Remember how Dalton's rookie season was one of best ever?

[fredtoast]

Before Dalton arrived in the NFL only two rookie QBs had thrown for 3000 yards and 20 tds (Jim Kelly, Peyton Manning). It seemed like a huge accomplishment when he did it in 2011.

Now it appears that Dalton just arrived at the right time.  Not only did Cam Newton match Dalton with 3000 yds and 20 tds in 2011, but in the 4 seasons since then 5 more rookies have done it (Luck, Griffen, Wilson '12, Carr '14, Winston '15).  Luck, Winston and Newton all had 4000 yds and 20 tds.

In the five years that Dalton has been in the league 7 other rookie starters (350+ att) have posted a higher passer rating than Dalton's 80.4. Griffen (102.4), Wilson (100.0), Mariota (91.5), Bridgewater (85.2), Newton (84.5), Winston (84.2), and Glennon (83.9).



It may be a bad idea for me to post this so soon after my last Dalton thread.  So let me make it clear that many of the QBs that had great rookie seasons fizzled out, and nothing Dalton did as a rookie can take away from what he did in '15.  So this is not really a "bash Andy" thread.  Instead it is just some interesting information I came across.

[fredtoast]

Also Dalton walked into a Dumpster fire with a rookie OC from the arena league and a rookie #1 WR.

And they didn't have all the off season OTAs and minicamps to install the offense because of the players strike.

[Brownshoe]

(03-24-2016, 01:48 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Also Dalton walked into a Dumpster fire with a rookie OC from the arena league and a rookie #1 WR.  

And they didn't have all the off season OTAs and minicamps to install the offense because of the players strike.

I think the only offensive weapon we had in 2011 that's still starting anywhere in the league is AJ Green.

[CageTheBengal]

That was a surprisingly good season when expectations were really low. I never thought we were going to be as bad as a lot of the experts predicted us to be but I thought 7-9 or 8-8 was possible. Never predicted playoffs.

[Shake n Blake]

I think Dalton (and AJ Green of course) played a bigger role in the turnaround than some will ever admit.

He stabilized us at the most important position and he's produced well. He's played well in almost all of our wins, and he's had some moments where he carried the team to wins or was a key player for us in those games.

He (like everyone else on the team) has to win in the playoffs to get true respect though.

[muskiesfan]

(03-24-2016, 06:51 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I think Dalton (and AJ Green of course) played a bigger role in the turnaround than some will ever admit.

He stabilized us at the most important position and he's produced well. He's played well in almost all of our wins, and he's had some moments where he carried the team to wins or was a key player for us in those games.

He (like everyone else on the team) has to win in the playoffs to get true respect though.

I cannot rep this enough. Andy has done a lot to help turn this franchise into the consistent winner that it is. I understand that he has not won in the postseason yet, but you don't get to play playoff games if you shit the bed during the season. Andy IS a franchise QB and he is THE franchise QB of this team.

[Shake n Blake]

(03-24-2016, 07:24 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: I cannot rep this enough. Andy has done a lot to help turn this franchise into the consistent winner that it is. I understand that he has not won in the postseason yet, but you don't get to play playoff games if you shit the bed during the season. Andy IS a franchise QB and he is THE franchise QB of this team.

Agreed. He really is a franchise guy. I think we can stop debating on that. Andy is the guy they should continually build around for 10 more years. 

They've just got to get the playoff monkey off their backs. It feels like they're close. As tough as this latest loss was to stomach, I was encouraged for once by what I saw. The defense played like they're capable of and our big stars made plays. We haven't really seen any of that in the previous 4 games. Give us that and a healthy Dalton and I think this team will go far.

[XenoMorph]

(03-24-2016, 06:51 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: He (like everyone else on the team) has to win in the playoffs to get true respect though.

and really the only reason thats such a focus here is the 20 years of failure before he even entered the draft.

[Brownshoe]

(03-25-2016, 09:50 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: and really the only reason thats such a focus here is the 20 years of failure before he even entered the draft.

Even though the Bengals only went to the playoffs twice in those 20 years and the Dalton lead Bengals haven't missed one in the 5 years he's been here he's still considered bad because he hasn't won a playoff game yet.

It would be like Blake Bortles turning the Jags around and bringing them to the playoffs every year. And then say he sucks because he hasn't won a playoff game even though he took a team that couldn't even get in the playoffs barley at all. and the team gets better every consecutive year after he was drafted.

[Shake n Blake]

(03-25-2016, 09:50 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: and really the only reason thats such a focus here is the 20 years of failure before he even entered the draft.

It would be a focus now regardless, considering they've lost a ridiculous 5 in a row. I think that's a record, Xeno.

It's not just a focus for Bengals fans, it's a point of emphasis for the actual team. Thanks to their OWN failures, not failures of 20 years ago.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

I can't wait for the season to start just to see if Dalton gets even better than he did last year.

Every year, Dalton has gotten better and better, the team has gotten better and better. If the trend continues, what will next season be like?

If I'm remembering correctly

2011 the Bengals were 9-7
2012 the Bengals were 10-6
2013 the Bengals were 11-5
2014 the Bengals were 10-5-1 winning % is better than the year before I think
2015 the Bengals were 12-4

The way the Bengals are going, in 7 more years with Dalton as QB, they will go 19-0

[XenoMorph]

(03-24-2016, 01:45 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Before Dalton arrived in the NFL only two rookie QBs had thrown for 3000 yards and 20 tds (Jim Kelly, Peyton Manning). It seemed like a huge accomplishment when he did it in 2011.

Now it appears that Dalton just arrived at the right time.  Not only did Cam Newton match Dalton with 3000 yds and 20 tds in 2011, but in the 4 seasons since then 5 more rookies have done it (Luck, Griffen, Wilson '12, Carr '14, Winston '15).  Luck, Winston and Newton all had 4000 yds and 20 tds.

In the five years that Dalton has been in the league 7 other rookie starters (350+ att) have posted a higher passer rating than Dalton's 80.4. Griffen (102.4), Wilson (100.0), Mariota (91.5), Bridgewater (85.2), Newton (84.5), Winston (84.2), and Glennon (83.9).



It may be a bad idea for me to post this so soon after my last Dalton thread.  So let me make it clear that many of the QBs that had great rookie seasons fizzled out, and nothing Dalton did as a rookie can take away from what he did in '15.  So this is not really a "bash Andy" thread.  Instead it is just some interesting information I came across.

some of this is a result of rookies starting the play right away. and being more prepared to do so.. that said dalton did have a lot working against him when he came to town that first year.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-25-2016, 02:20 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: some of this is a result of rookies starting the play right away. and being more prepared to do so.. that said dalton did have a lot working against him when he came to town that first year.

Not really, it'smuch more of a passing game now than it was when manning entered the league.

Not to say that Andy isn't any good, it's just the way the NFL is trending.

Back to the playoffs, the last 20+ years is on Mike Brown, the last 5 and the future is on Andy.

[TKUHL]

(03-24-2016, 01:45 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Before Dalton arrived in the NFL only two rookie QBs had thrown for 3000 yards and 20 tds (Jim Kelly, Peyton Manning). It seemed like a huge accomplishment when he did it in 2011.

Now it appears that Dalton just arrived at the right time.  Not only did Cam Newton match Dalton with 3000 yds and 20 tds in 2011, but in the 4 seasons since then 5 more rookies have done it (Luck, Griffen, Wilson '12, Carr '14, Winston '15).  Luck, Winston and Newton all had 4000 yds and 20 tds.

In the five years that Dalton has been in the league 7 other rookie starters (350+ att) have posted a higher passer rating than Dalton's 80.4. Griffen (102.4), Wilson (100.0), Mariota (91.5), Bridgewater (85.2), Newton (84.5), Winston (84.2), and Glennon (83.9).



It may be a bad idea for me to post this so soon after my last Dalton thread.  So let me make it clear that many of the QBs that had great rookie seasons fizzled out, and nothing Dalton did as a rookie can take away from what he did in '15.  So this is not really a "bash Andy" thread.  Instead it is just some interesting information I came across.

Its the Rules....Its a pass happy league now, passing records will be broken by players who might not be on a Marino,Montana,Manning level. Kinda sucks really.

[Shake n Blake]

(03-29-2016, 01:38 AM)TKUHL Wrote: Its the Rules....Its a pass happy league now, passing records will be broken by players who might not be on a Marino,Montana,Manning level. Kinda sucks really.

Shoot, just wait til they expand to 18 games. Then ALL the records will fall pretty quickly.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-24-2016, 06:51 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I think Dalton (and AJ Green of course) played a bigger role in the turnaround than some will ever admit.

He stabilized us at the most important position and he's produced well. He's played well in almost all of our wins, and he's had some moments where he carried the team to wins or was a key player for us in those games.

He (like everyone else on the team) has to win in the playoffs to get true respect though.

Nice post Shake as usual. This is just spot on.

[GreenCornBengal]

(03-29-2016, 01:32 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Shoot, just wait til they expand to 18 games. Then ALL the records will fall pretty quickly.

Only Favres iron man record will be safe. Everything else will be surpassed by 2025. I'm sure some QB will have 6000 yards in a season sooner or later.

[Shake n Blake]

(03-29-2016, 01:39 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: Only Favres iron man record will be safe. Everything else will be surpassed by 2025. I'm sure some QB will have 6000 yards in a season sooner or later.

They might just start measuring passing yards in miles. 

[GreenCornBengal]

(03-29-2016, 01:47 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: They might just start measuring passing yards in miles. 

I retract my statement about favres record... when Goodell creates the 5 alligator rule...

[*bfine32*]

I remember there used to be a "Only Andy and Peyton' theme on the Boards after Andy's first 3 years. I cannot remember the specifics but they were the only two to accomplish something great.