going to pay him the Minka Fitzpatrick contract he thinks he deserves. He said he wants to stay, but can't leave 10 million on the table. I get that, maybe they can meet in the middle somewhere.
It's a must to sign Wilson. If Pratt wants to leave for more money, let him.
I think with some time, we can upgrade Scharpings position. I'd let him walk.
Hayden Hurst has been very open about his mental health issues, and has finally found a home where he feels the team believes in him and he has excelled. I say give him a fair contract and he'll stay and for go moving to another team again where he may not be happy.
We need to re-sign Tyler Boyd, period.
We are stuck with Dru at punter. He might not be a good as we hoped when they gave hm the job, but we can't keep screwing around with McPherson's holder and not expect that to mess with the kicking game.
Bell is a must sign. Him coming here was the start of the defense as we know it today.
Apple is a no brainer- re sign him for insurance and we probably need to draft another corner.
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(01-31-2023, 03:59 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: It's probably going to be the last contract of his career. A lot of players say they like it here... they still want paid.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/jessie-bates-on-re-signing-with-bengals-id-love-to-be-here-but-thats-out-of-my-control/ar-AA16V4Lr
(But it doesn't mean he wants less than $18m/yr)
Uzomah said he was going to bathe in Skyline if the Bengals won the SB.
Higgins said he would love to stay around here for more years.
At the end of the day it's a business, though, and players are going to want to (rightfully) get paid. Hurst might be looking at getting the last payday of his life. At his age it might also come down less to money per year and more to guaranteed money.
Does he like Cincinnati enough to turn down $9m more ($3m/yr over 3 yrs, or maybe the Bengals only offer 2 years and another team offers 3) from a different team? Potentially a different team in a state without income tax? Or perhaps say $3m less signing bonus, which is $3m that would go right into his pocket then and there?
True.
How many other players have been in 2 other spots where it didn't work out (definitively) and then came here and filled a spot that made them happy.
I don't doubt he wants what's fair. Everyone does. I just question whether he will ask for an amount that the Bengals aren't willing to pay, ala Uzomah.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
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(01-31-2023, 04:06 PM)Sled21 Wrote: I've read, I don't remember where, that Mixon said he's willing to renegotiate his contract to stay here. If so, keep him here, if not, cut him.
Bates had a meh year and I don't think anyone is going to pay him the Minka Fitzpatrick contract he thinks he deserves. He said he wants to stay, but can't leave 10 million on the table. I get that, maybe they can meet in the middle somewhere.
It's a must to sign Wilson. If Pratt wants to leave for more money, let him.
I think with some time, we can upgrade Scharpings position. I'd let him walk.
Hayden Hurst has been very open about his mental health issues, and has finally found a home where he feels the team believes in him and he has excelled. I say give him a fair contract and he'll stay and for go moving to another team again where he may not be happy.
We need to re-sign Tyler Boyd, period.
We are stuck with Dru at punter. He might not be a good as we hoped when they gave hm the job, but we can't keep screwing around with McPherson's holder and not expect that to mess with the kicking game.
Bell is a must sign. Him coming here was the start of the defense as we know it today.
Apple is a no brainer- re sign him for insurance and we probably need to draft another corner.
I just don't get where this kind of talk is coming from.
First year kicking live bullets around and he's near top 10?
I just don't get it...
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
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(01-31-2023, 12:40 PM)Cosmokramer Wrote: Nah. I’m out on Apple. He’s mediocre at best. We have the pieces in place with a season behind us and full offseason to replace him. Plus Awuzie coming back
The Apple hate is absolutely nonsensical.
He is a CB3 that was paid 4M and played CB1 for team with 10 straight wins with him as a starter, again, at CB1.
Apple may have been the best deal on the team this year.
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(01-31-2023, 01:26 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: Mixon is not going anywhere. I don’t know but we need to be like KC. They’ve drafted very well.
You may not be able to keep Hurst and draft a TE in first or second round. Select a tackle first or second round. You need a corner. You may not be able to keep Perine if he wants much. Williams or Evans might have to do.
If you want this we would need to not only draft waaaaaay better but also trade Tee for a massive draft haul.
KC out drafts our personnel department by multiple tiers.
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