Sporting News Ranks AJ McCarron League's Best Backup QB

[*Nately120*]

(07-08-2016, 03:24 PM)grampahol Wrote: Why anyone still thinks Sanchez is going to carry a team is a mystery, but who knows?  Perhaps his time in NY and Philly made him a better player, but I wouldn't bet my best pile of sawdust over it..

I don't think anyone is falling for the narrative that Sanchez is going to do anything but play 3-6 games before he gets injurebenched for Lynch.

[BigSeph]

Oh look, the same tired AJM haters making the same tired criticisms.

Article lists him as best backup QB in the league? Can't hear that, gotta start trashing him on the internet ASAP.....

In his limited time, a sack% 0.2 higher than Russell Wilson, QB rating higher than Roethlisberger, Rivers, Eli, Aaron Rodgers.

2-1 in regular season, losing in OT to the eventual Superbowl champs at their house.

Delivered the Bengals first playoff win in a long time on a platter before Hill gave it back.

Yet some of you are still such irrational haters that you can't even say "Yeah, it's nice to have him, he's a nice backup QB for us."

Andy is the better QB, that's why he's going to start and he had a great season last year. But some of you guys really get upset when others point out the promise and upside of AJM.

Which rate stats would you rather have-

66.4% completions, 1.7% INT, 7.2 YPA, 97.1 QB rating, 9.2 sack%

vs

63.9% completions, 2.9% INT, 6.9 YPA, 86.5 QB rating, 9.0 sack%

?

Because the first one was AJM who is just so bad and the all star defense carried him because he's a sorry game manager, and the second one was Tom Brady in 2001. Tom Brady, who people said was carried by an all star defense (Seymour, Bruschi, Ted Johnson, Vrabel, Ty Law, Lawyer Milloy, etc) and was labeled a game manager.

Am I calling AJM Tom Brady? Absolutely not. But if you look at AJM on tape from last year and Tom Brady on tape from early 2001, they don't look all that different. They had basically the same scouting report heading into the draft. Can AJM make the most out of what he's got? I guess we'll all see. That's the million dollar question. But as he is right now, he's shown he can win football games.

If you want to badmouth having his high-level potential and solid current capabilities as your backup QB, due to some guys that were touting AJM as Dalton's superior, well that just shows how objective your opinion is. Seems like some of you guys are reacting with your emotions rather than your brains.

Glad the Bengals have somebody who can come in if needed and keep the boat afloat.

[Brownshoe]

(07-09-2016, 01:59 PM)McC Wrote: BS on that.  The ten thousand times you have argued with anyone and everyone who said a good thing about him says otherwise.  It's practically a crusade with you.  Calling a spade a spade is one thing.  You, on this subject, are about a hundred levels above that.

Nothing that I said is untrue. I'm just saying what actually happened.

[Brownshoe]

(07-10-2016, 09:06 PM)BigSeph Wrote: Oh look, the same tired AJM haters making the same tired criticisms.

Article lists him as best backup QB in the league?  Can't hear that, gotta start trashing him on the internet ASAP.....

In his limited time, a sack% 0.2 higher than Russell Wilson, QB rating higher than Roethlisberger, Rivers, Eli, Aaron Rodgers.

2-1 in regular season, losing in OT to the eventual Superbowl champs at their house.

Delivered the Bengals first playoff win in a long time on a platter before Hill gave it back.

Yet some of you are still such irrational haters that you can't even say "Yeah, it's nice to have him, he's a nice backup QB for us."

Andy is the better QB, that's why he's going to start and he had a great season last year.  But some of you guys really get upset when others point out the promise and upside of AJM.

Which rate stats would you rather have-

66.4% completions, 1.7% INT, 7.2 YPA, 97.1 QB rating, 9.2 sack%

vs

63.9% completions, 2.9% INT, 6.9 YPA, 86.5 QB rating, 9.0 sack%

?

Because the first one was AJM who is just so bad and the all star defense carried him because he's a sorry game manager, and the second one was Tom Brady in 2001.  Tom Brady, who people said was carried by an all star defense (Seymour, Bruschi, Ted Johnson, Vrabel, Ty Law, Lawyer Milloy, etc) and was labeled a game manager.

Am I calling AJM Tom Brady?  Absolutely not.  But if you look at AJM on tape from last year and Tom Brady on tape from early 2001, they don't look all that different.  They had basically the same scouting report heading into the draft.  Can AJM make the most out of what he's got?  I guess we'll all see.  That's the million dollar question.  But as he is right now, he's shown he can win football games.

If you want to badmouth having his high-level potential and solid current capabilities as your backup QB, due to some guys that were touting AJM as Dalton's superior, well that just shows how objective your opinion is.  Seems like some of you guys are reacting with your emotions rather than your brains.

Glad the Bengals have somebody who can come in if needed and keep the boat afloat.

You do realize that Wilson gets sacked a ton? Having a sack % anywhere close to Wilson is horrible. Plus passer rating is BS especially when it's used in a small sample size. If you took into consideration where the defense put McCarron on his scoring drives his passer rating would be much lower. He has a hard time scoring any points unless the defense puts him right by the red zone.

If you use your logic about how McCarron has similar stats to Brady in 2001 then you would be perfectly fine in using the same logic to say that Dalton is one of the best QBs of all time.

[OrlandoBengal]

(07-08-2016, 12:26 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: There was plenty of that even last year. which is a different level of dumb.   

I don't dislike McCarron because I like Dalton I dislike all the board members hyping him up to be better than our current starter when he hadn't played a snap.

McCarron did okay for a backup stepping into the situation he did.  But we also had a loaded team when he took over which greatly helped.  If he had stepped in late for the browns last year what would the prespective be?

He might be the best backup in the NFL.. for all I know I don't look at all the teams backup QBs and seeing as many never get tot play that season.
he might actually fit that bill.

But I also didn't see anyone offering anything for him in the offseason.  dispite a good portion of the board thinking we would get a 2nd round pick for him? hahahahahaha...

Using this logic we can also say that Dalton is propped up by a loaded team and would be a scrub if he played for another organization.  You can't use this logic to tear one down without the other.

And no one knows who may have called and/or what was offered.  This team is not going to disclose that information, but we all know the asking price would have been prohibitive.  How often to the Bengals engage in trades?  The answer is "very rarely" and when they do, they get incredibly good return.

[BigSeph]

(07-11-2016, 04:25 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: You do realize that Wilson gets sacked a ton? Having a sack % anywhere close to Wilson is horrible. Plus passer rating is BS especially when it's used in a small sample size. If you took into consideration where the defense put McCarron on his scoring drives his passer rating would be much lower. He has a hard time scoring any points unless the defense puts him right by the red zone.

If you use your logic about how McCarron has similar stats to Brady in 2001 then you would be perfectly fine in using the same logic to say that Dalton is one of the best QBs of all time.

This is exactly what I'm talking about.

You can't stand to hear the positive, you immediately rush to dismiss and downplay everything positive about AJM.

Sadly your opinion on the subject requires people to suspend belief in their own eyes, the actual statistics, the comments of players on the team, the comments of coaches and scouts, and articles which rank the backup QBs in the NFL.

Sure, if I disregard everything on the subject that matters and choose to harbor some childish resentment of the guy because some fans like him more than AD, I guess I could see things your way....

[BengalChris]

(07-08-2016, 02:19 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: you act like McCarron was the only guy out there playing in that one decent quarter.. the other starters stepped up also.. how about AJ and the key TD ?   

McCarron as a backup managed to go 2-2... Dalton was the starter  that delivered us a 10-3 record .  Enough said about that one

Not at all, but it should count for something that a QB of ours played decent for a quarter when the game was on the line. Not saying that he's better than Dalton or anything like that, but he did do something that neither Dalton or Palmer has done for the team. Yes, the defense played well, which was a change from previous playoffs games.

I just don't understand the hate on AJM when he's been a whole lot better than what we had at backup QB and he's at least capable of holding his own in the game. You should like that he's on the team.

[*Nately120*]

(07-11-2016, 02:00 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Not at all, but it should count for something that a QB of ours played decent for a quarter when the game was on the line. Not saying that he's better than Dalton or anything like that, but he did do something that neither Dalton or Palmer has done for the team. Yes, the defense played well, which was a change from previous playoffs games.

I just don't understand the hate on AJM when he's been a whole lot better than what we had at backup QB and he's at least capable of holding his own in the game. You should like that he's on the team.

It is legitimately difficult to hold AJM's lousy playoff game against him when any QB under Marvin Lewis thus far has looked as bad or worse when in stripes.  

[Brownshoe]

(07-11-2016, 04:10 PM)Nately120 Wrote: It is legitimately difficult to hold AJM's lousy playoff game against him when any QB under Marvin Lewis thus far has looked as bad or worse when in stripes.  

If he actually had a good game then it would be hard to hold it against him, but every game he played he struggled to move the ball. The only reason why his passer rating is decent is because the defense put him in extremly good field position.

[Brownshoe]

(07-11-2016, 01:03 PM)BigSeph Wrote: This is exactly what I'm talking about.

You can't stand to hear the positive, you immediately rush to dismiss and downplay everything positive about AJM.

Sadly your opinion on the subject requires people to suspend belief in their own eyes, the actual statistics, the comments of players on the team, the comments of coaches and scouts, and articles which rank the backup QBs in the NFL.

Sure, if I disregard everything on the subject that matters and choose to harbor some childish resentment of the guy because some fans like him more than AD, I guess I could see things your way....

And you still couldn't say why I am wrong. You have to try and deflect the issue because you know what I'm saying is factually correct.

[BengalChris]

(07-11-2016, 04:10 PM)Nately120 Wrote: It is legitimately difficult to hold AJM's lousy playoff game against him when any QB under Marvin Lewis thus far has looked as bad or worse when in stripes.  

Yeah, at least we had the lead with a minute to go. That's better than any one else has done under Marv.

Of course, I point to Marv more than I do Dalton or Palmer, and have done so many times.

[wolfkaosaun]

(07-11-2016, 11:37 PM)BengalChris Wrote: Yeah, at least we had the lead with a minute to go. That's better than any one else has done under Marv.

Of course, I point to Marv more than I do Dalton or Palmer, and have done so many times.

I mean, even though he did win his first playoff game in his 13 year career. He still wasn't that great in the playoffs at all.

48 for 81. 584 yards. 59.3 completion percentage. 4 TDs. 6 INTs. 67.1 QB rating. Fumbled the ball 3 times, lost 2 of them.

That's a 1 for 2 TD to turnover ratio. That's still pretty bad.

[*bfine32*]

(07-11-2016, 04:57 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: If he actually had a good game then it would be hard to hold it against him, but every game he played he struggled to move the ball. The only reason why his passer rating is decent is because the defense put him in extremly good field position.

How does Field position figure into passer rating?

(07-11-2016, 04:58 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: And you still couldn't say why I am wrong. 

See above. 

[Brownshoe]

(07-12-2016, 02:19 AM)bfine32 Wrote: How does Field position figure into passer rating?

See above. 

Because passer rating is based on pure %. The less yards it takes you to score through the air the higher passer rating you have. So, if you start with a short field that's less yards you have to cover and that raises your passer rating quite a bit.

Plus McCarron has a hard time scoring if the ball is placed on the Bengals side of the field, so it increases his chance to score, which increases his passer rating. You would be surprised at how little McCarron scores when he doesn't start by or past (on the opponents side) the 50 yard line.

Still haven't shown where I'm wrong about McCarron.

[BengalChris]

(07-12-2016, 01:57 AM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: I mean, even though he did win his first playoff game in his 13 year career. He still wasn't that great in the playoffs at all.

48 for 81. 584 yards. 59.3 completion percentage. 4 TDs. 6 INTs. 67.1 QB rating. Fumbled the ball 3 times, lost 2 of them.

That's a 1 for 2 TD to turnover ratio. That's still pretty bad.

Yeah, Palmer didn't look good in the playoffs this year. But they did advance.

(07-12-2016, 06:26 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Because passer rating is based on pure %. The less yards it takes you to score through the air the higher passer rating you have. So, if you start with a short field that's less yards you have to cover and that raises your passer rating quite a bit.

Plus McCarron has a hard time scoring if the ball is placed on the Bengals side of the field, so it increases his chance to score, which increases his passer rating. You would be surprised at how little McCarron scores when he doesn't start by or past (on the opponents side) the 50 yard line.

Still haven't shown where I'm wrong about McCarron.

Still, somehow he managed to have team with a lead and the offense did score more points than it has in the last several playoff games. You should be happy he's on this team and not on a team like the Steelers or Ravens or Clowns.

[Brownshoe]

(07-12-2016, 08:18 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Still, somehow he managed to have team with a lead and the offense did score more points than it has in the last several playoff games. You should be happy he's on this team and not on a team like the Steelers or Ravens or Clowns.

That wasn't because of McCarron. That was because of the defense. If the defense played like it has the in the past we might not have had any points and the Steelers up by 4+ score. The only 2 times McCarron scored in the playoffs was when the defense put him in amazing field position, and he gets a ticky tac PI flag with Green. And then the defense put him in great field position and Hill goes off for a TD drive. McCarron contributed very little to grabbing the lead late in the game.

[BengalChris]

(07-12-2016, 09:02 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: That wasn't because of McCarron. That was because of the defense. If the defense played like it has the in the past we might not have had any points and the Steelers up by 4+ score. The only 2 times McCarron scored in the playoffs was when the defense put him in amazing field position, and he gets a ticky tac PI flag with Green. And then the defense put him in great field position and Hill goes off for a TD drive. McCarron contributed very little to grabbing the lead late in the game.

I guess QBs only contribute when they aren't named AJ McCarron.

[Goalpost]

AJ passed at 65 percent in the red zone last year 13/20. He had 6 tds and zero ints. Small sample size, but actually better than many qbs. Aaron Rodgers for example was under 50 percent in the red zone last year.

[Brownshoe]

(07-12-2016, 07:01 PM)BengalChris Wrote: I guess QBs only contribute when they aren't named AJ McCarron.

No McCarron contributed to the loss. He didn't contribute to the near comeback win. No one has been able to prove me wrong about it either. Only deflections.

[*Nately120*]

(07-12-2016, 08:18 AM)BengalChris Wrote: Yeah, Palmer didn't look good in the playoffs this year. But they did advance.

Palmer's statline against the Packers probably would have won 4 or 5 of the Marvin Lewis-era losses.  We don't need a miracle, we just needed our QBs to play a not awful game.