Is it too early?

[WeezyBengal]

(09-14-2016, 03:30 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: 3.4 YPC

He looked strong on that 12 yard run, but lets not forget his other 8 carries for 19 yards.

Shit OL, but the same shit OL that Gio ran for 5.0 YPC behind.

You could see the adjustment the Jets were making throughout the game. They stopped our pass rush with quick passes and then used Forte to expose us once our D Line opened up. 

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(09-14-2016, 03:38 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: True, but who is to say he wouldn't improved with more carries. That sure isn't keeping the D very honest with
the lack of rushes. I think this contributed to the crazy sack total.

That is one of the best run stopping Lines in the league though. Might not of won the game if we did what i am
saying, never know. Hindsight is 20/20. I think our OL will improve this week, hard to play any worse.

It was Og's first game as a starter so i think we can give him a pass.

Bodine is shit i wouldn't paint the whole OL as shit.

If you're averaging 3.4 YPC a season after averaging 3.6 YPC, you can't be given too many carries. The offense simply can't survive that. There'd be a lot of 3 and outs.

Not so much calling the players shit, so much as their performance. Whit and Boling weren't terrible, but 40% of your OL not being terrible that day is the same as your OL being terrible that day. Lol

[Hammerstripes]

IF, and it's a big IF, Margus Hunt realized even half of his potential, this defense would be #1 in the league.

[Bengal Dude]

(09-14-2016, 03:18 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Love how people are acting like Hunt is God's gift to earth now. The guy had a field goal block and a couple tackles, great. Glad he could contribute 5 years after we drafted him. 

I'm the same way. I'm glad Hunt played well, but he's in his 4th season and this is the first time we've seen him do ANYTHING in the regular season.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(09-14-2016, 04:14 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: If you're averaging 3.4 YPC a season after averaging 3.6 YPC, you can't be given too many carries. The offense simply can't survive that. There'd be a lot of 3 and outs.

Not so much calling the players shit, so much as their performance. Whit and Boling weren't terrible, but 40% of your OL not being terrible that day is the same as your OL being terrible that day. Lol

True enough.

[SunsetBengal]

(09-14-2016, 04:43 PM)Bengal Dude Wrote: I'm the same way. I'm glad Hunt played well, but he's in his 4th season and this is the first time we've seen him do ANYTHING in the regular season.

Why I said that I was thrilled that he finally earned a game check..

[SunsetBengal]

(09-14-2016, 04:14 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: If you're averaging 3.4 YPC a season after averaging 3.6 YPC, you can't be given too many carries. The offense simply can't survive that. There'd be a lot of 3 and outs.

Not so much calling the players shit, so much as their performance. Whit and Boling weren't terrible, but 40% of your OL not being terrible that day is the same as your OL being terrible that day. Lol

You know, I hate when folks generalize data with the YPC.  It really doesn't tell the tale of the day.  By those numbers, 3.4 x 3 downs equals a 1st down every drive. 

[fredtoast]

(09-14-2016, 03:18 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: And Kirkpatrick? He is a decent cornerback. Nothing less, nothing more. He makes a few good plays and then gets manhandled by Decker for a TD. 

Funny how you want to define a players performance by just one play and ignore all the good he did.

You could just as well say that Dalton made a few good plays then threw a terrible interception.

Some people just get set in their ways and hate certain players no matter how well they play.

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-11-2016, 08:19 PM)TheCincinnatiKid Wrote: They traded up to pick him in the draft only 2 years ago, so I imagine the Bengals just aren't too keen to give up a the guy considering we never trade up for anything. 

I'm just trying to be optimistic, I thought he was absolute trash today, and the weak link all last year.

I don't believe this line of thinking...He is still a 4th round pick.  They gave up on Still, Moch, and Dawson in that timeframe that were all earlier selections.  The biggest problem here is that he is going to take our QB with him if he doesn't improve.  He is the weakest line in pass protection on the offensive line by far.  In run protection, in the preseason, I actually thought I saw improvement.  If they aren't going to keep a RB in to protect Dalton, there has to be an additional lineman (Fisher, or a TE) kept on the line to prevent two-gap responsibilities.  He is simply a liability in the passing game and it is too bad they didn't draft someone and begin to develop them.  Now, they either have to go FA or hope a rookie would be an upgrade next year, which is no small task given the Bengal's division. 

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-11-2016, 08:51 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Not sure that Westerman is the answer.  The only guy on the OL with any actual C experience that I would trust, Boling.  If the Bengals were to do something radical with the OL, which they likely won't, I would do something like this.  Whit at LT, Fisher at LG, Boling to C, Zeitler stay at RG, and Ogbuihe stay at RT.

I think the skill set and mobility needed at C would only be provided by Boling right now.  If Westerman can fill his void at LG??? Unfortunately, they did not explore this option in the regular season, so they will "dance with who we brought to the dance". 

OK, who said that quote???  Anyone?  Answer later tonight.  Try to withstand your anxiety while waiting.

[SunsetBengal]

(09-15-2016, 09:23 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I don't believe this line of thinking...He is still a 4th round pick.  They gave up on Still, Moch, and Dawson in that timeframe that were all earlier selections.  The biggest problem here is that he is going to take our QB with him if he doesn't improve.  He is the weakest line in pass protection on the offensive line by far.  In run protection, in the preseason, I actually thought I saw improvement.  If they aren't going to keep a RB in to protect Dalton, there has to be an additional lineman (Fisher, or a TE) kept on the line to prevent two-gap responsibilities.  He is simply a liability in the passing game and it is too bad they didn't draft someone and begin to develop them.  Now, they either have to go FA or hope a rookie would be an upgrade next year, which is no small task given the Bengal's division. 

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2016/9/14/12908534/the-weekly-lineman-jets-overpower-bodine-ogbuehi-and-rest-of-the-bengals-offensive-line

This article does a nice job of describing what went wrong with the OL, and who is to fault, and specifically what their individual faults are.  Yes, I know that it's only Cincyjungle, but it is pretty on point.

[WeezyBengal]

(09-15-2016, 09:14 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Funny how you want to define a players performance by just one play and ignore all the good he did.

You could just as well say that Dalton made a few good plays then threw a terrible interception.

Some people just get set in their ways and hate certain players no matter how well they play.

Didn't I just state that he has done some good? I said he is an average corner back, which he is. 

I can go back and find more than the play that Decker made on him if you want? I remember him getting roasted or called for PI quite a bit last season. 

Also, its funny how you still havent acknowledged the PFF stats that others posted about your boy Bodine earlier in this thread. Just going to ignore that one all together?

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-15-2016, 09:32 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: http://www.cincyjungle.com/2016/9/14/12908534/the-weekly-lineman-jets-overpower-bodine-ogbuehi-and-rest-of-the-bengals-offensive-line

This article does a nice job of describing what went wrong with the OL, and who is to fault, and specifically what their individual faults are.  Yes, I know that it's only Cincyjungle, but it is pretty on point.

Link didn't work for me, but I can probably guess where they suggest the issues stemmed.  They aren't going to lambast one guy and absolve the others.  However, I think a lot of the scheme has to be dictated because of the pass-blocking deficiencies of our center.  That is where the problem begins. 

[Hammerstripes]

I've always thought that Boling would end up at center this year because of Bodine.

The only issue for me is that I don't know exactly how I would put the rest of the guys on the line.

I guess you could slide Fisher into LG.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(09-15-2016, 12:46 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I've always thought that Boling would end up at center this year because of Bodine.

The only issue for me is that I don't know exactly how I would put the rest of the guys on the line.  

I guess you could slide Fisher into LG.

Yep, Fish at LG.

[Shake n Blake]

(09-14-2016, 09:27 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: You know, I hate when folks generalize data with the YPC.  It really doesn't tell the tale of the day.  By those numbers, 3.4 x 3 downs equals a 1st down every drive. 

Not only that, but Gio had 5 carries,  so not much of a sample size to use his 5.0 average as evidence for anything. His first 3 carries went for 4, 1 and 3 yards. The run game just wasn't effective enough to justify staying with it. Sure, Andy was getting pummeled pretty good, but he was moving the ball effectively.

This was the worst performance I've seen from our o-line since 2008. They got zero push on the ground, they were overpowered and completely confused by the stunts. Obviously Bodine got the worst of it.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(09-15-2016, 12:46 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: I've always thought that Boling would end up at center this year because of Bodine.

The only issue for me is that I don't know exactly how I would put the rest of the guys on the line.  

I guess you could slide Fisher into LG.

Think that's a waste since Boling is so good as a pulling LG. Always felt like you'd just create another weak spot on the OL by moving Boling to C because then your good LG is out of position and your backup T is out of position.

Unless they do something ridiculous like Boling to C, Whit to LG, Fisher to LT. I don't even know if Boling can play C, or if Fisher can play LG for that matter.

[TheCincinnatiKid]

(09-15-2016, 09:23 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: I don't believe this line of thinking...He is still a 4th round pick.  They gave up on Still, Moch, and Dawson in that timeframe that were all earlier selections.  The biggest problem here is that he is going to take our QB with him if he doesn't improve.  He is the weakest line in pass protection on the offensive line by far.  In run protection, in the preseason, I actually thought I saw improvement.  If they aren't going to keep a RB in to protect Dalton, there has to be an additional lineman (Fisher, or a TE) kept on the line to prevent two-gap responsibilities.  He is simply a liability in the passing game and it is too bad they didn't draft someone and begin to develop them.  Now, they either have to go FA or hope a rookie would be an upgrade next year, which is no small task given the Bengal's division. 

Nowhere did I say that was my actual line of thinking dude, I even said 'I'm just trying to be optimistic here' suggesting I'm throwing things out there 

I personally think he's had long enough to prove himself, and I've little doubt the Bengals will cut him when they have given up on him/there is an obvious and realistic better option. Unless we trade or draft, Bodine will remain the starter.

[SunsetBengal]

(09-15-2016, 12:43 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Link didn't work for me, but I can probably guess where they suggest the issues stemmed.  They aren't going to lambast one guy and absolve the others.  However, I think a lot of the scheme has to be dictated because of the pass-blocking deficiencies of our center.  That is where the problem begins. 

Yes, the emphasis on Bodine was that he cannot effectively anchor and hold his block, and that Boling or Zeitler often have to be schemed to chip on his man, even on run plays.

[SunsetBengal]

Well, Bodine still isn't good, but at least he's showing signs of fight. But wow, the run blocking absolutely sucks, from the OL as a unit. It's high time that the Bengals get away from looking for multi-faceted finesse athletes to play OL, and just start drafting bad Motherstuffers that can move some large dudes off the ball.