(01-11-2016, 01:31 PM)JS-Steelerfan Wrote: Dude, Gilberry walked UP TO Porter in that video. He was not previously engaged with him. He had no business bumping him from behind, whether Porter was on the field legally or not. It is not his job to enforce the rules, especially with shoving. Surely even you can admit that this was not incidental.
Also, how about Burfict shoving a trainer - a trainer! - in that video?
Look, I'll admit that the Steelers weren't angels, built come on ... Stop trying to pretend that the Bengals are innocent victims here.
Um.....the trainer smacked his hand away....but why let facts get in the way of a good ol gang up....amirite? I've seen like five contradictions so far....keep moving the goalposts and eventually it may wind up someone else's fault.
(01-11-2016, 05:55 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: If you hit a defenseless receiver in the head, using any part of your body, you will get a PF thrown at you. Period. That is what happened.
Unless it's on Bernard....then it's just "unfortunate".
I can't speak for everyone else....but aside from the need for offsetting penalties....I'm just sick of the media narrative that the Stoolers are somehow innocent victims in all of this.
(01-11-2016, 10:20 PM)Wyche Wrote: Unless it's on Bernard....then it's just "unfortunate".
I can't speak for everyone else....but aside from the need for offsetting penalties....I'm just sick of the media narrative that the Stoolers are somehow innocent victims in all of this.
It was a missed call but one that cost the Steelers.
They don't miss that call, Ben doesn't get hurt 4 plays later. Ben doesn't get hurt, the offense doesn't grind to a halt. The offense doesn't grind to a halt, the Bengals have less time to work with.
Average TOP per possession with Ben = 2:35
Average TOP per possession with Jones = 1:15
Refs don't miss that call, the Bengals have 3 to 4 less minutes of clock to mount a comeback.
(01-11-2016, 10:20 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Unless it's on Bernard....then it's just "unfortunate".
I can't speak for everyone else....but aside from the need for offsetting penalties....I'm just sick of the media narrative that the Stoolers are somehow innocent victims in all of this.
Except Gio was not a defenseless receiver. I've also stated that was a blown call, though, because it violated a different rule.
(01-11-2016, 10:30 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Except Gio was not a defenseless receiver. I've also stated that was a blown call, though, because it violated a different rule.
Well.....according to that hack , Carey , Gio took two whole steps making him a runner. Ok then , Bryant took two steps , but Williams got the flag early on in the game.......so which is it ? Oh that pesky thing called a memory....amirite?
The Williams call was BS....and the no call on Gio was BS. Shazier led with the crown outside of the tackle box.....therefore , penalty.
It's stuff like this that led to the free for all.....the subsequent media ass kiss is fanning those flames.
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(01-11-2016, 08:01 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I don't follow your logic here.
Doesn't surprise me.
You say that you don't have enough evidence to conclude that the refs were biased, do you follow me so far?
Then, you say that Porter being on the field illegally caused Jones to touch the ref, do you follow so far?
Yet they call Jones for bumping the ref while he was going after a COACH THAT WAS DRESSED IN NORMAL CLOTHES, which I put that in caps lock so you realize that they couldn't have mistaken him for a player and thought that he was on the field legally.
You still follow?
Therefore, they were obviously bias in calling a penalty on Jones when the flag should have been on Porter and Jones never even should have had a chance to try and shove Porter and mistakingly bumping the ref.
Let's sum it all up: You can't say the refs weren't biased when you also say that they allowed a Steelers player to break the rules first and provoke a Bengals player.
I hope I didn't lose ya anywhere in there.
(01-11-2016, 08:01 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I said things that were going on. Gilberry could have been called for his helmet being off or bumping Porter, yet he wasn't. Already pointed that out. The officials let things get out of hand with their leniency, but when Jones touched an official that was it. The rule about that leaves no room for ambiguity and discretion like the others. He wasn't pushed into the official or anything, he made that decision. No one is to blame there but himself, and it's not biased.
Refs get run into all the time in the field of play. I've seen players shake hands with refs or hug refs (Doug Martin), yet they weren't flagged.
(01-11-2016, 10:36 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: Well.....according to that hack , Carey , Gio took two whole steps making him a runner. Ok then , Bryant took two steps , but Williams got the flag early on in the game.......so which is it ? Oh that pesky thing called a memory....amirite?
The Williams call was BS....and the no call on Gio was BS. Shazier led with the crown outside of the tackle box.....therefore , penalty.
Do you mean the Wheaton hit? Also, steps aren't the only part of it. A football move is also required. That being said, I said from the get go I feel that Wheaton was a runner. So you're preaching to the choir on that.
You say that you don't have enough evidence to conclude that the refs were biased, do you follow me so far?
Then, you say that Porter being on the field illegally caused Jones to touch the ref, do you follow so far?
Yet they call Jones for bumping the ref while he was going after a COACH THAT WAS DRESSED IN NORMAL CLOTHES, which I put that in caps lock so you realize that they couldn't have mistaken him for a player and thought that he was on the field legally.
You still follow?
Therefore, they were obviously bias in calling a penalty on Jones when the flag should have been on Porter and Jones never even should have had a chance to try and shove Porter and mistakingly bumping the ref.
Let's sum it all up: You can't say the refs weren't biased when you also say that they allowed a Steelers player to break the rules first and provoke a Bengals player.
I hope I didn't lose ya anywhere in there.
Refs get run into all the time in the field of play. I've seen players shake hands with refs or hug refs (Doug Martin), yet they weren't flagged.
Sounds like ambiguity to me.
There is no ambiguity in the rule. As for the part up top, let me see if I can get you to understand me. I said I did not have enough evidence to conclude the refs were biased. That's a period there. I wasn't talking about that one call (even though I made my position abundantly clear on that as well), I was saying overall. I said there was no bias (not that there is a lack of evidence for me) in the call because there were multiple infractions going on, but it took Jones hitting a ref to draw the flag. A penalty so egregious it is mentioned in the rules as being necessary to report to the Commissioner.
(01-11-2016, 10:43 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Do you mean the Wheaton hit? Also, steps aren't the only part of it. A football move is also required. That being said, I said from the get go I feel that Wheaton was a runner. So you're preaching to the choir on that.
Wheaton.....Bryant.....who gives a shit......yeah the hit by Sean Williams. It was a textbook tackle. I know about the football move , but that needle dick Carey kept harping over and over Bernard took two steps....took two steps.....took two steps....well , so did Wheaton! So which is it Mike ?
We beat ourselves.....it's the painting us as the black hats......the Steelers as both the white hats and the damsel in distress.....and the gift wrap at the end that sickens me.
(01-11-2016, 03:17 PM)GMDino Wrote: And other than the PF on Foster (for, uh, moving his foot after it was stepped on?) I'm not arguing them.
I *do* think that had the officials thrown a couple (any) 15 yarders on the Bengals for some of the post whistle stuff maybe the game calms down.
But then I look at Burfict and Jones and realize there were going to do something stupid sooner or later.
Your facts are off. It was pitt players that were instigating post-whistle shenanigans. Like always. Hell, your team has 3 coaches that have been fined in the last couple years.
3 coaches!
Dirty ass team from the top down.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(01-11-2016, 06:01 PM)JS-Steelerfan Wrote: Watch the video of Burfict closely. His helmet DID hit Brown before his shoulder did. Watch the angle at that is shown at the 0:17 second mark.
Porter should have been flagged. But that doesn't excuse anyone from shoving him from behind, especially if he had to travel several yards to do it. But that was Gilberry. Jones wasn't flagged for shoving Porter. He was flagged for shoving a ref. Gilberry's shove of Porter went uncalled, as did Burfict's shove of a Steeler trainer.
But no matter who did what, they are responsible for their own actions. Porter getting away with being out there does not excuse them from any wrongdoings they themselves commit.
By the way: the rule prohibiting coaches on the field is written in such a way that the refs have the authority to allow non-players and non-trainers on the field during a time out. They are not bound to calling penalties in that situation - they can use their own discretion.
Burfict's helmet never contacts Brown. His shoulder gave a glancing to, at worst, moderate blow.
Be smarter than this.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(01-11-2016, 06:20 PM)SteelCitySouth Wrote: They called a flag because any....I'll repeat that for ya....Any contact by the defender to the head/neck area of a defenseless receiver is a personal foul.
100% correct. Too bad the vast majority of steelers fans on this board choose to make shit up like his helmet his Brown first, or the hit was the dirtiest thing that's ever happened in the history of the world. It was a run of the mill illegal contact.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
Either or both team attendants and their helpers may enter the field to attend their team during a team timeout by either team. No other non-player may come on the field without the Referee’s permission, unless he is an incoming substitute (5-2-2).
During any team timeout, all playing rules continue in force. Representatives of either team are prohibited from entering the field unless they are incoming substitutes, or team attendants or trainers entering to provide for the welfare of a player, and any game-type activities are prohibited on the Field of Play.
You need referee's permission to be on field. Given Porter was out there for some time and in the presence of the ref's, I think that permission is implicit at that point. It's rare but not unusual for coaches to be on the field during an injury.
There's usually not a problem because other coaches that come onto the field aren't rancid turds like Porter; whose only intent was to provoke a Bengals defender.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(01-11-2016, 06:55 PM)Benton Wrote: And that's part of where the ref's failed. It's their discretion. In a game where they were supposed to be holding everything close to the line — and a game where they knew things could get out of hand — they should not have allowed a linebackers coach onto the field to check on a receiver.
The Steelers allowed a young position coach from another position to go onto the field to check on a player.
Porter fits in with that coaching crew. Scuzziest bunch of cheaters.
And their scuzzy head coach gave him a game ball, apparently, for drawing the flag.
If the Steelers aren't the worst case of human trash playing/coaching and owning in the NFL...i can't think of anyone else that's even close.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(01-11-2016, 06:56 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here.
Okay, I think you're trying to say if Porter hadn't been on the field, Jones wouldn't have touched the official. I agree. and I have said before that Porter should have been flagged. So could any number of things going on in that instance.
I never said the refs weren't biased, I don't have enough information to draw that conclusion. What I said was that the call there was not biased. There was a lot of leniency for both sides in that instance, until Jones touched an official. I don't call that bias, I call that having to draw a line somewhere.
Adam Jones flying in, to try and show how much of a man he is, and making contact with an official--causing another 15yd penalty--is in the running for, literally, the stupidest incident ever in an NFL game, given all the circumstances.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
(01-11-2016, 07:17 PM)StrictlyBiz Wrote: Perhaps.
But also why were six Bengals allowed to be around an injured Steelers player? When Bernard was hurt Mike Mitchell was the only player nearby.
Given the nature of the game, shouldn't the ref's gotten the Bengal defenders out of there? Or maybe some of the Bengals coaches?
Because Bernard was actually hurt to the extent he appeared to be.
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
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