Blame the run game

[Destro]

Mixon is below mediocre but the O-Line is even worse at rushing. Mixon can't make the first guy miss? Why is the first guy already 2 yards behind the LOS when Mixon gets the ball?

I would also like to see if another back could have had a different result. 11 rushes today. Two rushers today: Mixon and Browning.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(11-26-2023, 10:05 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: No. 0. Jones and Yoshi got very few too. One played 4.

That's our speed.

And they need to be seeing what they have in these guys before the draft rolls around. They probably tag Tee, but they’ll need a Boyd replacement at the very least.

[casear2727]

(11-26-2023, 10:06 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: At draft time, some act like we got 7 stars.

They do that after every draft.

[NATI BENGALS]

(11-26-2023, 09:34 PM)Whatever Wrote: Yeah, we should give the kid who had 69 yards on 29 carries in the preseason touches.  That'll fix the issues.  He barely averaged 2 yards a carry against PS guys in preseason, but maybe against a likely playoff team's starters in the regular season, it'll be different.

I will never understand why folks on this board will give up on a Day 1 or 2 OL or DL in less than half a season, but will cling to hope for a Day 3 RB or WR for years.  

Right. Keep doing what’s working so well and not change a thing with our league worst run game. Brilliant solution.

[ezekiel23]

(11-26-2023, 06:23 PM)Millhouse Wrote: Backup QB (barely any experience) - check
Late November game with iffy weather - check
Going against below average Pitt rush defense - check
.
.
.
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Rush it for 8 times (for 16 yards) - check check check.

I put this loss on Taylor and company. Browning is what he is right now. Defense was out there 37 minutes to the offense's 23 minutes, and did enough for a win. But to utilize the run game like they did is about as bad as I have seen. At this point, I am pretty much in the camp that the entire offensive coaching staff needs a big shakeup.

With the Offensive scheme that the coaching staff displayed out there today,if I didn’t know better,I would think they were trying to deliberately tank the remaining season.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-26-2023, 10:57 PM)ezekiel23 Wrote: With the Offensive scheme that the coaching staff displayed out there today,if I didn’t know better,I would think they were trying to deliberately tank the remaining season.

They ran the same Burrow offense.

Tanking causes young guys to play. They don't do that. 

[reuben.ahmed]

(11-26-2023, 09:57 PM)Whatever Wrote: Why would they?  We ran less than 40 plays on offense today and none of them were with the game out of reach for either team.  

Because Mixon is terrible. I'd be surprised if he's the starting RB next year, won't win a superbowl with him. He's just that single thorn that Burrow won't be able to hurdle (amongst everything else he's hurdling) - having no run game whatsoever. Don't care if he runs for 200 next game, he's consistently bad.

Gotta love the Zac quote that Mixon is not the reason they lost today (when questioned about his 16 yards rushing). It's not like it helped, when you blame everyone nothing changes. Zac's record without Burrow is going to be hilariously bad after this season.

Callahan had a very interesting quote that they basically go away from the run game when "it doesn't work" for 1-2 plays. It's hard to say if he's talking about himself or Zac, yet another no taking responsibility situation.

[Whatever]

(11-26-2023, 10:17 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Right. Keep doing what’s working so well and not change a thing with our league worst run game. Brilliant solution.

Change for the sake of change accomplishes nothing.  What has Chase Brown shown anybody on this board that indicates he should be playing?  Nothing, because he has performed at a poor level every time he's taken the field at the NFL level.  

[Whatever]

(11-26-2023, 11:06 PM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: Because Mixon is terrible. I'd be surprised if he's the starting RB next year, won't win a superbowl with him. He's just that single thorn that Burrow won't be able to hurdle (amongst everything else he's hurdling) - having no run game whatsoever. Don't care if he runs for 200 next game, he's consistently bad.

Gotta love the Zac quote that Mixon is not the reason they lost today (when questioned about his 16 yards rushing). It's not like it helped, when you blame everyone nothing changes. Zac's record without Burrow is going to be hilariously bad after this season.

Callahan had a very interesting quote that they basically go away from the run game when "it doesn't work" for 1-2 plays. It's hard to say if he's talking about himself or Zac, yet another no taking responsibility situation.

Mixon may be terrible.  He's also the best RB we have as proven through performance.  There's a reason Brown is a 4th stringer and can't even beat out guys like Williams and Evans.  Just because Mixon may not be the answer doesn't mean Brown is.  The beat writers that cover the team have seen plenty of Brown in practice.  If they aren't asking the question, there's a good reason why.

[Whatever]

(11-26-2023, 10:06 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: At draft time, some act like we got 7 stars.

It's fine to have high hopes for every draft pick.  It's bad to have high expectations for every pick.

There's been successful starters at every position that were drafted on Day 3.  Those are the exceptions, not the rule, though.  

It doesn't help that the majority of people on the board have an aversion to drafting skill players high.  I can't imagine this board if they decided to start a 5th round pick who looked terrible in the preseason at OT, but for some reason, it would be fine if it was at RB.  

[NUGDUKWE]

(11-26-2023, 11:06 PM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: Because Mixon is terrible. I'd be surprised if he's the starting RB next year, won't win a superbowl with him. He's just that single thorn that Burrow won't be able to hurdle (amongst everything else he's hurdling) - having no run game whatsoever. Don't care if he runs for 200 next game, he's consistently bad.

Gotta love the Zac quote that Mixon is not the reason they lost today (when questioned about his 16 yards rushing). It's not like it helped, when you blame everyone nothing changes. Zac's record without Burrow is going to be hilariously bad after this season.

Callahan had a very interesting quote that they basically go away from the run game when "it doesn't work" for 1-2 plays. It's hard to say if he's talking about himself or Zac, yet another no taking responsibility situation.

I still don't think it's as much on Mixon as everyone wants to put on him. Does he have his faults? Yes. Has he lost some tread on the tires? Probably. Do I think we need to get a new quick back this offseason that can be a #1 to atleast split with Mixon this offseason? Absolutely. But I still think most of the blame on the run game falls elsewhere. 

[NUGDUKWE]

(11-26-2023, 11:39 PM)Whatever Wrote: Mixon may be terrible.  He's also the best RB we have as proven through performance.  There's a reason Brown is a 4th stringer and can't even beat out guys like Williams and Evans.  Just because Mixon may not be the answer doesn't mean Brown is.  The beat writers that cover the team have seen plenty of Brown in practice.  If they aren't asking the question, there's a good reason why.

I disagree on the Mixon is terrible statement. But what i really wanted to say is Brown has been injured and this his 1st game back from injury Evans was a healthy scratch. I honestly don't think our coaches look at the running game as an avenue for success. Sure it's easy to look at this game and say 2 ypc no wonder we don't run the ball. But it's happened multiple times this year that Mixon pops off some 5-10yd runs and we completely forget about the run game. I mean Chris Evans literally has 2 carries this year 1 was 5 yd carry the other was a 7 yd carry and we never give him another chance. Not to mention he had shown good hands and a little bit of shiftiness to pick up the 1st down yet we never give him any targets. We need a fresh breath of air in offensive playcalling. 

[THE PISTONS]

(11-26-2023, 11:59 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I still don't think it's as much on Mixon as everyone wants to put on him. Does he have his faults? Yes. Has he lost some tread on the tires? Probably. Do I think we need to get a new quick back this offseason that can be a #1 to atleast split with Mixon this offseason? Absolutely. But I still think most of the blame on the run game falls elsewhere. 

It's a mix. Teams blitz us because we pass so much and that hurts running too.

Playcalls are predictable.

That said, Mixon isn't the fastest guy nor is he elusive.

[NUGDUKWE]

(11-27-2023, 12:11 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: It's a mix. Teams blitz us because we pass so much and that hurts running too.


Playcalls are predictable.

That said, Mixon isn't the fastest guy nor is he elusive.

I've said it in the past multiple times with Mixon. He's an odd back to judge and I use 2019 as an example. That year he had 4 games in the beginning of the year that he went 6 for 10, 11 for 17, 8 for 10 and 10 for 2. That was during the first half of the season. The 2nd half he was the 2nd best back in the league. Not sure what changed other than blocking scheme and or an emphasis on the run game. My point is he can look terrible but when used correctly be a top back in the league. Not sure that it still holds true today but that is the difference coaching and execution can have on his game. 

[Bengalstripes9]

Bengals need to learn how to win with their defense and running game alone. If they can do this we will have more ways we can win as a team. A lot of afc north games are won with defense and running game, as well as bad weather and late season games.

[NUGDUKWE]

(11-27-2023, 12:42 AM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I've said it in the past multiple times with Mixon. He's an odd back to judge and I use 2019 as an example. That year he had 4 games in the beginning of the year that he went 6 for 10, 11 for 17, 8 for 10 and 10 for 2. That was during the first half of the season. The 2nd half he was the 2nd best back in the league. Not sure what changed other than blocking scheme and or an emphasis on the run game. My point is he can look terrible but when used correctly be a top back in the league. Not sure that it still holds true today but that is the difference coaching and execution can have on his game. 

I guess I'm quoting myself. But I just wanted to add something to this. When I went back and looked at 2019 Zac Taylor's first game looks like it was a sign of the kind of OC he wants to be. In our 1 pt loss to Seattle we ran the ball 14 times and had Dalton throw the ball 51 times.
I will say Mixon had 6 of the 14 carries and we only averaged 2.4 ypc overall. But I already said how Mixon finished the 2nd half of the season as the #2 back. But he came into 2019 after being the #4 back in the league with 4.9 ypc. So Taylor taking over as a 1st time head coach while calling the plays on a team that AJ Green was hurt and not playing (missed the whole year) was too dumb to understand that he he had a top 5 back that averaged 4.9 ypc or was too dump to see how the other staff had the personnel block for him. We are fooling ourselves if we think this staff will change.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-27-2023, 01:01 AM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I guess I'm quoting myself. But I just wanted to add something to this. When I went back and looked at 2019 Zac Taylor's first game looks like it was a sign of the kind of OC he wants to be. In our 1 pt loss to Seattle we ran the ball 14 times and had Dalton throw the ball 51 times.
I will say Mixon had 6 of the 14 carries and we only averaged 2.4 ypc overall. But I already said how Mixon finished the 2nd half of the season as the #2 back. But he came into 2019 after being the #4 back in the league with 4.9 ypc. So Taylor taking over as a 1st time head coach while calling the plays on a team that AJ Green was hurt and not playing (missed the whole year) was too dumb to understand that he he had a top 5 back that averaged 4.9 ypc or was too dump to see how the other staff had the personnel block for him. We are fooling ourselves if we think this staff will change.

Zac calls plays like he's playing Madden.

[NUGDUKWE]

(11-26-2023, 10:17 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Right. Keep doing what’s working so well and not change a thing with our league worst run game. Brilliant solution.

Right. I mean I wasn't thrilled with how Brown looked in the preseason but he did flash on a big catch and run. I can only hope it being his 1st game back from injury and all is why we didn't see him. But how we've refused to give anyone else an opportunity it is doubtful that's the reason. I mean we have to give him reps down the stretch here or else why did we waste a draft pick on him. We need to see what we have in him because we are gonna need to at the very least get a potential Mixon replacement on the roster next year. Not saying Brown is that guy but we have no idea what he is unless we use him.

[NUGDUKWE]

(11-26-2023, 10:57 PM)ezekiel23 Wrote: With the Offensive scheme that the coaching staff displayed out there today,if I didn’t know better,I would think they were trying to deliberately tank the remaining season.

Please let's not give them the credit for having some underlying plan for being so terrible. I already feel like we did this for the 2019 season.

[SunsetBengal]

(11-26-2023, 10:02 PM)Boomer Anderson Wrote: It's really difficult to run from the shotgun instead of under center.  Can't build up momentum.

Please draft a strong, fast game-changing edge rusher in the first and then 6 straight O Lineman.

In football, one way or another, games are always won or lost in the trenches.

Some of us were asking for this, even before Burrow went down with the injury.  This cult like adherence to the shotgun, 11 personnel formation is really making the team so one dimensional to defend.  If it wasn't exactly blowing teams away with Joe Burrow leading the charge, what in the hell would make Zac Taylor believe that it was the right situation to throw Jake Browning into?

Many around here want to look at the individual failure of players and the OL as a unit, and say that they need to be replace with better players.  Well, they did that.  Those players aren't even able to play up to levels that they had established with their previous teams.  It's so much less about the personnel on the field, than it is so much more about the scheme, play calling and coaching failing to change and adapt to ever evolving defenses.