Excited about this draft class.We just got better dramatically.

[fredtoast]

(04-29-2017, 06:41 PM)Striped4war Wrote: Tell that to Marvin.His loyalty to players is unmatched.Even when trying to replace them drafting a guy when there not getting it done anymore he will STILL sit the guys drafted.Not the players fault our coach is a idiot in that fact and certainly not worth calling them wasted picks.

Sorry Striped4war, but that just is not true.

Here are the actual numbers

http://thebengalsboard.com/Thread-Marvin-Lewis-playing-rookies?highlight=marvin

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-30-2017, 01:48 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I would love our guys to perform at these guys levels. Is it to much to ask for Ross to be a faster A. Brown also?

If Ross can stay healthy i don't think it is too much to ask, that is how good i think Ross can be.

He is much faster with his straight line speed and he can be shifty like AB. He is bigger as well.

[Okeana]

(04-30-2017, 01:41 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Exactly, need contrast of opinion on here.

Would be no fun if everyone agreed all the damn time.

Look im down for talking about who we should have taken and why, but simply saying hes gonna ride bench 4 years and never do anything.  Thats not a contrast of opinion its just trolling because you didn't like the pick.  Tell me exactly why the ross pick was bad ?

Size ?

He's bigger and faster than two of the best receivers in the nfl in d jackson and b cooks,  lets even throw in wes welker for good measure.  5'11" 185 is not small and he can add some more to his frame without it destroying his speed.  

Over Drafted ?  

Before combine he was considered a top 20 player.  After the combine he somehow drops after setting the record ?  The tape doesn't lie this guy is an all around receiver and not just a sideline speed guy.  his routes are crisp, his hands are above average, and he's gotten better every single year.  He has also played corner so he can diagnose defenses better than most receivers.

Injury ?

He tore his acl which tore his meniscus at the same time.  It hasn't been re injured and by his own words he got faster and he has no lingering issues after the surgery.  He was super young when it happened and everything went perfect.  The rejuvenation of youth isn't to be overlooked with injuries like this.  

Last year he tore his shoulder and played the entire season putting up the best numbers of his career.  They repaired it and he said he's ready by training camp.  again he's 21 now and youth will fix this minor injury.

Scheme? 

Lastly and most importantly he's a perfect scheme fit to improve our team.  We need a dynamic fast receiver and we got the fastest guy without any of the pitfalls most other speed guys come with.  AJ Green improves with this pick, the run game improves with this pick, and he adds that top speed aspect this team has long needed.  This team 2 years ago actually used brandon TATE! imagine what a guy like Ross brings to a team over a guy like Tate or Lafell 

Intangibles?

This is a highly competitive football player.  Not a track star converted to play football.  He's a chippy guy who plays with some anger on the field and off the field he's a business man.  No character issues,  No distractions, and is basically another AJ Green style pro.  Lastly he had a chance to win an island at the combine, but instead he ran in nike shoes which is a brand he's preferred his whole life.  Which means this guy doesn't roll over for money and hes not a sell out.

[Sled21]

(04-29-2017, 06:41 PM)Striped4war Wrote: Tell that to Marvin.His loyalty to players is unmatched.Even when trying to replace them drafting a guy when there not getting it done anymore he will STILL sit the guys drafted.Not the players fault our coach is a idiot in that fact and certainly not worth calling them wasted picks.

Or, or, or..... could it be that the drafted guy just did not progress fast enough to knock off the vet and take his spot??? Maybe when they hit the field and are good players, it's because they sat behind that vet for a year or two...

[Beaker]

(04-30-2017, 02:33 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Or, or, or..... could it be that the drafted guy just did not progress fast enough to knock off the vet and take his spot??? Maybe when they hit the field and are good players, it's because they sat behind that vet for a year or two...

A lot of these people who say ML doesn't play his rookies soon enough are also crying that we let Whitworth walk because now we will be stuck with 2 young OTs.

[*ochocincos*]

We may not see a ton of contribution from most of these players outside of ST, but that should be expected.
Mixon might very well get the most usage, but Ross could still have the best production due to how much of a home run threat he is.
I expect these two players are the top two rookie contributors outside of ST.
I think Willis and Lawson will be used in a rotation, so their production will be capped.
Malone will likely be the inactive WR every game unless an injury occurs.
Glasgow will likely only be used to spell Billings or even inactive some games based on what other DT(s) are kept.
I see Jordan Evans being primarily used in ST but could see occasional snaps as a coverage LB.
Brandon Wilson should be a ST demon. He can be both a gunner and returner.
I think Dielman will take the last OL spot (if he makes the team at all) and be inactive until an injury. He needs some work technically and very much needs to build strength.
I think Schreck goes to PS.

[Luvnit2]

(04-30-2017, 03:01 PM)ochocincos Wrote: We may not see a ton of contribution from most of these players outside of ST, but that should be expected.
Mixon might very well get the most usage, but Ross could still have the best production due to how much of a home run threat he is.
I expect these two players are the top two rookie contributors outside of ST.
I think Willis and Lawson will be used in a rotation, so their production will be capped.
Malone will likely be the inactive WR every game unless an injury occurs.
Glasgow will likely only be used to spell Billings or even inactive some games based on what other DT(s) are kept.
I see Jordan Evans being primarily used in ST but could see occasional snaps as a coverage LB.
Brandon Wilson should be a ST demon. He can be both a gunner and returner.
I think Dielman will take the last OL spot (if he makes the team at all) and be inactive until an injury. He needs some work technically and very much needs to build strength.
I think Schreck goes to PS.

This is reasonable expectations and:

Billings will probably get a chance to play on running downs
Jackson has a shot at taking Jones spot, bigger shot if we cut Jones (which it is time to do in my opinion)

[Shake n Blake]

Draft class was amazing IMO (and I'm not the type that gets excited every year no matter who we take).

That said, free agency was awful and the o-line blows hard on paper.

They were talking on radio last night about the Seahawks not doing enough to help Russell Wilson because his line is terrible. Wilson was sacked 41 times last year (same as Dalton) and put up nearly identical numbers. So the perception for Dalton should be the same. I'm thrilled with the additions of Ross and Mixon...and even some of the others we drafted (most of whom will get overhyped), but as happy as I am about that, I have to keep it real about the line. It was awful last year and we did zilch to improve it. In fact, it got worse on paper. The only hope people can cling to is that Ogbuehi and Fisher improve massively while Andre stays healthy and has a smooth transition to a new position.

That's a bunch of gigantic if's and I wouldn't say any of them are likely to happen. This roster is still good enough to contend for a championship...outside of the o-line, but I don't see how anyone can come up with realistic reasons for optimism with that position group. Then of course, we still have the same staff in place that's goose egg in the playoffs.

Long story short...I love this draft class, but I'm not sure it will offset the o-line and coaching issues.

[McC]

(04-30-2017, 01:48 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I would love our guys to perform at these guys levels. Is it to much to ask for Ross to be a faster A. Brown also?

He does have a lot of the qualities that make Brown so good.  Plus that added speed.  So, at least the possibility exists, imo.

[BengalsRocker]

(04-29-2017, 06:14 PM)McC Wrote: The Bengal FO did a bunch of non-Bengal-like things this year.

They cut Peko and Rey M.

They signed a FA in his prime.

They drafted a WR under 6".

In other words, they shook some things up.

So, maybe the next logical step is to play the young guys sooner than later.

[Striped4war]

(04-30-2017, 01:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Sorry Striped4war, but that just is not true.

Here are the actual numbers

http://thebengalsboard.com/Thread-Marvin-Lewis-playing-rookies?highlight=marvin

It's a good number if you didn't factor in injuries.How many got to keep the starting jobs though?

[Striped4war]

(04-30-2017, 02:36 PM)Beaker Wrote: A lot of these people who say ML doesn't play his rookies soon enough are also crying that we let Whitworth walk because now we will be stuck with 2 young OTs.

Big Whitt was our best player for many years.Why would anybody want there best player sense Willie Anderson ride the bench when his play NEVER warranted it.There was absolutely no drop off in his game.Unlike MJ,Maualuga,Geathers.

[Striped4war]

(04-30-2017, 02:33 PM)Sled21 Wrote: Or, or, or..... could it be that the drafted guy just did not progress fast enough to knock off the vet and take his spot??? Maybe when they hit the field and are good players, it's because they sat behind that vet for a year or two...

Or or or Even though Geno far outplayed Simms he still played backup.Its no secret Marvin wants guys to pay there dues before taking the reins.If you haven't noticed over the years take the blinders off.

[Striped4war]

(04-30-2017, 02:29 PM)Okeana Wrote: Look im down for talking about who we should have taken and why, but simply saying hes gonna ride bench 4 years and never do anything.  Thats not a contrast of opinion its just trolling because you didn't like the pick.  Tell me exactly why the ross pick was bad ?

Size ?

He's bigger and faster than two of the best receivers in the nfl in d jackson and b cooks,  lets even throw in wes welker for good measure.  5'11" 185 is not small and he can add some more to his frame without it destroying his speed.  

Over Drafted ?  

Before combine he was considered a top 20 player.  After the combine he somehow drops after setting the record ?  The tape doesn't lie this guy is an all around receiver and not just a sideline speed guy.  his routes are crisp, his hands are above average, and he's gotten better every single year.  He has also played corner so he can diagnose defenses better than most receivers.

Injury ?

He tore his acl which tore his meniscus at the same time.  It hasn't been re injured and by his own words he got faster and he has no lingering issues after the surgery.  He was super young when it happened and everything went perfect.  The rejuvenation of youth isn't to be overlooked with injuries like this.  

Last year he tore his shoulder and played the entire season putting up the best numbers of his career.  They repaired it and he said he's ready by training camp.  again he's 21 now and youth will fix this minor injury.

Scheme? 

Lastly and most importantly he's a perfect scheme fit to improve our team.  We need a dynamic fast receiver and we got the fastest guy without any of the pitfalls most other speed guys come with.  AJ Green improves with this pick, the run game improves with this pick, and he adds that top speed aspect this team has long needed.  This team 2 years ago actually used brandon TATE! imagine what a guy like Ross brings to a team over a guy like Tate or Lafell 

Intangibles?

This is a highly competitive football player.  Not a track star converted to play football.  He's a chippy guy who plays with some anger on the field and off the field he's a business man.  No character issues,  No distractions, and is basically another AJ Green style pro.  Lastly he had a chance to win an island at the combine, but instead he ran in nike shoes which is a brand he's preferred his whole life.  Which means this guy doesn't roll over for money and hes not a sell out.

Nice read.
I was already excited about the pick.You just enforced it even more.I wanted Williams but the more I look at it I think Ross can be used so many other different ways.Bigger is not always better and I think ( hope) Core can turn into that type of receiver Williams .I just hope Zamp plays Ross right and lines him up everywhere.Keep defenses guessing and take full advantage of that speed.

[Okeana]

(05-02-2017, 08:31 AM)Striped4war Wrote: Nice read.
I was already excited about the pick.You just enforced it even more.I wanted Williams but the more I look at it I think Ross can be used so many other different ways.Bigger is not always better and I think ( hope) Core can turn into that type of receiver Williams .I just hope Zamp plays Ross right and lines him up everywhere.Keep defenses guessing and take full advantage of that speed.

Either he plays him right or he finds a new job after marvin is fired next year

[Benton]

(04-30-2017, 05:19 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: They were talking on radio last night about the Seahawks not doing enough to help Russell Wilson because his line is terrible. Wilson was sacked 41 times last year (same as Dalton) and put up nearly identical numbers. So the perception for Dalton should be the same. I'm thrilled with the additions of Ross and Mixon...and even some of the others we drafted (most of whom will get overhyped), but as happy as I am about that, I have to keep it real about the line. It was awful last year and we did zilch to improve it. In fact, it got worse on paper. The only hope people can cling to is that Ogbuehi and Fisher improve massively while Andre stays healthy and has a smooth transition to a new position.

 .

Our Oline should be better.

I know some people have been buymmed that we didn't address it in this year's draft, but there wasn't much available. A few good guard/C prospects, but nothign sure fire. No tackle we drafted would be better than Ogbeuhi and Fisher, at least not for a few years.

But anyway, the thing is, we DID address the OL... in 2015 and 2016 when we added two tackles and when we took Westerman. I think our line play is going to be much improved this season.

[Luvnit2]

(05-02-2017, 11:19 AM)Benton Wrote: Our Oline should be better.

I know some people have been buymmed that we didn't address it in this year's draft, but there wasn't much available. A few good guard/C prospects, but nothign sure fire. No tackle we drafted would be better than Ogbeuhi and Fisher, at least not for a few years.

But anyway, the thing is, we DID address the OL... in 2015 and 2016 when we added two tackles and when we took Westerman. I think our line play is going to be much improved this season.

The Bengals had a great plan if you think about it going and drafting not just 1, but 2 OT's in 2015 to groom for this day they knew was coming replacing Whittworth and A. Smith. Now, we will find out if they made great draft picks in 2015 knowing the OL was poor in 2017 draft.