OJ Howard

[Deanlj69]

I know we have no clue what John Ross can do and this was probably addressed within other threads but with Eifert going out for th3 year (big surprise) as well as being a free agent at year end wouldn’t OJ look really good right now? I was shocked at the Ross pick to begin with not that I had anything against him but he did seem like a potential WR version of Eifert with injury bug and so far it’s seeming that way. I just feel Howard or a couple other choices were much safer picks

[Shake n Blake]

It sucks that Ross is off to a bad start, but it's not like Howard is doing much to be envious about. 4 catches (on 9 targets) in 4 games.

Could be rookie struggles, but either way we're probably better off with Kroft right now.

[*bfine32*]

I was/am not a fan of the Ross pick, but if you're going to look back at least pick someone that is doing something, such as David Njoku

[Deanlj69]

Tampa does have Brate who is a solid TE so maybe it’s a case of easing him in but I guess I would have gambled on the guy with no injury history or even on someone else. I just hope Ross isn’t Eifert 2.0 playing WR and plays like his last year in college

[Deanlj69]

I sure do miss Gresham

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(10-11-2017, 10:35 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: It sucks that Ross is off to a bad start, but it's not like Howard is doing much to be envious about. 4 catches (on 9 targets) in 4 games.

Could be rookie struggles, but either way we're probably better off with Kroft right now.

Yeah, Howard hasn't been all that. Probably a mixture of rookie struggles and the fact that Cameron Brate is around, who is a good underrated TE. (56/660/8 last year, 15/205/3 so far this year)

TE is also a position where you don't really get monster rookie seasons. It's most certainly a position where you need a year in the NFL to learn.

Gronk Yr1: 42/546/10
Gronk Yr2: 90/1,327/17

Graham Yr1: 31/356/5
Graham Yr2: 99/1,310/11

Witten Yr1: 35/347/1
Witten Yr2: 87/980/6

Gates Yr1: 24/389/2
Gates Yr2: 81/964/13

Gonzalez Yr1: 33/368/2
Gonzalez Yr2: 59/621/2
(He actually took until Yr3 before he has a monster season of 76/849/11, which was enormous in 1999.)

- - - - - - - -

So it's unlikely any TE in the 2017 draft class would have a huge impact this year. If you wanted a real huge impact pick (from someone who was actually chosen around that pick, so no 3rd round pick with hindsight 20/20), the Bengals should have taken Malik Hooker with the 9th overall pick. Guy's a massive ballhawk with 3 interceptions already. Not that it's terribly surprising after he had 7 picks last year in college, including 3 pick-6s.

[Essex Johnson]

(10-11-2017, 10:18 PM)Deanlj69 Wrote: I know we have no clue what John Ross can do and this was probably addressed within other threads but with Eifert going out for th3 year (big surprise) as well as being a free agent at year end wouldn’t OJ look really good right now? I was shocked at the Ross pick to begin with not that I had anything against him but he did seem like a potential WR version of Eifert with injury bug and so far it’s seeming that way. I just feel Howard or a couple other choices were much safer picks

OJ doing nothing right now so can;t really judge this pick yet.. one guy hurt not playing . one guy not hurt not putting up any stats, hell Kroft performing much better than Howard right now

[BFritz21]

(10-11-2017, 10:59 PM)Deanlj69 Wrote: I sure do miss Gresham

I don't.

He was ok but not really the physical presence we want at tight end.

He wasn't anything special and wasn't enough of a difference maker to miss.

[*bfine32*]

(10-11-2017, 10:59 PM)Deanlj69 Wrote: I sure do miss Gresham

Most around here applauded our cutting ties with Gresh; I did not. This is Tyler's 5th year, the same number Gresh played for us. Gresh had over 150 more catches and 1200 yards. 

[BobJones4980]

(10-11-2017, 11:14 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Most around here applauded our cutting ties with Gresh; I did not. This is Tyler's 5th year, the same number Gresh played for us. Gresh had over 150 more catches and 1200 yards. 

Yea and it only took him 35 more games to do it and he still only had 4 more TDs than Eifert.

He also hasn't exactly been stellar since we let him go, 1 TD over the last 3 season and never over 400 yards, I mean I don't think we lost much.

Injuries suck and I actually think moving on from Eifert outside of a cheap 1 year deal is the best option for the team but Gresham was not and is not the answer for this team.

[*bfine32*]

(10-11-2017, 11:28 PM)BobJones4980 Wrote: Yea and it only took him 35 more games to do it and he still only had 4 more TDs than Eifert.

Not sure we should hold Gresh's ability to stay healthy against him and more TDs is more TDs. Thanks for bringing that up.

As to not doing well since he left here; it's Arizona. Who is the last TE that did anything of merit?

Parting ways with Gresham was a mistake. I don't like always being right, but I am. 

[PlayadLc]

Kroft>Gresham.

[*bfine32*]

(10-11-2017, 11:34 PM)PlayadLc Wrote: Kroft>Gresham.

Kroft receptions first 2 years in the league: 21

Gresh receptions first 2 years in the league: 108

[*Synric*]

(10-11-2017, 11:34 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Not sure we should hold Gresh's ability to stay healthy against him and more TDs is more TDs. Thanks for bringing that up.

As to not doing well since he left here; it's Arizona. Who is the last TE that did anything of merit?

Parting ways with Gresham was a mistake. I don't like always being right, but I am. 

It points out the fact he was and is not a good redzone receiver. 

Gresham has developed into a great blocker, but as receiver he's quite slow and doesn't have good short area quickness. Not mention the drops and fumbles.

He did become a damn good blocker though...

[Hammerstripes]

We're actually not that bad off with Kroft and C.J.

[BobJones4980]

(10-11-2017, 11:34 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Not sure we should hold Gresh's ability to stay healthy against him and more TDs is more TDs. Thanks for bringing that up.

As to not doing well since he left here; it's Arizona. Who is the last TE that did anything of merit?

Parting ways with Gresham was a mistake. I don't like always being right, but I am. 

First its not holding it against him, it just makes it clear that Gresham is nowhere near the type of player Eifert is when he is on the field. I mean if you really think having a TE that is lucky to get 50 yards a game and almost never gets in the endzone would have made some kind of difference for us I don't really know what to tell you. I mean Kroft(This year) and Uzomah(Last year) both showed they are capable of that. So why would we pay a vet more to do the same thing as a rookie? 

As for who did anything of merit in AZ, Fells? I mean he put up similar numbers in 2015 to Greshams best year and in Arizona with more TDs. 2014 John Carlson 350 yards and a TD almost identical to Greshams best season in AZ. 2013 Rob Housler 454 yards 1 TD. 2012 Rob Housler 417 yards. 

So who has done anything of merit in AZ nobody really including Gresham. If you compare the numbers he is at best on the same level as Housler, John Carson, and Fells. So is he really worth keeping when he is dropping balls and constantly getting penalties when he is putting up similar or worse numbers to these scrubs?

But you keep telling yourself you were right on this one. 

[*bfine32*]

(10-11-2017, 11:50 PM)BobJones4980 Wrote: First its not holding it against him, it just makes it clear that Gresham is nowhere near the type of player Eifert is when he is on the field. I mean if you really think having a TE that is lucky to get 50 yards a game and almost never gets in the endzone would have made some kind of difference for us I don't really know what to tell you. I mean Kroft(This year) and Uzomah(Last year) both showed they are capable of that. So why would we pay a vet more to do the same thing as a rookie? 

As for who did anything of merit in AZ, Fells? I mean he put up similar numbers in 2015 to Greshams best year and in Arizona with more TDs. 2014 John Carlson 350 yards and a TD almost identical to Greshams best season in AZ. 2013 Rob Housler 454 yards 1 TD. 2012 Rob Housler 417 yards. 

So who has done anything of merit in AZ nobody really including Gresham. If you compare the numbers he is at best on the same level as Housler, John Carson, and Fells. So is he really worth keeping when he is dropping balls and constantly getting penalties when he is putting up similar or worse numbers to these scrubs?

But you keep telling yourself you were right on this one. 

Best ability is availability. 

You also helped me support the fact that AZ doesn't really use a TE as a receiving threat. 

You and others can say it was a good move to let Gresh go. I did not and still do not. You keep telling folks I was wrong.

[*Synric*]

(10-11-2017, 11:55 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Best ability is availability. 

You also helped me support the fact that AZ doesn't really use a TE as a receiving threat. 

You and others can say it was a good move to let Gresh go. I did not and still do not. 

I wouldn't have complained if they resigned him. Like I said he became of the best blocking TEs in the NFL. But I'm not gonna say he was anything but mediocre as a receiver.

[GreenCornBengal]

Man that 4 catches for 92 yards would totally put Cinci over the top.

OJ Howard has been pedestrian at best. Probably wouldn't have done shit here. Let's be honest.

[*bfine32*]

(10-11-2017, 11:59 PM)Synric Wrote: I wouldn't have complained if they resigned him. Like I said he became of the best blocking TEs in the NFL. But I'm not gonna say he was anything but mediocre as a receiver.

Gresh is one of only 3 TEs in the history of the NFL to have at least 50 catches their first 3 years in the league. He only got 46 his 4th year as Tyler became the focus, but he returned the next year to grab over 60 while Tyler played 1 game.

Mediocre receivers do not do what Gresh did here.