Reds September Games Thread

[guyofthetiger]

Is the fat lady singing yet? Does not look good for the Reds. Still a great season though.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(09-09-2023, 11:10 PM)guyofthetiger Wrote: Is the fat lady singing yet? Does not look good for the Reds. Still a great season though.

Not dead yet. Still close enough that if they go on a run they can get right back in there (with a little help). I believe the Twins are the only team left on the schedule with a winning record.

[cinci4life]

Greene, Votto, and India are all back. Greene is the starting pitcher and Votto and India both in the starting lineup.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/09/reds-activate-joey-votto-jonathan-india-hunter-greene.html

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

Greene just never seems like he is going to be pitch efficient enough to be more than mediocre. Another 5 innings/98 pitches/4 walks.

[The D.O.Z.]

(09-10-2023, 03:49 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Greene just never seems like he is going to be pitch efficient enough to be more than mediocre. Another 5 innings/98 pitches/4 walks.

I agree. I've said it before... he's a bullpen arm masquerading as a starting pitcher.

[*bengalfan74*]

(09-10-2023, 03:49 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Greene just never seems like he is going to be pitch efficient enough to be more than mediocre. Another 5 innings/98 pitches/4 walks.

(09-10-2023, 04:25 PM)The D.O.Z. Wrote: I agree. I've said it before... he's a bullpen arm masquerading as a starting pitcher.

Yup

I'm trying to hold out hope that Greene can develop another effective off speed pitch and turn the corner. But every game that goes by that hope fades a bit. 

It's not like he's old already. But the light needs to get brighter, soon.

[*ochocincos*]

(09-10-2023, 03:49 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Greene just never seems like he is going to be pitch efficient enough to be more than mediocre. Another 5 innings/98 pitches/4 walks.

What's the most important thing for a pitcher?
Walks allowed?
Innings pitched?
Something else that determines 'efficiency'?

For me, it's ERA.
Btw, Greene went 6 innings, not 5.
And despite 4 walks and 98 pitches, he's allowed 0 runs yet again.

The week prior, he went 5.1 innings.

Anything 5 and up is considered satisfactory nowadays, especially for a fireballer like Greene.
His WHIP needs to go down, but as long as he's keeping earned runs down, that's what I ultimately want to see.

If the Reds can get Sonny Gray back to go along with Abbott, Greene, Ashcraft, and Williamson next year, I think that could really be enough. Then you can have guys like Phillips and Lodolo as long relief and pushing for spots in the rotation. Plus another couple bullpen additions obviously.

[cinci4life]

Williamson is back off of the Covid list and starting tonight. Also interesting lineup tonight.

India
Senzel
Steer
Renfroe
Stephenson
Votto
EDLC
Bader
Friedl

[cinci4life]

Nice win tonight and needed with both Miami and Arizona about to lose. Cubs and SF currently losing also.

[guyofthetiger]

1 game back of Arizona. Please keep winning. Would be great to make the postseason.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

Phillips needs to go back down to AAA and keep working on his control and pitches.

[cinci4life]

Uh oh. Antone just left with a possible injury.

[Nicomo Cosca]

Half game back. Not over yet.

[cinci4life]

(09-13-2023, 10:38 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Half game back. Not over yet.

Arizona is getting trashed by the Mets so they'll be in the last wild card spot now.

[cinci4life]

Pretty damn incredible how well the bullpen is pitching right now.

[CJD]

(09-13-2023, 10:45 PM)cinci4life Wrote: Pretty damn incredible how well the bullpen is pitching right now.

The bullpen is cobbled together with re-treads, journeymen and a few unproven prospects but, somehow, Derek Johnson has turned them into an incredibly effective group of pitchers.

The Reds bullpen has accounted for 5.3 fWAR this year, which is 4th in the major leagues. 

5th in innings pitched, 2nd in saves, 2nd in wins, 9th in FIP, 4th in BABIP allowed, and 8th in LOB% (Left on base).

The funny thing is they aren't particularly effective or efficient when it comes to K/9 (27th), BB/9 (24th), HR/9 (18th), or ERA (14th). 

That, to me, points to an effective use in terms of situational decisions (when to replace the starter, when to shift between RHP and LHP etc), and that is a manager trait.

So I guess what I'm saying is David Bell probably has a lot to do with why our bullpen is performing so well.

[*bengalfan74*]

(09-14-2023, 02:17 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: The bullpen is cobbled together with re-treads, journeymen and a few unproven prospects but, somehow, Derek Johnson has turned them into an incredibly effective group of pitchers.

The Reds bullpen has accounted for 5.3 fWAR this year, which is 4th in the major leagues. 

5th in innings pitched, 2nd in saves, 2nd in wins, 9th in FIP, 4th in BABIP allowed, and 8th in LOB% (Left on base).

The funny thing is they aren't particularly effective or efficient when it comes to K/9 (27th), BB/9 (24th), HR/9 (18th), or ERA (14th). 

That, to me, points to an effective use in terms of situational decisions (when to replace the starter, when to shift between RHP and LHP etc), and that is a manager trait.

So I guess what I'm saying is David Bell probably has a lot to do with why our bullpen is performing so well.

Just incredible

And you can go on with the starters:

This is among starters with 3 or more starts.

We don't have a starter with double digit wins. We only have one starter with an ERA below 4.00  We have had 17 different starting pitchers this season. Brandon Williamson's story is just beyond all logic as far as us winning games he's started after getting clobbered to start the game.

It's just crazy that we're still in contention with this entire pitching staff.

[*ochocincos*]

Thought I saw mentioned from one of the Reds beat writers that they'll be limiting Abbott's pitch count moving forward to avoid burnout.
That would be unfortunate given Reds are right in the thick of things, but I understand since he's pitched pretty much the entire season as a rookie.
With that said, in the past five outings, he's only thrown 90+ pitches one time, and it was "only" 97 pitches.
I guess this is what happens when you have such a young rotation.
Bunch of guys who just aren't conditioned enough to pitch so many innings yet.

Also, the Reds have lucked out getting late-game wins when their starters are coming out before the 5th inning is over.
Williamson and Phillips both only pitched 4.0 innings in their outings.

Fingers crossed the Reds can get through these next 2.5 weeks and only have to worry about 3 SPs instead of 5.

[CJD]

(09-14-2023, 08:42 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Just incredible

And you can go on with the starters:

This is among starters with 3 or more starts.

We don't have a starter with double digit wins. We only have one starter with an ERA below 4.00  We have had 17 different starting pitchers this season. Brandon Williamson's story is just beyond all logic as far as us winning games he's started after getting clobbered to start the game.

It's just crazy that we're still in contention with this entire pitching staff.

Our starting pitching, much like our bullpen, has been cobbled together with whatever players we had on hand to get us through the day. The injuries we've sustained at the starting pitching position have been insane. 

Lodolo's season wiped out
Greene missing months
Ashcraft missing months
Ben Lively and Brett Kennedy, both of whom had not started against since 2018, had to make some starts for our team due to these injuries and even then, Lively ended up injured multiple times. 
Luke Weaver was forced to start 21 games for us because of all the injuries our rotation sustained.
Abbott, Williamson, Phillips, Stoudt, Richardson, Kennedy, and Spiers, all rookies, had to make real starts for this team (not "starts" that were actually just bullpen games like Antone, Cruz and Law's 4 combined "starts"). That's 46 starts by rookies. Not record breaking by any means, but that's so many rookie starts, especially when many of those prospects were not ready for MLB action but were needed simply because of lack of arms.

With all of that turmoil, we are still sitting in a playoff spot with a little over 2 weeks of baseball left to go.

This team has all the potential in the world.

[cinci4life]

Well good news is Miami lost and Arizona is getting destroyed again. SF was rained out so it's a 3 way tie for the last wildcard spot with Arizona and SF.