Dalton retires to become a Monk POLL 2. Who would you have be the long term QB ?

[depthchart]

Stranger things have happened, so let's assume Andy Dalton announces Pre Draft that he will seek a higher calling and Retire.

Bengals are in scramble mode to get a Long Term QB option. 
 

Who is the guy that you would try to get to be the new long term Face of the Franchise at the QB position ?


See the POLL options and choose your guy.

[Shake n Blake]

I'd have to look hard at Mason Rudolph. He put up great numbers at a big school. He has the size (6'5" 230, same as CP). His highlights check out and look good to me. Not sure why he isn't talked about more. We'd probably want to trade up a few spots to get him.

If not Rudolph, my #2 choice would be trading up for Sam Darnold. This would be pricier, but Darnold seems like a safe pick. Josh Allen has that size and the arm, but his numbers and tape are bad. Heard he often sails screen passes. Just doesn't have any touch. Lamar Jackson is too frail and inaccurate. I don't like Rosen's attitude. Mayfield looks like Manziel. Not as far as attitude, but as far as I don't think his game will translate.

So yeah...it'd be Rudolph as my primary choice (at 21, we wouldn't have to move up much), and Darnold as the other guy I wouldn't be mad about. Poo poo on the rest.

[depthchart]

(04-18-2018, 12:59 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I'd have to look hard at Mason Rudolph. He put up great numbers at a big school. He has the size (6'5" 230, same as CP). His highlights check out and look good to me. Not sure why he isn't talked about more. We'd probably want to trade up a few spots to get him.

If not Rudolph, my #2 choice would be trading up for Sam Darnold. This would be pricier, but Darnold seems like a safe pick. Josh Allen has that size and the arm, but his numbers and tape are bad. Heard he often sails screen passes. Just doesn't have any touch. Lamar Jackson is too frail and inaccurate. I don't like Rosen's attitude. Mayfield looks like Manziel. Not as far as attitude, but as far as I don't think his game will translate.

So yeah...it'd be Rudolph as my primary choice (at 21, we wouldn't have to move up much), and Darnold as the other guy I wouldn't be mad about. Poo poo on the rest.

Trading up into the Top 3 picks to get one of the Top rated QBs would cost a fortune in Draft picks over multiple years.

Would have to think long and hard before doing it, especially since the Bengals are so reliant on drafts versus Free Agency.

It will be interesting for me to see how the Poll plays out and what people on the Board would do.

Major "Cost versus Benefit" analysis when it comes to trading up into the top 3 or so picks.

[*bfine32*]

I'd have to see what the Browns would want for Tyrod Taylor. The kids career passer rating is just shy of 90 and is much higher than that over his time as a starter, despite having no one to throw to. Can also make plays with his feet. Then I would draft Lamar Jackson.

[fredtoast]

I am hoping Dalton would have announced his retirement before free agency. In that case we could have used the extra $15 million from his salary plus all of our high draft picks to improve O-line and TE. Then we draft Barrett in the middle rounds.

QBs going at the top of the first round are way to risky for what they costs. They all look good going into the draft, but after a couple of years at least half of them flop.

[Goalpost]

This is a stocked QB draft year, which has probably pushed Lamar Jackson down some. At 21, I would choose him.

[depthchart]

(04-18-2018, 01:45 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I am hoping Dalton would have announced his retirement before free agency.  In that case we could have used the extra $15 million from his salary plus all of our high draft picks to improve O-line and TE.  Then we draft Barrett in the middle rounds.

QBs going at the top of the first round are way to risky for what they costs.  They all look good going into the draft, but after a couple of years at least half of them flop.

For the purposes of this Poll, I am assuming that Dalton announces it today.  April 18, 2018.

The Bengals would be in a scramble.

So you would see JT Barrett as the long term option ?

[BengalHawk62]

I'm sure I'm in the minority, but give me Kap in this hypothetical situation.  the kid has skills and it really is a wonder why he hasn't been picked up yet.  is there a conspiracy against him?

Then I would look for another QB in the draft. Lamarr Jackson perhaps? Mason Rudolph?

[depthchart]

(04-18-2018, 12:59 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I'd have to look hard at Mason Rudolph. He put up great numbers at a big school. He has the size (6'5" 230, same as CP). His highlights check out and look good to me. Not sure why he isn't talked about more. We'd probably want to trade up a few spots to get him.

If not Rudolph, my #2 choice would be trading up for Sam Darnold. This would be pricier, but Darnold seems like a safe pick. Josh Allen has that size and the arm, but his numbers and tape are bad. Heard he often sails screen passes. Just doesn't have any touch. Lamar Jackson is too frail and inaccurate. I don't like Rosen's attitude. Mayfield looks like Manziel. Not as far as attitude, but as far as I don't think his game will translate.

So yeah...it'd be Rudolph as my primary choice (at 21, we wouldn't have to move up much), and Darnold as the other guy I wouldn't be mad about. Poo poo on the rest.

I am torn as to what I would do.

I am considering Lamar Jackson, Mason Rudolph or trading for Nick Foles.

It is my understanding that Nick Foles has worked with Bill Lazor in the past.  Lazor was his QB coach in 2013.

Lamar Jackson's college numbers when compared to Michael Vick's make me think he could maybe be a better passer than Vick or at least do as well as Vick in that area. Jackson is 3 inches taller than Vick and about the same weight, so he may need to gain some weight & strength. The height advantage should be a plus. Vick was a 4 time Pro Bowler which has me at least interested in Lamar Jackson since to me they are similar. Not sure I want to commit to an offense styled around Lamar though.

Vick College stats - 56.3 completion percentage, 3,279 passing yards, 21 pass td, 12 interceptions, 1,216 rush yards, 17 rush td, 5.5 rush avg

Lamar College - 57 completion percentage, 9,043 passing yards, 69 pass td, 27 interceptions, 4,132 rush yards, 50 rush td, 6.3 avg


Mason Rudolph seems like a solid value option with good qualities as you mentioned.


Nick Foles is more plug and play with ties to Bill Lazor. I would definitely be inquiring to see what the Eagles would take for him. If the price was right, I could see myself going this direction. Lazor worked with Foles as his QB Coach in 2013 where Foles started 10 games and had a 119.2 rating that season. He just turned 29 years old and has proven that he can handle the spotlight in big games.

Right now I am kicking the tires on these 3 guys since trading up for one of the top 3 guys would cost a fortune in draft picks.

[Shake n Blake]

(04-18-2018, 02:44 PM)depthchart Wrote: I am torn as to what I would do.

I am considering Lamar Jackson, Mason Rudolph or trading for Nick Foles.

It is my understanding that Nick Foles has worked with Bill Lazor in the past.  Lazor was his QB coach from what I understand.

Lamar Jackson's college numbers when compared to Michael Vick's make me think he could maybe be a better passer than Vick or at least do as well as Vick in that area. Jackson is 3 inches taller than Vick and about the same weight, so he may need to gain some weight & strength. The height advantage should be a plus. Vick was a 4 time Pro Bowler which has me at least interested in Lamar Jackson since to me they are similar. Not sure I want to commit to an offense styled around Lamar though.

Vick College stats - 56.3 completion percentage, 3,279 passing yards, 21 pass td, 12 interceptions, 1,216 rush yards, 17 rush td, 5.5 rush avg

Lamar College - 57 completion percentage, 9,043 passing yards, 69 pass td, 27 interceptions, 4,132 rush yards, 50 rush td, 6.3 avg


Mason Rudolph seems like a solid value option with good qualities as you mentioned.


Nick Foles is more plug and play with ties to Bill Lazor. I would definitely be inquiring to see what the Eagles would take for him. If the price was right, I could see myself going this direction. He just turned 29 years old and has proven that he can handle the spotlight in big games.

Right now I am kicking the tires on these 3 guys since trading up for one of the top 3 guys would cost a fortune in draft picks.

I'm not as big on running QB's as some. Too often it's one-read-then-run. They could be losing out on a bigger play because they're inclined to run when their primary is covered. They tend to lean on that ability. Also, so many of them wind up having shorter careers. RGIII got wrecked almost immediately. Steve McNair and McNabb were always battling injury. Vick himself only played 16 games once in his entire career, and was washed up by the time he hit 32...despite the fact that he missed a chunk of time in jail.

Plus Vick's lack of accuracy translated to the pro's, where he only completed 56.2% of his passes, and only hit 3000 yards twice, maxing out at 3303 yards. Is that really what we want? A more frail version of Vick? 

You do mention my main issue with Jackson: Do we really want to build the offense around his specific skill-set...especially when he's likely to spend some time injured? 

I just think people fall in love with the exciting physical attributes and don't think about how it will all fit.

------------------------

For me it's Rudolph...but Nick Foles would be intriguing for obvious reasons. That said, I believe the Eagles are asking a king's ransom for their SB hero.

[depthchart]

(04-18-2018, 03:01 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I'm not as big on running QB's as some. Too often it's one-read-then-run. They could be losing out on a bigger play because they're inclined to run when their primary is covered. They tend to lean on that ability. Also, so many of them wind up having shorter careers. RGIII got wrecked almost immediately. Steve McNair and McNabb were always battling injury. Vick himself only played 16 games once in his entire career, and was washed up by the time he hit 32...despite the fact that he missed a chunk of time in jail.

Plus Vick's lack of accuracy translated to the pro's, where he only completed 56.2% of his passes, and only hit 3000 yards twice, maxing out at 3303 yards. Is that really what we want? A more frail version of Vick? 

You do mention my main issue with Jackson: Do we really want to build the offense around his specific skill-set...especially when he's likely to spend some time injured? 

I just think people fall in love with the exciting physical attributes and don't think about how it will all fit.

------------------------

For me it's Rudolph...but Nick Foles would be intriguing for obvious reasons. That said, I believe the Eagles are asking a king's ransom for their SB hero.

If I did go with Lamar, it would be in part based on his 3 inches of extra height possibly translating into him being able to eventually pass from the pocket better than Vick. Even then, as you point out, I wonder how durable he would be and can he do well enough as a passer to make an eventual Super Bowl run someday. He may get to Pro Bowls being like Vick did but never really be a guy that consistently makes deep playoff runs. Being a good passer is critical in today's game. There are a lot of "ifs" and "maybes" with Lamar, as you point out.

The Eagles could demand more for Foles than I may want to give, so I could end up going with Mason Rudolph by default. Then keep a close eye on the QB market going forward while hoping Rudolph pans out.

I'd say I'm getting Foles if the price is right and then next choice is Rudolph. Lamar third due in part to concerns you raised that I also have.

I would take Lamar Jackson if he compared more favorably to Deshaun Watson in terms of passing ability.

Deshaun Watson College - 67.4 comp. percent, 10,168 passing yards, 90 pass td, 32 interceptions, 1,934 rush yards, 26 rush td, 4.4 avg

Lamar College - 57 completion percentage, 9,043 passing yards, 69 pass td, 27 interceptions, 4,132 rush yards, 50 rush td, 6.3 avg

I think that Deshaun Watson is a good enough passer from the pocket to go far. Needs to stay healthy. He is about 10 pounds heavier than Lamar. Watson and Vick seem to be good guys for gauging Lamar to coming out of college. Lamar may just lack the passing from the pocket credentials that I would want. Durability a concern also as you point out.

[bengalsturntup926]

I picked Lamar Jackson probably because he sounds realistic but there is part of me saying he wouldn't get us too far. I did a mock draft with mason 1st round and it just didn't feel right taking him.but I do like him he does remind me of Palmer ,but they say he's mr consistent.

The other prospects my feelings are

Josh Rosen - I actually like how he's cocky and he looks to have a high ceiling but you never know he could flop.

Josh allen- he would look good in stripes,I love a big arm ,I've already seen inconsistent accuracy out of Andy so I'm not scared of inaccuracy that much. I still don't know if hed flop .I don't feel good enough to draft up for him.

Baker mayfield- I was really big on him at first,I've simmered down on it , I think he could pick up the hype again with me or he can be a flop ,I see him as boom or bust. Can't say I trust him all the way to draft up.

Nick foles - I heard mentioned,I like that idea alot I'm surprised he wants to be backup this year.

[depthchart]

(04-18-2018, 04:36 PM)bengalsturntup926 Wrote: I picked Lamar Jackson probably because he sounds realistic but there is part of me saying he wouldn't get us too far. I did a mock draft with mason 1st round and it just didn't feel right taking him.but I do like him he does remind me of Palmer ,but they say he's mr consistent.

The other prospects my feelings are

Josh Rosen - I actually like how he's cocky and he looks to have a high ceiling but you never know he could flop.

Josh allen- he would look good in stripes,I love a big arm ,I've already seen inconsistent accuracy out of Andy so I'm not scared of inaccuracy that much. I still don't know if hed flop .I don't feel good enough to draft up for him.

Baker mayfield- I was really big on him at first,I've simmered down on it , I think he could pick up the hype again with me or he can be a flop ,I see him as boom or bust. Can't say I trust him all the way to draft up.

Nick foles - I heard mentioned,I like that idea alot I'm surprised he wants to be backup this year.

Nick Foles has it made.

He could never start another game in his life, make millions of dollars as a backup for years to come and still be a Super Bowl winning QB that beat Tom Brady for the rest of his life.

[grampahol]

Just intentionally tank to make sure we get number one pick the following season and hope there's a decent QB available and Mikey has a fatal heart attack before the draft?
That would be my strategy . Hell, maybe someone in the Brown/Blackburn clan gets greedy enough to poison him . 

[depthchart]

(04-18-2018, 05:54 PM)grampahol Wrote: Just intentionally tank to make sure we get number one pick the following season and hope there's a decent QB available and Mikey has a fatal heart attack before the draft?
That would be my strategy . Hell, maybe someone in the Brown/Blackburn clan gets greedy enough to poison him . 

Now, now Grampahol, you wouldn't want that.

What if Dalton's abrupt retirement to become a Monk backed Mike and Marvin into a corner where the pressure caused them to actually Hit on the QB they chose, leading to a Super Bowl win two seasons later, leading to another Marvin extension ?

This would be the Fairy Tale ending you should want for Mike. 

[Bilbo Saggins]

(04-18-2018, 01:32 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I'd have to see what the Browns would want for Tyrod Taylor. The kids career passer rating is just shy of 90 and is much higher than that over his time as a starter, despite having no one to throw to. Can also make plays with his feet. Then I would draft Lamar Jackson.

Have you seen him play much lately? Without his defense and run game last year he wouldn't have sniffed the playoffs. He feels phantom pressure, has poor anticipation, and has accuracy problems the likes of which Bengals starting qbs haven't had for quite a while. His QBR isn't bad, but he's a very safe game manager sort of player when he's performing his best.

Anyhow, Rosen is going to make a lot of the old coot GMs and owners look silly if/when they pass on him. Darnold was a turnover machine in college - that's unlikely to change at the next level. Allen doesn't have great anticipation - he'll wind up being somewhere between a Jake Locker and a Joe Flacco when all is said and done, Flacco being his ceiling I think. Mayfield may be solid with his football IQ. 

[bonesaw]

Mason Rudolph.

Still confused on why he isn't mentioned higher. Does he have a weak arm or something?

[SunsetBengal]

The number of Lamar Jackson responses amuses me. The same as all of the Teddy Bridgewater people, a few years back, look what happened to him...

If you have to go new franchise QB this year? Josh Allen.

[*bfine32*]

(04-18-2018, 08:25 PM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: Have you seen him play much lately? Without his defense and run game last year he wouldn't have sniffed the playoffs. He feels phantom pressure, has poor anticipation, and has accuracy problems the likes of which Bengals starting qbs haven't had for quite a while. His QBR isn't bad, but he's a very safe game manager sort of player when he's performing his best.

His QB rating is much above "not bad" and I've seen him play plenty. I have zero idea how a QB could have all those shortcomings and still perform as well as TT has over the last 3 years. Completion percentage is actually higher than Andy's so I'm not sure your accuracy/anticipation assertion carries much merit. 

[depthchart]

Top 4 choices in the POLL results so far:  (34 total Votes to this point)


7 votes for Lamar Jackson

6 votes for Mason Rudolph

5 votes to trade up for Baker Mayfield

4 votes to sign Colin Kaepernick


The Top 4 choices above combine for 22 of the 34 total votes or roughly 65% of all votes so far.