the interior Passrush

[kalibengal]

First off, I like the Murphy pick and will bring some edge speed we lack.
But the question is how did we improve our interior passrush? are we sold on Zack Carter who I dont think logged one full sack? Sample is a good motor guy and is solid backup but Im concerned since we barely eeeked out 30 sacks last yr.
We were so much better with Larry O along side Reader in this regard.

[Soonerpeace]

(05-01-2023, 12:46 PM)kalibengal Wrote: First off, I like the Murphy pick and will bring some edge speed we lack.
But the question is how did we improve our interior passrush? are we sold on Zack Carter who I dont think logged one full sack? Sample is a good motor guy and is solid backup but Im concerned since we barely eeeked out 30 sacks last yr.
We were so much better with Larry O along side Reader in this regard.

This staff has drafted in recent years with a big focus on versatility of players. Murphy is 6.5 270. I expect to see us sub out Hill and Reader a lot more. But for a DT collapsing the pocket is pretty important as well as sacks. Reader collapsing the pocket and batting down passes tells his entire story.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

Have been saying the 2 players that could help this team more than any improving are Jackson Carman and Zachary Carter.

Definitely need more interior pass rush. Carter WAS looking much better late in the year and in the Playoffs. Hope this trend
continues, same with Carman. Didn't add a 3-tech in FA or the Draft so we have to hope this is the case. Really like Murphy as a
move to the interior on 3rd and long passing situations so he definitely helps.

[NATI BENGALS]

https://www.bengals.com/news/b-j-hill-looks-to-top-career-year-with-zach-carter-s-help

“Bengals defensive tackle B.J. Hill, who last season's career year saw him knock down the quarterback more than Aaron Donald and Jeffery Simmons and have as many batted passes as Chris Jones while taking more snaps than Javon Hargrave and Jarran Reed (courtesy of Pro Football Reference), thinks he could be even better this year.”

Between Hill, Carter, Tufele, and Sample I think we are ok.

[masonbengals fan]

Hill played well enough that losing Larry O didn't sting near as much as I thought it would.

[007BengalsFan]

We still need some help in the middle getting pressure on the QB. With all the talk last year about Hill being better than Ogunjobi, he is not. Hill is a good player but we missed Ogunjobi on the defensive line.

[*ochocincos*]

(05-01-2023, 12:46 PM)kalibengal Wrote: First off, I like the Murphy pick and will bring some edge speed we lack.
But the question is how did we improve our interior passrush? are we sold on Zack Carter who I dont think logged one full sack? Sample is a good motor guy and is solid backup but Im concerned since we barely eeeked out 30 sacks last yr.
We were so much better with Larry O along side Reader in this regard.

I would hope/expect Hubbard to see a good bit of time inside in nickel again.
He was doing that a decent amount in his earlier years.

Might also see Sample doing that (as well).
Murphy also has done some inside rushing, IIRC.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-01-2023, 01:52 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: https://www.bengals.com/news/b-j-hill-looks-to-top-career-year-with-zach-carter-s-help

“Bengals defensive tackle B.J. Hill, who last season's career year saw him knock down the quarterback more than Aaron Donald and Jeffery Simmons and have as many batted passes as Chris Jones while taking more snaps than Javon Hargrave and Jarran Reed (courtesy of Pro Football Reference), thinks he could be even better this year.”

Between Hill, Carter, Tufele, and Sample I think we are ok.

Agreed, if anything getting stronger on the edges will open up more opportunities for the interior guys to pick up more contact with the QB, as he will be more apt to step up from the outside rushers.

[WeezyBengal]

Tufele flashed last year. I think he is going to have a bigger role this year than people think.

[Sled21]

We just signed a DT with good college film, albeit a smaller school.

[BengalsBong]

We need a solid snap count rotation to keep guys fresh. Can not expect it to work on every team as some are more pass heavy and some more run heavy. But keeping guys fresh is the key to production across the board.

[CJD]

Carter started off very poorly but I began to notice him a little bit as the season went on. He didn't offer much as a pass rusher as a rookie, but he did have a couple stuffs against Cleveland on Halloween, another one the following week and a PD in week 18 vs the Ravens. He had a stuff in the playoffs against the Ravens too.

I think not drafting a pass rusher at DT in this draft is a vote of confidence in Carter. We'll see how he does in his 2nd year.

The good news is that one thing I often hear from draft gurus and the like is that DT is a position that takes a year or 2 to adjust to the NFL. It is among the most physical positions in the entire league, so the rookies often struggle having not been in an NFL weight room for very long. 2nd year is the earliest you'll see genuine production out of a DT. Maybe Carter takes a leap in year 2.

I could also see us going to a Nascar package with Ossai and Murphy moving inside on obvious passing downs as well. That should help the interior pass rush.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-01-2023, 01:52 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: https://www.bengals.com/news/b-j-hill-looks-to-top-career-year-with-zach-carter-s-help

“Bengals defensive tackle B.J. Hill, who last season's career year saw him knock down the quarterback more than Aaron Donald and Jeffery Simmons and have as many batted passes as Chris Jones while taking more snaps than Javon Hargrave and Jarran Reed (courtesy of Pro Football Reference), thinks he could be even better this year.”

Between Hill, Carter, Tufele, and Sample I think we are ok.

Didn't know BJ played THAT good last year. I know he played well and didn't get the Sacks that show good DT play, but that is 
impressive and hadn't heard this before. Love BJ Hill but he strikes me more as a player in between Reader and Carter than a 
true 3-tech like Aaron Donald or Geno.

[OSUfan]

(05-01-2023, 12:46 PM)kalibengal Wrote: First off, I like the Murphy pick and will bring some edge speed we lack.
But the question is how did we improve our interior passrush? are we sold on Zack Carter who I dont think logged one full sack? Sample is a good motor guy and is solid backup but Im concerned since we barely eeeked out 30 sacks last yr.
We were so much better with Larry O along side Reader in this regard.

On obvious passing downs both Hubbard and Murphy can rush from the interior to go along with Cam Sample and Jay Tufele. Tufele played the nose while Reader was out with injury but he played the 3 in college and could be an important part of this interior line.

[OSUfan]

(05-01-2023, 03:46 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Carter started off very poorly but I began to notice him a little bit as the season went on. He didn't offer much as a pass rusher as a rookie, but he did have a couple stuffs against Cleveland on Halloween, another one the following week and a PD in week 18 vs the Ravens. He had a stuff in the playoffs against the Ravens too.  

I think not drafting a pass rusher at DT in this draft is a vote of confidence in Carter. We'll see how he does in his 2nd year.

The good news is that one thing I often hear from draft gurus and the like is that DT is a position that takes a year or 2 to adjust to the NFL. It is among the most physical positions in the entire league, so the rookies often struggle having not been in an NFL weight room for very long. 2nd year is the earliest you'll see genuine production out of a DT. Maybe Carter takes a leap in year 2.

I could also see us going to a Nascar package with Ossai and Murphy moving inside on obvious passing downs as well. That should help the interior pass rush.

I do not think they would move Ossai inside rather Murphy and Hubbard if going Nascar with Hendrickson and Ossai outside. That would be my guess.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

We did not address DT/NT paasush directly, but Murphy will help. He, Hubbard, & Sample can all take snaps inside, and even Ossai did so on pass rush downs sometimes.

Generally speaking:
DE Rotation: 1st-2nd down: Hendrickson, Hubbard, Murphy, Sample
DT Rotation: 1st-2nd down: Reader, Hill, Tupou, Carter
DE 3rd: Hendrickson, Hubbard, Ossai, Murphy
DT 3rd: Hill, Carter, Hubbard, Murphy, Sample

It won't be that ridgid. Reader will play some 3rd, he pushes the pocket well. Tufele, too. But Murphy adding depth to the DE rotation will allow more rotation. Fresher legs. And more DEs moving inside on passing downs.

[Sled21]

Devonnsha Maxwell played DT at Chattanoga and had 37.5 sacks, 55.5 tackles for loss and 5 forced fumbles. Let's see if he can translate that to the big stage.

[*SHRacerX*]

(05-01-2023, 12:46 PM)kalibengal Wrote: First off, I like the Murphy pick and will bring some edge speed we lack.
But the question is how did we improve our interior passrush? are we sold on Zack Carter who I dont think logged one full sack? Sample is a good motor guy and is solid backup but Im concerned since we barely eeeked out 30 sacks last yr.
We were so much better with Larry O along side Reader in this regard.

Some of BJ Hill's decline, IMHO, came from needing him to play too many snaps.  The rotation of guys is key to have fresh legs coming in and wearing down offensive linemen.  Carter improved steadily throughout the year and showed he belonged by the end of the season.  I would imagine we will see more of him and reducing Hill's snaps (this is what Ogunjobi did so well for Hill) which could make him more effective.

Lastly, I think with Murphy's size and strength, he may also be a candidate to rotate inside.  They want their defensive linemen to have the ability to rotate inside without subbing.  Murphy, Ossai, and Hubbard are all capable of this.  I think we also see a lot more of Ossai and Murphy as ends in rotation with Hubbard and Hendrickson to keep them fresh and healthy as well.  

[sandwedge]

(05-02-2023, 08:33 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Devonnsha Maxwell played DT at Chattanoga and had 37.5 sacks, 55.5 tackles for loss and 5 forced fumbles. Let's see if he can translate that to the big stage.

37.5 sacks from the DT spot? Was he a man amongst boys or what? That is an amazing stat...

[*ochocincos*]

(05-01-2023, 02:31 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Tufele flashed last year. I think he is going to have a bigger role this year than people think.

I liked Tufele coming out of college.
He was a 4th rounder.
I think some discount him because he was put on waivers by the Jags, so people assumed he was crap.


I think he can compete for a spot, although there might not be room for him now that they added Murphy.
Decision may come whether to go with 5 DE - 5 DT, or 6 DE - 4 DT.