OJ Howard

[*Synric*]

(10-12-2017, 12:04 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Gresh is one of only 3 TEs in the history of the NFL to have at least 50 catches their first 3 years in the league. He only got 46 his 4th year as Tyler became the focus, but he returned the next year to grab over 60 while Tyler played 1 game.

Mediocre receivers do not do what Gresh did here. 

When the bengals gave Jerome Simpson a chance he had over 50 catches in 2011does that make him a good receiver? No.

Gresham could run a 5 yard hitch and 5 yard out using his body to wall off defensers and was good eith the ball in his hands. But if you asked him to run anytbing over that and he had problems creating separation due to lack of quickness and body control. People here complained they weren't using him right because he never ran deeper routes. It wasn't that they never did it was that those kinda routes didn't play to his strengths.

[GreenCornBengal]

(10-12-2017, 12:04 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Gresh is one of only 3 TEs in the history of the NFL to have at least 50 catches their first 3 years in the league. He only got 46 his 4th year as Tyler became the focus, but he returned the next year to grab over 60 while Tyler played 1 game.

Mediocre receivers do not do what Gresh did here. 

So, was it the entire NFL that missed out on Gresham's talent, because he didn't do much after leaving Cincinnati.

Tell me more about this stud TE.

[*bfine32*]

(10-12-2017, 12:13 AM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: So, was it the entire NFL that missed out on Gresham's talent, because he didn't do much after leaving Cincinnati.

Tell me more about this stud TE.

Well Gresh had back surgery after his last year here to repair a herniated disc he played through here while Eifert played 1 game. So he didn't get all the offers he most likely would have although at least 3 teams wanted him.

After his first year in AZ both CHI and NYJ offered him 4-year deals that he turned down to remain in AZ.

Bengal fans trying to spin the narrative that Gresh was/is not a talented TE make me chuckle a little bit. 

[BobJones4980]

(10-11-2017, 11:55 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Best ability is availability. 

You also helped me support the fact that AZ doesn't really use a TE as a receiving threat. 

You and others can say it was a good move to let Gresh go. I did not and still do not. You keep telling folks I was wrong.

Yea availability is great and all but 40 yard games and seasons of 0-1 TD can be done by many TE's in the league including Kroft or Uzomah.

I also showed you the names that did the same or better than Gresh, all nobodies that can do everything Gresham does and some of them did it better, but take away what you want from that as you usually do.

You were wrong. We have 3rd and 5th rounds picks that can do what Gresham does.

[*Synric*]

(10-12-2017, 12:21 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Well Gresh had back surgery after his last year here to repair a herniated disc he played through here while Eifert played 1 game. So he didn't get all the offers he most likely would have although at least 3 teams wanted him.

After his first year in AZ both CHI and NYJ offered him 4-year deals that he turned down to remain in AZ.

Bengal fans trying to spin the narrative that Gresh was/is not a talented TE make me chuckle a little bit. 

So your narrative is even though he's this amazing receiving TE Arizona just refuses to use him that way...he then resigned in ARZ to be ill used as a receiver.

That makes me chuckle.

[*bfine32*]

(10-12-2017, 12:12 AM)Synric Wrote: When the bengals gave Jerome Simpson a chance he had over 50 catches in 2011does that make him a good receiver? No.

Gresham could run a 5 yard hitch and 5 yard out using his body to wall off defensers and was good eith the ball in his hands. But if you asked him to run anytbing over that and he had problems creating separation due to lack of quickness and body control. People here complained they weren't using him right because he never ran deeper routes. It wasn't that they never did it was that those kinda routes didn't play to his strengths.

You go with the idea that being 1 of only 3 TEs in the history on the NFL with over 50 catches each of their first 3 years is a sign of a mediocre receiver. I will not. 

[*bfine32*]

(10-12-2017, 12:25 AM)Synric Wrote: So your narrative is even though he's this amazing receiving TE Arizona just refuses to use him that way...he then resigned in ARZ to be ill used as a receiver.

That makes me chuckle.

AZ just signed him to a 4 year deal, Obviously they like what he's doing.

You go with calling one of only 3 TEs in the history of the NFL a mediocre receiver. 

Folks can decide what is truly chuckle-worthy.

I'm gonna let you and Bob Jones go. I see you've dug you heels in. You guys go with Gresh was/is not a talented TE and it was not a mistake to let him go. I'll go with he was/is a talented TE and it was a mistake to let him go.  

[*Synric*]

(10-12-2017, 12:26 AM)bfine32 Wrote: You go with the idea that being 1 of only 3 TEs in the history on the NFL with over 50 catches each of their first 3 years is a sign of a mediocre receiver. I will not. 

Andy Dalton is one of very QBs to throw for 3000+ yards 20+ TDs in hist first 3 years. He's one of what very few QBs to take his team to the playoffs 5 times in a row.


You seem to call him a mediocre QB alot lol. Just saying pot kettle man.

[BobJones4980]

(10-12-2017, 12:31 AM)bfine32 Wrote: AZ just signed him to a 4 year deal, Obviously they like what he's doing.

You go with calling one of only 3 TEs in the history of the NFL a mediocre receiver. 

Folks can decide what is truly chuckle-worthy.

I'm gonna let you and Bob Jones go. I see you've dug you heels in. You guys go with Gresh was/is not a talented TE and it was not a mistake to let him go. I'll go with he was/is a talented TE and it was a mistake to let him go.  

I like how we dug our heels in when you are literally defending a guy that is lucky to get 40 yards a game and 1 TD per season because of something he did years ago. 

[*Go Cards*]

Was a big fan of Greshams talent but he did fumble a bit.

Gresham 12 fumbles
Eiffert zero fumbles

Guess Gresh won out on that one too.

Both had all the potential in the world yet neither really worked out the way I thought they would for Bengals.

Do not hate either of them though. They both gave their all on the field for us and wish them both the best.

[McC]

(10-12-2017, 12:04 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Gresh is one of only 3 TEs in the history of the NFL to have at least 50 catches their first 3 years in the league. He only got 46 his 4th year as Tyler became the focus, but he returned the next year to grab over 60 while Tyler played 1 game.

Mediocre receivers do not do what Gresh did here. 

And his time was up.  By the time he left, the coaches were done with him.  He was never gonna come back here so this is all kinda silly.

[ah5]

Ross is the new Eifhurt. I hope I'm wrong but damn, hated the pick at first but I pumped myself up. His statement about everyone gets hurt kinda rubbed me the wrong way and already have him labeled as Eifhurt 2.0. Don't say shit like that as a rookie just say you'll prove yourself when you get back instead of making excuses.

Wish we had gone Howard regardless if 9 was over drafting him.

[PlayadLc]

(10-11-2017, 11:40 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Kroft receptions first 2 years in the league: 21

Gresh receptions first 2 years in the league: 108

Gresh's first two years in the league? That was 7 years ago.

I'm saying Kroft is better than Gresh right now.

[The Caped Crusader]

Funny how people defend Gresham quicker than Dalton...

[TSwigZ]

Nobody defended gresh in his last few years here. If he wasn't fumbling he was causing a crucial penalty or making a bonehead play. That said at least he was available

[The Caped Crusader]

(10-12-2017, 03:36 AM)TSwigZ Wrote: Nobody defended gresh in his last few years here. If he wasn't fumbling he was causing a crucial penalty or making a bonehead play. That said at least he was available

So is my Mother...but I'll pass.

[grampahol]

Sure does a lot of good to argue over players not on this team. 
Right now I'm focusing on the guys we have, not the ones we don't have.
Kroft is turning out to be a pretty good TE. He can block and can catch.  He's not a huge TD threat, but oh well.  He seems to be a real go-to guy on 3rd down which is huge. 
Uzamah? I'm not as sold on him.  He's dropped several passes though not this season because he hasn't been on the field much yet.
The book is still open on Ross. I'm not going to try to predict his future, but it would be nice to have him healthy and producing at a high level. 
As for Eifert.. ehhh.. He's not on the field and healthy anymore. It was nice while it lasted and it's possible he might make it back this season, but I seriously doubt it. The bengals site seems to have written him off for season ending surgery. He's certainly not in any kind of shape to bargain for a huge contract next year..

[muskiesfan]

I've always liked Gresham. I felt it was time to move because Eifert was the better TE, but Mr. Glass is zero help when he can't even stay on the field.

Gresham did develop into a very good blocking TE, but that was part of the problem with his time in Cincinnati. He was drafted as a receiving TE, but Marvin wanted him to be just as good at blocking. I think that stunted some of Gresham's potential as a Bengal. Often, Lewis seems to want to take square pegs and force them into round holes. Draft a receiving tight end in the first round, but break his balls about blocking.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-11-2017, 10:35 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: It sucks that Ross is off to a bad start, but it's not like Howard is doing much to be envious about. 4 catches (on 9 targets) in 4 games.

Could be rookie struggles, but either way we're probably better off with Kroft right now.

There's a difference with someone like Howard and other drafted TEs like Njoku, Engram, etc.
Howard is mainly being used as the blocking TE in TB while Brate as the receiving TE. Plus, Howard is like the 5th option in that offense behind Evans, DJax, Doug Martin, and Brate. It's though for him to get the necessary targets because of all the other weapons and there already being an established TE there that stays healthy.

Meanwhile, David Njoku is on a team that has very little when it comes to other receiving threats, so he has produced more as expected.
Engram is being used primarily as a receiver and will see a lot of work with all the NYG receivers going down and the fact their run game is terrible.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-12-2017, 09:40 AM)muskiesfan Wrote: I've always liked Gresham. I felt it was time to move because Eifert was the better TE, but Mr. Glass is zero help when he can't even stay on the field.

Gresham did develop into a very good blocking TE, but that was part of the problem with his time in Cincinnati. He was drafted as a receiving TE, but Marvin wanted him to be just as good at blocking. I think that stunted some of Gresham's potential as a Bengal. Often, Lewis seems to want to take square pegs and force them into round holes. Draft a receiving tight end in the first round, but break his balls about blocking.

Since at least Marvin Lewis came to Cincinnati, every TE the Bengals have had was expected to be at least serviceable as a blocker. It's why we never saw anything out of Chase Coffman. He never saw the field because he couldn't block. If you can't block, you won't be used much on the Cincinnati Bengals offense.

EDIT - And that's why Howard would have been a great fit on this team. He excelled at blocking at Alabama. He was probably the best blocker out of all the TEs in the draft. On top of that, he was very athletic and has a ton of potential as a receiving weapon. It's just behind his blocking ability right now.