In hindsight, the Bengals FO did a poor job this off season

[Housh]

Hindsight?

I coulda told you wed suck without those guys.

I think most people on here agrred we had to keep at least 1 WR and Nelson.

Bengals did neither and didn't even find suitable replacements. I said all offseason that first year starters and rookies ARENT suitable replacements and people talked to me like I was crazy. Sometimes people get too into the idea of young players getting PT. Half the young guys on our team just aren't good

[fredtoast]

(10-05-2016, 10:46 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Why dont you compare Jone's stats from this year to Lafells from this year? 

That tells a different story. 

Because we are talking about replacing Jones production while he was HERE.

[fredtoast]

(10-05-2016, 12:19 PM)Housh Wrote: Hindsight?

I coulda told you wed suck without those guys.

I think most people on here agrred we had to keep at least 1 WR and Nelson.

Bengals did neither and didn't even find suitable replacements. I said all offseason that first year starters and rookies ARENT suitable replacements and people talked to me like I was crazy. Sometimes people get too into the idea of young players getting PT. Half the young guys on our team just aren't good

LaFell has more than replaced Jones production.

And we don't suck.  We still have both a top ten defense and a top ten offense.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

Other than Nelson, I really can't complain....but I complained about Nelson when it happened.  Jones just wasn't gonna stay here, Sanu wasn't that good to begin with, Smith had been struggling (Ced just needs to grow), Leon is very close to done, Gilberry has been improved upon...imo.

I see people knocking Reggie, the numbers and the shot to save the day in Baltimore say otherwise, the over the top coverage has been our lone consistent weak spot in the secondary.  He fixes that.  Williams for Nelson looks to be a mistake right now.

In 2013, yes, Zimmer was the right call.  Should've canned Marv after the debacle against San Diego and paid the man.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-05-2016, 10:41 AM)Sled21 Wrote: You're right, I don't know why we didn't keep them all.....oh wait, the salary cap....nevermind. As for coaches, we should have just made them all head coach here so they wouldn't leave...... LaFell is doing better than Sanu and Jones, Andre Smith is stinking it up in Minnesota, I haven't been keeping up with Gilberry, but Jackson just had a fire sale in Cleveland and has yet to win a game. Yeah, our front office is stinking it up alright.....

To be fair, we DID make Piano Man assistant HC, and it has kept him here for DECADES.

[Bengalholic]

(10-04-2016, 05:58 PM)3wt Wrote: And it was going to be an awkward thing to let Marvin go and hire Zimmer.  Timing is so important.  And Marvin has done so much for the team that jettisoning him in order to hire Zimmer as HC would have made it hard for Brown to look in the mirror... and frankly for Zimmer to stay.   We would have had to be looking back on a sub .500 season, not just failing in the playoffs.

The only way I could have seen Zimmer being hired by the Bengals is if Marvin had wanted to jump upstairs leaving room for Zimmer to move into the HC Job.   And from what I hear Marvin has never been interested in doing that.

I have to disagree with you on this brother. I think there was a great opportunity to make the change following the incredibly embarrassing and disappointing playoff loss to the Chargers. The Bengals had just lost their 3rd straight playoff game, and Marvin was 0-5 at that point. Zimmer was also a hot name among head coaching candidates at that time, so I feel like that window was the perfect time to make the change, as it would've made sense on all fronts.

[*Synric*]

(10-05-2016, 11:11 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Because that is not the point. The point is did we adaquetly replace MLJ.

Do you think MLJ whould have those numbers here?

Numbers aren't he only story... Do you think defenses have to cover Lafell like hey did Jones? No Jones was faster had more burst off the line etc...


Come on people Brandon may have a good career here buy he did not replace the threat that is Marvin Jones...

Saying that Lafell has replaced Jones because of stats is like saying Diggs is as good as OBJ cuz he has more catches and yards so far this year...

[fredtoast]

(10-05-2016, 02:05 PM)Synric Wrote: Numbers aren't he only story... Do you think defenses have to cover Lafell like hey did Jones? No Jones was faster had more burst off the line etc...


Come on people Brandon may have a good career here buy he did not replace the threat that is Marvin Jones...

Think we can convince the league to give us first downs based on a player "being a threat" instead of actually gaining yards?


As long as LaFell produces on the field other teams will have to work just a shard to stop him as they did Jones.


But since you brought it up, who would you have signed to replace Jones if you had control of our front office?

[3wt]

(10-04-2016, 10:04 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Keeping Erickson over Tate looks to be a mistake.

Except no one including Adam Jones is returning well, and Jones always looked better than Tate.   We are not blocking people.  So it's a little early to make that judgment.  Still I was surprised they did it.  Tate was nothing if not reliable and was always good for an exceptional catch downfield on the edge.

[*Synric*]

(10-05-2016, 02:12 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Think we can convince the league to give us first downs based on a player "being a threat" instead of actually gaining yards?


As long as LaFell produces on the field other teams will have to work just a shard to stop him as they did Jones.


But since you brought it up, who would you ki have signed to replace Jones if you had control of our front office?

You are still using the same flawed logic and didnt answer the question....as a Defense do you cover Brandon Lafell the same way you cover Marvin Jones? No Jones is faster in every aspect of his game...

But to answer your question about resigning him no they couldn't he was worth more money than the Bengals could afford....

[3wt]

(10-05-2016, 01:44 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I have to disagree with you on this brother. I think there was a great opportunity to make the change following the incredibly embarrassing and disappointing playoff loss to the Chargers. The Bengals had just lost their 3rd straight playoff game, and Marvin was 0-5 at that point. Zimmer was also a hot name among head coaching candidates at that time, so I feel like that window was the perfect time to make the change, as it would've made sense on all fronts.

I see your point Holic.  And the more I see Zimmer operating the more I'm sorry he is not here.   He's making all the right moves.  But the San Diego game was a disaster largely because of devastating injuries to the offense and a big failure of the Zim coordinated defense.  

If the playoff disaster had followed a really bad season we would have had the perfect window.  But I can't help but wonder what might have been.

[3wt]

(10-05-2016, 02:19 PM)Synric Wrote: You are still using the same flawed logic and didnt answer the question....as a Defense do you cover Brandon Lafell the same way you cover Marvin Jones? No Jones is faster in every aspect of his game...

But to answer your question about resigning him no they couldn't he was worth more money than the Bengals could afford....

He had the same speed last year and was not producing any more than Lafelle is this year.  Yes he's a different receiver than Lafelle, but he was not producing any more than this point last season. 

And he was not going to sign for more money.  He wanted to be the #1 guy.  We pretty much matched what Detroit offered and he elected not to return.

Bottom line is that with regard to Jones the FO did not mess up.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-05-2016, 02:19 PM)Synric Wrote: You are still using the same flawed logic and didnt answer the question....as a Defense do you cover Brandon Lafell the same way you cover Marvin Jones? No Jones is faster in every aspect of his game...

But to answer your question about resigning him no they couldn't he was worth more money than the Bengals could afford....

He gots a strawman taller than Lady Liberty.  Anyone with a clue knows it was harder to cover all of our weapons last season than it is this season.  Jones is a viable deep threat, Lafell doesn't appear to be.  They are stacking the box and doubling AJ, and these guys still aren't getting open. 

However, NOTHING was gonna get Marvin to stay.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-05-2016, 01:44 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I have to disagree with you on this brother. I think there was a great opportunity to make the change following the incredibly embarrassing and disappointing playoff loss to the Chargers. The Bengals had just lost their 3rd straight playoff game, and Marvin was 0-5 at that point. Zimmer was also a hot name among head coaching candidates at that time, so I feel like that window was the perfect time to make the change, as it would've made sense on all fronts.

Yep, as I said, he should've been canned after the San Diego debacle.....2010 actually, but definitely after that embarrassment.

[BengalFanInNJ]

(10-05-2016, 12:16 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: Todd Haley sucked as a head coach, that's why.  Like McDaniels, he put his tail between his legs after failing as a HC and returned to the comfort of a very stable coaching staff under a tenured head coach.

I'm sure if Mike Zimmer, Hue Jackson or Jay Gruden are fired and Marvin Lewis is still coach, the same could happen.  However, it appears all 3 of those guys will keep their jobs for a while.

True, but Belichick sucked with Cleveland. Carroll sucked with the Jets. Why not at least offer him a chance?

[Sled21]

Mike Brown screwed up with Zimmer by not forcing Marvin into a front office position ala GM or such, and making Zim head coach. That would have been face saving for Marvin, who after all has done wonders to get this team from where it was to where it is, and let Zim come in and take it the rest of the way.....

[Brimey]

(10-05-2016, 10:58 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: In fairness, I think Cleveland clearly had no intentions of trying to actually win something this year. They cut a ton of the players who had been around for a bit, got rid of some other players, saved up their FA $, and stocked up a mountain of draft picks (I think they have two full drafts worth in 2017).

They drafted 14 people in the 2016 draft.

It's pretty clear Cleveland just burnt everything to the ground and are rebuilding from scratch. They'll suck this year, get a QB with the 1st or 2nd pick overall, and then use the rest of their bajillion picks on other folk and augment their roster with all that cap space $ they'll roll over.

Understand what they're doing, and it's actually not a half bad plan for the Browns.

Remember, once these 14 draft picks a yeas rookie contract's are up they are going to scramble to fit their deals under the cap and resign their guys. Combine our 2010 and 2011 drafts and scramble to fit everyone under the cap in 2014

[*bfine32*]

(10-05-2016, 02:05 PM)Synric Wrote: Numbers aren't he only story... Do you think defenses have to cover Lafell like hey did Jones? No Jones was faster had more burst off the line etc...


Come on people Brandon may have a good career here buy he did not replace the threat that is Marvin Jones...

Saying that Lafell has replaced Jones because of stats is like saying Diggs is as good as OBJ cuz he has more catches and yards so far this year...

Of Course they are not the only story. I'm sure you can point to AJ not being as productive as usual because these defenses are rolling coverage away from Brandon in a way they didn't Jones. 

You can do that, right?

[Vas Deferens]

(10-05-2016, 03:06 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Mike Brown screwed up with Zimmer by not forcing Marvin into a front office position ala GM or such, and making Zim head coach. That would have been face saving for Marvin, who after all has done wonders to get this team from where it was to where it is, and let Zim come in and take it the rest of the way.....

that would have cost brownie more money.  he's already got the FO filled with his litter and their ilk and those golden teets aren't cheap as it is.

[Bilbo Saggins]

(10-05-2016, 05:25 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Of Course they are not the only story. I'm sure you can point to AJ not being as productive as usual because these defenses are rolling coverage away from Brandon in a way they didn't Jones. 

You can do that, right?

If they are clamping down on Green so much then why does he have more yards and catches now than at this point last season? Lafell and Boyd are not the problem with this offense, it's the run game and o-line play.