Is Marvin handcuffing Lazor?

[*bfine32*]

Look how good Hue is after he got rid of Marvin's meddling. He's currently 1-20 as the Brown's HC.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-08-2017, 10:20 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: Not really. Lazor was always an aerial coach. He knows how to have a passing attack. He's struggled with running the ball.

You know your stuff Wolf, starts in the trenches.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-08-2017, 10:24 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote:  You honestly think this team doesn't make halftime adjustments? Seriously Marvin knows more football then me and you or anyone else on this board. The fact that people think the guy is an idiot and cant coach shows the idiotodacy of this fanbase. For Christ sakes the dude coached one of the greatest defenses of all time and won a Superbowl.

My God.

Jakeypoo.

Look at this team's stats in the second half over just the last 10 games, let alone all the games under Marv when we have the lead.

Just look at the Packers and Browns games just this season.

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-08-2017, 06:08 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: IMO, it's an obvious yes. We still see the same third and short BS we have since the days of Bratkowski. Shovel passes, tosses 5 yards back from the LOS, dumbass attempts at trickery... The continuous rotating of RB's after Lazor said he wanted to get away from the gimmick.

Marvin, please... Back the f*** off.

I would lean towards 'i doubt it'. At least not during a game. Marv has coaches that he wants because he wants them to do things his way. That stuff is ironed out in camp and preseason. 

I don't doubt that he would say something during film, or sometime in a meeting during the week, but i don't think he interferes with his coordinators during a game. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-08-2017, 09:27 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Anyone that thinks it is a coincidence that ALL of the OC's over ALL these years do the EXACT same thing is NUTZ.

It is not a coincidence.

Marv is the problem and have said it for years that Defensive minded people need to stick to Defense.

Agree with you Pat.

Marv needs to get out of Lazor's ear.

It's not uncommon for all the OCs under Marv to follow his philosophy...but they obviously do it in different ways. 

Otherwise, you wouldn't have seen the Bengals throwing so much and trying to score a TD on their 2nd to last possession today. 

That possession kind of blows the assumption out of the water. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-08-2017, 10:14 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Guess what the losers of the Superbow did? They stopped running the ball and did not adjust.

Guess what the winners did? Adjusted and threw the ball cause they were down.

You have to adjust to the other team and Marvin Lewis believes from his own words that adjustments are "journalistic jargon".

Marv is great at putting a good team together, especially Defense, he don't know Offense.

You kind of have to admit that every team in the NFL would start throwing the ball all over the yard when they're down 25 in the 2nd half. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-08-2017, 10:42 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: It's not uncommon for all the OCs under Marv to follow his philosophy...but they obviously do it in different ways. 

Otherwise, you wouldn't have seen the Bengals throwing so much and trying to score a TD on their 2nd to last possession today. 

That possession kind of blows the assumption out of the water. 

Did not get to see that possession but i will take your word on it.

Still, one possession doesn't throw all the years out of the water.

Just happy Marv is getting out of Lazor's bidness.

(10-08-2017, 10:45 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: You kind of have to admit that every team in the NFL would start throwing the ball all over the yard when they're down 25 in the 2nd half. 

Of course and with a 25 point lead Marv might of been able to hold onto that lead.

Difference is, he cannot outcoach a good coach to get there cause he cannot adjust or even understand the thought.

[t3r3e3]

(10-08-2017, 10:24 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Look how good Hue is after he got rid of Marvin's meddling. He's currently 1-20 as the Brown's HC.

Hue inherited either the worst or second worst (S.F.) team in the league. Other than the Bengals game, the Browns have been in every game this year. They lost a bunch of close games last year with the youngest team in the league. The Browns are getting incrementally better, and should be relevant in other year or so. Too much young talent and draft capital to not be.

[*bfine32*]

(10-08-2017, 10:58 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: Hue inherited either the worst or second worst (S.F.) team in the league.  Other than the Bengals game, the Browns have been in every game this year.  They lost a bunch of close games last year with the youngest team in the league.  The Browns are getting incrementally better, and should be relevant in other year or so.  Too much young talent and draft capital to not be.

What did Marvin inherit? 

[Pat5775]

Ok folks I'll admit I was a little tipsy when I first made this thread and I'm still buzzing a little bit now but here goes.

I'm not saying Marv is in his ear all the time, I just wonder how much freedom the OC really has. Again, the infuriating shovel pass we've seen countless times from every coordinator under Marv. The third and short pitch sideways or handoff 5 yards behind the LOS. It's the same infuriating, conservative and at time downright stupid stuff we've seen several times over Marvs tenure.

As a whole, Lazor has been excellent. But he seems to be yet another OC that calls the same typical head scratchers at inopportune times. Again... Coincidence? I doubt it.

There is little doubt in my mind that Marv is involved in some way. In what capacity? We'll likely never know.

[Shake n Blake]

(10-08-2017, 11:04 PM)bfine32 Wrote: What did Marvin inherit? 

Carson Palmer, Jon Kitna, Rudi Johnson, Chad Johnson, TJ Houshmandzadeh, Willie Anderson, Rich Braham, Levi Jones, Justin Smith and Brian Simmons?

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-08-2017, 11:12 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Carson Palmer, Jon Kitna, Rudi Johnson, Chad Johnson, TJ Houshmandzadeh, Willie Anderson, Rich Braham, Levi Jones, Justin Smith and Brian Simmons?

Yeah, schlubs

[Pat5775]

(10-08-2017, 10:24 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote:  You honestly think this team doesn't make halftime adjustments? Seriously Marvin knows more football then me and you or anyone else on this board. The fact that people think the guy is an idiot and cant coach shows the idiotodacy of this fanbase. For Christ sakes the dude coached one of the greatest defenses of all time and won a Superbowl.

     

.... Wow... I... Wow...

First off, what he did in Baltimore has NOTHING to do with his head coaching abilities. Looking at someone's career as a coordinator is a beyond asinine way to judge someone as a head coach. I would think Marvs body of work as a HC would speak for itself to every Bengal fan on the planet by now but clearly... Some of you are still wearing the black Jesus blinders from 2003-2005. 

And actually, there are quite a few posters on this board alone I would trust managing a game better than Marv. It took Marv how long to get rid of Nuge when 90% of the board could see he had lost it? How long did we continue to roll with the likes of Nate Livings, Eric Ghiacuc, Brad St Louis and Dennis Roland before changes were made? How about Ogbeuhi? Who decided to roll into this season with Ken f***ing Zampese? The vast majority of these boards saw these obvious personnel issues and wanted changes long before Marv did a damn thing. Marv may not be an idiot but he damn sure is not a quality head coach.

[Shake n Blake]

(10-08-2017, 11:10 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: There is little doubt in my mind that Marv is involved in some way. In what capacity? We'll likely never know.

He's the head coach. Of course he has input. Hard telling how much, but I've always imagined the OC's being able to call their own game, but they also have to adjust according to what Marv wants to see in-game. Do people honestly think the man isn't pulling any strings as far as game planning and play calling?

That he never has any ideas for plays or how the game should "flow"?

So yeah, of course he's involved. It's near impossible for us to completely nail down where Marv's influence starts and ends though, and I can see where Marv fans would feel it's unfair to blame any negative on Marv. I do think the ultra conservative nature of the offense once we get a lead is a Marv thing. It's normal to drain clock late. We seem to jump into that mode a little early sometimes though. 20-7 lead early in the 3rd? Better start running the crap out of the ball. 

The shovel passes are a throwback to the Brat days, but I don't recall Jay or Hue using them a ton. 

[Pat5775]

(10-08-2017, 11:12 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Carson Palmer, Jon Kitna, Rudi Johnson, Chad Johnson, TJ Houshmandzadeh, Willie Anderson, Rich Braham, Levi Jones, Justin Smith and Brian Simmons?

Technically, Marv drafted Carson. A smart, yet obvious first choice as a HC. 

[Shake n Blake]

(10-08-2017, 10:24 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote:  You honestly think this team doesn't make halftime adjustments? Seriously Marvin knows more football then me and you or anyone else on this board. The fact that people think the guy is an idiot and cant coach shows the idiotodacy of this fanbase. For Christ sakes the dude coached one of the greatest defenses of all time and won a Superbowl.

J24 is channeling Fred here.

[Shake n Blake]

(10-08-2017, 11:23 PM)Pat5775 Wrote: Technically, Marv drafted Carson. A smart, yet obvious first choice as a HC. 

Yeah he did draft Carson, but like you say, CP was the consensus #1 pick in that draft. Whoever held the pick was taking CP.

That's why I just say Marv inherited him. Among several other all-time Bengals legends.

[Pat5775]

(10-08-2017, 11:30 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Yeah he did draft Carson, but like you say, CP was the consensus #1 pick in that draft. Whoever held the pick was taking CP.

That's why I just say Marv inherited him. Among several other all-time Bengals legends.

Fair enough. Your point still stands 

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-08-2017, 10:58 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: Hue inherited either the worst or second worst (S.F.) team in the league. Other than the Bengals game, the Browns have been in every game this year. They lost a bunch of close games last year with the youngest team in the league. The Browns are getting incrementally better, and should be relevant in other year or so. Too much young talent and draft capital to not be.

2011 is calling, they want their joke back.

The Browns will NEVER get better, whether it is a little bit or exponentially, but thanks for the laugh

[CornerBlitz]

(10-08-2017, 06:12 PM)bfine32 Wrote: In my years on the board I have discovered a theme:

If it's good. Someone other than Marvin did it

If it's bad: Marvin did it.

I don't agree with you on many things but in this instance, i'd have to agree.

Any time i criticize Dalton it's always Marvin's fault, not Daltons. The argument gets old after a while.