2016 and Forward: A Hypothethical

[BFritz21]

(12-30-2015, 06:22 PM)J24 Wrote: I agree it was a bad call but its stupid to blame him for Andy's injury. 

If he doesn't make that call, Dalton doesn't get injured.

Only bad things can happen when you call a stupid play like that in that condensed of an area because the entire principle of running a screen is to get everyone over-pursuing and get the ball to the back in space, which can't happen inside the five yard line.

[wolfkaosaun]

(12-30-2015, 07:06 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: If he doesn't make that call, Dalton doesn't get injured.

Only bad things can happen when you call a stupid play like that in that condensed of an area because the entire principle of running a screen is to get everyone over-pursuing and get the ball to the back in space, which can't happen inside the five yard line.

If Bob Bratkowski doesn't call a deep pass on the 2nd play in the playoff game, Palmer doesn't tear his ACL.

It's 20-20. Injuries happen. There's no one to blame for this injury. Was it a bad call? Yes. Did it result in the injury? Yes. Is it Hue's fault that Dalton's thumb broke on the Steelers knee? No.

[BFritz21]

(12-30-2015, 07:58 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: If Bob Bratkowski doesn't call a deep pass on the 2nd play in the playoff game, Palmer doesn't tear his ACL.

It's 20-20. Injuries happen. There's no one to blame for this injury. Was it a bad call? Yes. Did it result in the injury? Yes. Is it Hue's fault that Dalton's thumb broke on the Steelers knee? No.

But the deep pass was an ok call because it was normal for the circumstance and would have been a great call if not for the freak injury.  It was a normal call (actually, it was a good call) where something bad happened, whereas Hue's call was a bad call where something bad happened.  

[Daddy-O]

(12-30-2015, 05:34 PM)Bengal Dude Wrote: What happens if we lose in the first round?

It's simple. Marvin will remain the head coach. Hue will get hired to be a head coach somewhere else. Free agency will come and go with a mediocre signing or two. Iloka will probably be tagged while we work on an extension with Jones. The owners' meeting will come with the news that Marvin has received another 1 year extension to prevent him from being a lame duck. We'll have another A-/B+ type of draft and enter the 2016 season just like we entered this one.

I agree with everything said here. Although I'm getting tired of Marvin's in-game coaching he is still very stable from a coaching perspective.  You can't underestimate consistency and continuity.  We have that with Marvin.

Firing a coach doesn't always work, just ask Phily and San Fran.  Maybe Marvin will eventually figure out the part of the job from whistle to whistle?? 

[Harmening]

(12-30-2015, 08:12 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: But the deep pass was an ok call because it was normal for the circumstance and would have been a great call if not for the freak injury.  It was a normal call (actually, it was a good call) where something bad happened, whereas Hue's call was a bad call where something bad happened.  

Still doesn't make it Hue's fault for Daltons injury. 
You also stated that if Hue doesn't make that call, Dalton doesn't get injured. You don't know that, nor does anyone else on this Earth. 

[StLucieBengal]

Yeah let's fire the only coach who has brought us back from the dead.     Mike Shula is a hot commodity now or so I hear ..... Maybe we can hire him.    Would fit right in with the path some want us to take I guess.  

Shula for Bengals HC!!!!!!!!!

[BengalChris]

(12-30-2015, 01:36 AM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: Lets suppose for a moment that, regardless of QB situation, that we lost in the postseason to the likely Jets.

Where does the organization move from here. Does ownership do the unthinkable and fire Marvin Lewis? A lot of people may think no, but I think it will happen. Heres why.


Media around the NFL started mentioning it as the season started. This year we had the best roster since the mythical team from the 80s. It's going to be tragic to see that go to waste and a Free Agency period that is going to be devastating to the point that the team can only regress--even if slightly. Mike Brown only giving Marvin one year contracts arouses my suspicion as well. Why isn't he able to commit his unconditional love for Marvin for the long-run? If the front office though lewis was the answer, then surely he would've gotten a contract lasting longer for one year.


Also, say what you want about the guy. He has had 14 years. 14 years to win a playoff game. I think Stephen A Smith said it best when we lost to the Chargers.

But what do you guys think. If this team tragically goes one and down again, does anything change?

Mikey B is not going to fire Marvin. That's pretty much assured. Marv might quit though.


There was nothing mythical about either of the two super bowl teams from the 80's. They were better than this team and proved it on the field for the entire season.

We can hope the front office resigns the key guys and we draft well. It'll be another year next year and our backup QB will have a few games of real experience under his belt.

[Atomic Orange]

(12-30-2015, 02:00 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Remember when the Reds got tired of just making he playoffs?

Remember when Jon Gruden took Tony Dungy's team to the SB and won a year after he left?

[Bengal Dude]

(12-31-2015, 03:40 AM)Atomic Orange Wrote: Remember when Jon Gruden took Tony Dungy's team to the SB and won a year after he left?

And beat the team that Gruden built up in Oakland.

[Yojimbo]

Best case scenario: Katie finally takes over complete control, persuades Lewis to resign, Hue or Vance take over as HC.T

[StLucieBengal]

(12-31-2015, 05:45 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Best case scenario: Katie finally takes over complete control, persuades Lewis to resign, Hue or Vance take over as HC.T

Why do you think the grass is greener with Hue as HC or Vance Joseph?

Loads here bash the heck out of Hue as it is ..... And Vance hasn't even been a coordinator.

The marvin hate around here has gone way overboard . Yes he makes mistakes and yes we lose games we should win. ... Somehow he seems to always win enough to qualify for the postseason. We will get over that hump. Unless of course we follow the tear the whole thing down approach some are advocating.

Marvin is one of the best coaches in the league. When you look at it from an honest lense that's the case.

[StLucieBengal]

(12-31-2015, 03:40 AM)Atomic Orange Wrote: Remember when Jon Gruden took Tony Dungy's team to the SB and won a year after he left?

Didn't dungy go on to win a super bowl in Indy and go on to have the decades best record. And he lasted long after Gruden was fired and Tampa has been a mess since.

[Bengal Dude]

(12-31-2015, 05:53 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Why do you think the grass is greener with Hue as HC or Vance Joseph?

Loads here bash the heck out of Hue as it is .....  And Vance hasn't even been a coordinator.    

The marvin hate around here has gone way overboard .   Yes he makes mistakes and yes we lose games we should win. ... Somehow he seems to always win enough to qualify for the postseason.    We will get over that hump.   Unless of course we follow the tear the whole thing down approach some are advocating.    

Marvin is one of the best coaches in the league.  When you look at it from an honest lense that's the case.

If we promote Hue or Vance, I don't see that as a tear down approach. They would probably keep a lot of things the same. When Hue was coaching the Raiders and traded for Carson, Carson said that it didn't take long to learn the playbook because it was so similar to Cincy's.

[Yojimbo]

(12-31-2015, 05:53 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Why do you think the grass is greener with Hue as HC or Vance Joseph?

Loads here bash the heck out of Hue as it is .....  And Vance hasn't even been a coordinator.    

The marvin hate around here has gone way overboard .   Yes he makes mistakes and yes we lose games we should win. ... Somehow he seems to always win enough to qualify for the postseason.    We will get over that hump.   Unless of course we follow the tear the whole thing down approach some are advocating.    

Marvin is one of the best coaches in the league.  When you look at it from an honest lense that's the case.

I have no ide how Hue or Vance would do as HC. I DO know how Lewis is as a HC and I'm sick of the status quo and accepting mediocrity for the sake of stability. Time to shake things up.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(12-30-2015, 02:00 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Remember when the Reds got tired of just making he playoffs?

Apples and oranges.

The Reds drafted HORRIBLY for the better part of a decade under Jocketty, so their farm system became a dumpster fire. They had to trade away 4/5th of their rotation because they couldn't afford to keep them since there's no salary cap in MLB and FA prices are becoming absolutely ridiculous (MLB leader in HR allowed and earned runs last year got 5yr/$90m in FA this offseason). Meanwhile Jocketty also kept signing terrible deals, like Brandon Phillips, Homer Bailey, Kevin Gregg, Ryan Ludwick, Skip Schumaker, Jason Marquis, Ramon Santiago, Jack Hannahan, etc. They also decided the best arm in all of baseball should pitch 60 innings a year (and only with a 1-3 run lead) rather than 200+ innings a year.

Then when it finally came time to rebuild because they missed their window, they decided not to and instead tried to slap some bandaids on the team (see: Gregg, Marquis, Byrd) and have a hope and a prayer that every single thing went their way to try to win something rather than make a short quick rebuild that'd see them competing once again in just a year. It (predictably) failed.

Nothing similar to Marvin.

- - - - -
Remember when the Buccaneers got tired of just making the playoffs? They hired Gruden and won the SB that year.

It works both ways. Change can be good, even if you're just terrified of memories of the 90s and love you some mediocrity.

The Bengals should have never let Zimmer get away. He should have been made the HC so he'd never leave.

[jfkbengals]

(12-30-2015, 06:56 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: From reports I read, they did want Zimmer to take one more year to stay with the Bengals and see how the season goes. Ultimately, he went to the Vikings anyway.

The Bengals got hurt with injuries and many used injuries as excuses for the playoff loss.

Which might be how this year goes. A big 'WHAT IF' due to Dalton's injury

Of course they wanted him to take another year, and then another 5 after that.  Hell they didn't want him to leave at all, but the Vikings are the ONLY team to ever make him an offer to be the HC, so of course he was going to take it.

[Atomic Orange]

(12-31-2015, 05:55 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Didn't dungy go on to win a super bowl in Indy and go on to have the decades best record.   And he lasted long after Gruden was fired and Tampa has been a mess since.

Yeas he did, yet many believe that with Peyton Manning they probably should have won a couple more. Who cares what happened after Gruden left they won a damn Superbowl. It appears you are happy just making the playoffs and that is fine if you are cool with that, unfortunately I no longer am. I want to win a Superbowl

or bust. 

[BonnieBengal]

(12-31-2015, 10:00 PM)jfkbengals Wrote: Of course they wanted him to take another year, and then another 5 after that.  Hell they didn't want him to leave at all, but the Vikings are the ONLY team to ever make him an offer to be the HC, so of course he was going to take it.

What he's done with that team is pretty remarkable.  He inherited a bottom ranked defense and made it one of the best in the league.  

[Beaker]

(12-31-2015, 10:28 PM)BonnieBengal Wrote: What he's done with that team is pretty remarkable.  He inherited a bottom ranked defense and made it one of the best in the league.  

Why is that remarkable? He did the same thing here. Its more status quo for Zimmer than remarkable.

[tigerseye]

I think ML will be the coach here as long as he wants. ML has brought this team a long way and I think that he is continually getting better.  The team is good enough to win the SB this year ,so I think he has done a great job. (along with the rest of the organization ) Everything is in place ,the players and coaches just needs to finish. The team just has to realize that they can do it. There is a point that it is on the players ,the coaches can only take them so far, then it is on them. It can't be show up one game then not the next. They just have to step up and take what they want.

ML for President.