O-Line Rankings Have Me Excited!

[THE PISTONS]

(09-05-2023, 08:04 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I was watching Orlando vs Philly today on the replay of the SB. Just watched a few series with KC on offense. Brown is a large human and his long arms rough on DE’s. He looked awfully good with the plays I saw. I don’t think top 10 is realistic but not out of reach either. But…. if the OL is top 15 it will produce a better offense. I’ve been saying it Brown and Volson large humans I’d expect more short yardage success there than years past.

Brown is our best lineman. He's probably a top 10 to 12 Tackle...so big upgrade.

He's a great run blocker. An above average to good pass blocker.

That makes us better definately.

Health is always the wild card.

[*ochocincos*]

(09-05-2023, 10:40 PM)tms Wrote: Honestly, I thought you were gonna go in another direction. I think depth is important, and I'm actually excited about ours. I've always used 3 years as the rule of thumb for OL development. If you think about the last two years, we were bringing along CV, JC, HA, Prince, Hill, Smith all in their first three years. Even Scharping, Cappa, Karras and Collins (and before them Reiff) were new bodies. 

Point being, we had a ton a guys who were just out of college, and another group who were trying to help us change the oil going full speed up the interstate. Besides OBJ coming in off the street and CV on the learning curve, that's not really the case anymore. JC, Smith and Hill are in their much ballyhooed third years. Cappa, Karras and Scharping (and later Collins) will know what to expect. We've been burned before, that's true, and it's important not to count the chickens before they're chickens, but I think we're in a good place.  

What exactly have you seen from the backups that make you confident in their ability to fill in?
About the only thing I am optimistic about is Carman, but only at LT. He's looked bad on the right side.
Smith can't run block to save his life.
Ford looked atrocious in the preseason.
Hill hasn't really looked any better, still just a meh IOL.
Scharping hasn't looked good on the right side either.
Collins coming back will help provide assurance for RT, but it will be interesting to see who they drop once he's healthy.

[Whatever]

(09-06-2023, 09:16 AM)ochocincos Wrote: What exactly have you seen from the backups that make you confident in their ability to fill in?
About the only thing I am optimistic about is Carman, but only at LT. He's looked bad on the right side.
Smith can't run block to save his life.
Ford looked atrocious in the preseason.
Hill hasn't really looked any better, still just a meh IOL.
Scharping hasn't looked good on the right side either.
Collins coming back will help provide assurance for RT, but it will be interesting to see who they drop once he's healthy.

Collins will be a good 6th guy off the bench.  He's played both T spots as well as G, so I'm not overly concerned there.  Carman is at least a solid reserve LT.  However, the reality is that when you have to put in backups at 2-3 positions, the line is going to suffer. Nobody has that much OL depth.  Most teams struggle just to get 5 quality starters out there, much less have good depth.  Look at how KC's OL imploded a couple of years back against TB when they had to play some backups.  

[Soonerpeace]

(09-05-2023, 11:59 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Brown is our best lineman. He's probably a top 10 to 12 Tackle...so big upgrade.

He's a great run blocker. An above average to good pass blocker.

That makes us better definately.

Health is always the wild card.

I know I keep harping on this but I seriously think the left side will move the pile. I think our goal line & short yardage will reap the benefits of the behemoths.

[*ochocincos*]

(09-06-2023, 10:23 AM)Whatever Wrote: Collins will be a good 6th guy off the bench.  He's played both T spots as well as G, so I'm not overly concerned there.  Carman is at least a solid reserve LT.  However, the reality is that when you have to put in backups at 2-3 positions, the line is going to suffer. Nobody has that much OL depth.  Most teams struggle just to get 5 quality starters out there, much less have good depth.  Look at how KC's OL imploded a couple of years back against TB when they had to play some backups.  

I dunno if I would put Collins at LT honestly after seeing how he played last year.
We also haven't seen Collins play OG in years. It was only LG and only in 2015-2016.
While many believe an OG should be able to play both OG spots, we know it's not always a reality that they will play both sides well.

The way I see it for backups I'd be possibly confident in filling in:
LT - Carman
LG - Scharping (maybe Collins but it's been a while)
C - Hill probably the closest but I'd be nervous
RG - Not a damn person, but Collins maybe best option? Super nervous about that though since he's not played RG in a NFL game
RT - Collins only. Rest of the guys have been terrible there.

What does this mean for me?
I have 0 faith in Smith and Ford at any position at this point after seeing them in the preseason.
Cappa and Karras probably the guys that the team can least afford getting injured.

[TheCincinnatiKid]

(09-05-2023, 07:52 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yeah I hope the line is Top 10, but I doubt it.

They don't have to be top 10, they just have to not be an enormous liability when the playoffs come rolling in.

[LSUfaninTN]

(09-05-2023, 03:43 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: So the offensive line has been the only thing holding us back from a title the past two years. It was ranked 28th last season and it's in the top half this season! Some (few) sites even have us top ten, but most have us around the ten-to-fifteen range.

Either way, it's a drastic improvement from either of the past two years!

I only bring this up because I have the top pick in tonight's fantasy football draft and the consensus is to take Jefferson, but I started doing research on taking Chase first overall.

What I found out was that Jefferson's air yards were almost twice as much as Chase's last year, which means that our line struggled so much that Chase only had half as much time to run downfield before Burrow had to get rid of the ball.

We almost won a title the past two years having two of the worst lines in the league and now we're DRASTICALLY improved, so I'm even more excited!

I'm going to stop by the casino when I get the chance to place more bets

WHO-DEY!

Chase is going to have a great year. I dropped about $1500 on Burrow and Chase autograph cards (and Jefferson) before the season. That being said I’m not sure I would’ve picked him over JJ, I still think JJ is probably gonna go down as the GOAT when it’s said and done, but Chase will be top 5, maybe top 3. People forget how much of a freak he is, because of his lost momentum last year. Even though NCAAF and NFL are worlds different, it should count for something that Chase owned Jefferson with the same QB. Burrow > Cousins (even though Cousins is really underrated). 

Anyway, I feel like I’m back in high school pulling for the Saints. That was my favorite time to be a NFL fan. Waiting for the Bengals’ 2009 Saints “pinch me” moment. I’m genuinely excited for you guys because when (not if) it happens for y’all, it’s gonna be beautiful. Especially if you’ve been watching in misery for the last few decades like I was with the ‘Aints. 

Side note, when Burrow and Chase win multiple SB’s I’m probably going to make a pretty penny on these cards if I’m not too much of a sap to keep them and give them to my nephew when I’m dead.

[tms]

(09-06-2023, 09:16 AM)ochocincos Wrote: What exactly have you seen from the backups that make you confident in their ability to fill in?
About the only thing I am optimistic about is Carman, but only at LT. He's looked bad on the right side.
Smith can't run block to save his life.
Ford looked atrocious in the preseason.
Hill hasn't really looked any better, still just a meh IOL.
Scharping hasn't looked good on the right side either.
Collins coming back will help provide assurance for RT, but it will be interesting to see who they drop once he's healthy.

Yeah, I'm not saying they're great. But they're backups. The entire league's in the same boat on that one. They'll contribute on Teams, in heavy sets and in practices, and stay ready to fill in for an injury. They might not excel but at least they know what they're doing now, which is half the battle. I'm not losing any sleep over it. (< famous last words lol)

[THE PISTONS]

(09-06-2023, 11:21 AM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I know I keep harping on this but I seriously think the left side will move the pile. I think our goal line & short yardage will reap the benefits of the behemoths.

Yes. Run blocking is improved.

Pass blocking should be, but Burrows style will lead to sacks.

[Sled21]

(09-05-2023, 03:52 PM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: stop wasting your money gambling

Yeah, spend it on whiskey and hookers instead....

[*ochocincos*]

(09-07-2023, 12:01 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Yes. Run blocking is improved.

Pass blocking should be, but Burrows style will lead to sacks.

Have we actually seen this yet though?
Or is it more just an assumption because Orlando Brown was added and Volson bulked up some?

I know Preseason didn't have the starters playing, but those guys did not give (me) any confidence in the run game being more productive.
Outside of Evans' 33 yard run in Game 1, the RBs averaged 3.5 YPC or less.

[BengalB]

(09-05-2023, 04:30 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: We have 4 of the 5 same starters as last year. Jonah moves to the right side and Orlando Brown Jr. takes his spot on the left. While Orlando Brown Jr. is a very good LT, he is not Trent Williams. Jonah is Jonah. We should be improved this year but are we a top 10 offensive line? I dont think so but it could happen. Orlando Brown Jr. would need to play at his usual Pro Bowl level, Jonah would need to play better on the right side than he did on the left side, Volson would need to show some major improvement, Karras would need to improve and Cappa just needs to be himself. If that happens we will have a top 10, maybe even top 5 offensive line. If everyone plays like they did last year, this is not a top 10 line.

I agree. It’s worrisome that they didn’t do much of anything to fix the one major weak spot on this team.

It’s frustrating too. There’s some great FA’s available…but did they even take a look?


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[BFritz21]

(09-07-2023, 08:45 PM)BengalB Wrote: I agree. It’s worrisome that they didn’t do much of anything to fix the one major weak spot on this team.

It’s frustrating too. There’s some great FA’s available…but did they even take a look?


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It's worrisome but it should be improved some. 

I just really how you don't just completely the foundation of your franchise's hopes for success' health with a line to protect him just confuses the hell out of me.......

[sandwedge]

(09-07-2023, 08:45 PM)BengalB Wrote: I agree. It’s worrisome that they didn’t do much of anything to fix the one major weak spot on this team.

It’s frustrating too. There’s some great FA’s available…but did they even take a look?


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What's the weak spot?

[casear2727]

(09-06-2023, 12:11 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I dunno if I would put Collins at LT honestly after seeing how he played last year.
We also haven't seen Collins play OG in years. It was only LG and only in 2015-2016.
While many believe an OG should be able to play both OG spots, we know it's not always a reality that they will play both sides well.

The way I see it for backups I'd be possibly confident in filling in:
LT - Carman
LG - Scharping (maybe Collins but it's been a while)
C - Hill probably the closest but I'd be nervous
RG - Not a damn person, but Collins maybe best option? Super nervous about that though since he's not played RG in a NFL game
RT - Collins only. Rest of the guys have been terrible there.

What does this mean for me?
I have 0 faith in Smith and Ford at any position at this point after seeing them in the preseason.
Cappa and Karras probably the guys that the team can least afford getting injured.

Why would we put LC at LT?  Surely we would slide Jonah back to LT and LC to RT dont you think?

You have more faith in Smith and Ford than I do,  I wish I could get to zero.

[Joelist]

Bringing in. Orlando Brown was a pretty big upgrade to the line, and last year the line was not as bad as some think. Our biggest issue on the left side was Jonah getting beaten inside. That isn't happening with Brown. Plus running will be better with the team being committed to power gap and a line of maulers.

The first 3 games were problematic as the line had zero snaps together as a unit ever. They surrendered 15 sacks. The rest of the regular season they surrendered only 29 in 13 games. The playoffs were spottier but having three starters out had a lot to do with that.

[Rattler]

O Line looked as bad as any the Bengals have ever fielded...no push, no protection, no pocket, nothing but epic fail.

Pollack SUCKS!

[LSUfaninTN]

(09-10-2023, 05:57 PM)Rattler Wrote: O Line looked as bad as any the Bengals have ever fielded...no push, no protection, no pocket, nothing but epic fail.

Pollack SUCKS!

Agreed. Now we know the issue MUST be with coaching. No excuses this time. The issue is with the head coach as well. 

I still can't get over what I saw today. Every team in the league should be dreading the Bengals' offense on their schedule. 3 freaking points. Today was a joke. 

[Clark W Griswold]

(09-09-2023, 09:59 PM)sandwedge Wrote: What's the weak spot?

The entire offense…

[*ochocincos*]

(09-10-2023, 05:57 PM)Rattler Wrote: O Line looked as bad as any the Bengals have ever fielded...no push, no protection, no pocket, nothing but epic fail.

Pollack SUCKS!

I dunno if it's purely because of Pollack's (lack of) coaching or the fact none of these starters played hardly a snap in preseason games and thus just weren't ready (or both), but it's clearly yet another slow start like every season under Taylor.