Hernandez or Wynn in Round One and Why

[kevin]

We can get Daniels, Price, Ragnow in TWO for a center. What we can't get in Two and should be there at pick 21 is a choice between Will Hernandez and Isaiah Wynn. Grabbing either Hernandez or Wynn in ONE and then Daniels, Price or Ragnow in TWO solves a lot of Bengals having worst O Line in NFL. Suddenly we aren't worst O Line in NFL anymore. As for RT, these picks help because Bengals guards and tackles from last year can compete for RT. I would like to see Bolling at Guard, but he has shown he can play tackle. Still, I'm thinking LT-Glenn, LG-Bolling, C-Daniels, Price or Ragnow, RG-Hernandez or Wynn, RT- Fisher, Ogbuehi, Westerman.

Bengals could take a Center in One and then not draft O Line rest of draft, but that's a mistake. Or they could take Center in One and get Tackle like Orlando Brown or somebody in TWO, but Hernandez and Wynn probably long gone. Bengals could also draft WR and QB early as some predict, and then just bend over and kiss season good-bye because they won't have a chance without blocking. It will be more of the Jacksonville game all season as Bengals O Line gets THUMPED all season and Dalton gets killed all season. I'm hoping this WR and QB talk is just pre draft poker bluff.

I could understand Bengals taking a defensive player in One or Two and a Center. There is no room or common sense to WR or QB early. Bengals have other huge major weaknesses on O Line first and Defense second. Our D is not as bad as our O Line, but both need draft help THIS YEAR.

[Hammerstripes]

The only problem with that scenario is that you are hoping that there is one of the top 3 centers are there at 46. IF Ragnow and Daniels go in round 1 (which I think is a reality), then someone could easily jump in front of us to grab Price.

That being said, grab Wynn or Hernandez at 21 and then move UP to get Ragnow.

[Au165]

(04-24-2018, 10:46 AM)kevin Wrote: We can get Daniels, Price, Ragnow in TWO for a center.  What we can't get in Two and should be there at pick 21 is a choice between Will Hernandez and Isaiah Wynn.   Grabbing either Hernandez or Wynn in ONE and then Daniels, Price or Ragnow in TWO solves a lot of Bengals having worst O Line in NFL.  Suddenly we aren't worst O Line in NFL anymore.  As for RT, these picks help because Bengals guards and tackles from last year can compete for RT. I would like to see Bolling at Guard, but he has shown he can play tackle. Still, I'm thinking LT-Glenn, LG-Bolling, C-Daniels, Price or Ragnow, RG-Hernandez or Wynn, RT- Fisher, Ogbuehi, Westerman.  

Bengals could take a Center in One and then not draft O Line rest of draft, but that's a mistake.  Or they could take Center in One and get Tackle like Orlando Brown or somebody in TWO, but Hernandez and Wynn probably long gone. Bengals could also draft WR and QB early as some predict, and then just bend over and kiss season good-bye because they won't have a chance without blocking.  It will be more of the Jacksonville game all season as Bengals O Line gets THUMPED all season and Dalton gets killed all season. I'm hoping this WR and QB talk is just pre draft poker bluff.

I could understand Bengals taking a defensive player in One or Two and a Center.   There is no room or common sense to WR or QB early. Bengals have other huge major weaknesses on O Line first and Defense second.  Our D is not as bad as our O Line, but both need draft help THIS YEAR.

Disagree, more and more it is looking like we get one or the other based on the latest news on Centers. Top tier guard or top tier Center will probably be our choice and I prefer Center. If you go the Price route you get a guy who can play either versatility wise which is nice. I prefer having Westerman or Hopkins at Guard than TJ Johnson at Center so I lean towards center. Now if you are okay with a guy like Corbett or Cole in the 2nd or 3rd round to go with a Wynn or Hernandez then you can go Guard first. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-24-2018, 12:22 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: The only problem with that scenario is that you are hoping that there is one of the top 3 centers are there at 46.  IF Ragnow and Daniels go in round 1 (which I think is a reality), then someone could easily jump in front of us to grab Price.

That being said, grab Wynn or Hernandez at 21 and then move UP to get Ragnow.

I agree with this, we cannot gamble on one of those Centers being there.

Luckily we have enough picks to make this happen, i just hope the interest that the Patriots, Panthers and Falcons
in Ragnow was for the 2nd round. The Bears are also definately in play as are the Vikings.

The thing is RT might be a bigger hole than RG, but i think that Wynn could play both in a pinch and the OT's in
this Draft are not the best. I take Wynn over Hernandez just cause of his versatility and he has so much better
hands and is extremely smart and can adjust in pass rush situations like no other G/T i have seen in a long time.

Wynn and then Ragnow/Price would be frickin awesome man. Fisher might beat out whoever we draft at RT
anyways, who knows with Pollack coaching him up.

[McC]

I hope like hell we don't spend out first pick on a G when we are so much more in need of a RT and a C. I think it would piss me off a lot.

If the plan is to get a C in the second, which I disagree with, if you can't get the RT in the first, go for a LB or edge rusher. Not a G. If you have to have a G, which we don't, get one of them in the third or fourth.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-24-2018, 01:01 PM)McC Wrote: I hope like hell we don't spend out first pick on a G when we are so much more in need of a RT and a C.  I think it would piss me off a lot.

If the plan is to get a C in the second, which I disagree with, if you can't get the RT in the first, go for a LB or edge rusher.  Not a G.  If you have to have a G, which we don't, get one of them in the third or fourth.

Well than you mean you don't want Hernandez. Wynn could play RT for us no problem and he might be better than
any OT in this class honestly. He doesn't have short arms, he has great bend, hands, feet and is a great run and pass
blocker with amazing adjustment skills. Would love Wynn, but i agree, not Hernarndez who is a pure RG.

But i wouldn't be pissed with Hernandez as long as we got a top Center. He is a bulldozer at RG we haven't had since
we had Bobbie.

[SunsetBengal]

I've been thinking about this. If both Wynn and Hernandez are sitting there at #21, you still draft the Center, Frank Ragnow. The reason being if you really want Wynn or Hernandez, one of them will be there in the top of the 2nd round. Might have to trade up a few spots, in order to get the specific one you're after, but with all the 5th and 7th round picks the Bengals have it's very doable.

[Luvnit2]

(04-24-2018, 01:32 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I've been thinking about this.  If both Wynn and Hernandez are sitting there at #21, you still draft the Center, Frank Ragnow.  The reason being if you really want Wynn or Hernandez, one of them will be there in the top of the 2nd round.  Might have to trade up a few spots, in order to get the specific one you're after, but with all the 5th and 7th round picks the Bengals have it's very doable.

There are lots of experts who think Daniels is better than Ragnow, many believe Daniels is a top 16 player in draft. I don't know, I like all 3 centers and hope Pollack makes right call as he will be the one coaching them.

I think based on pure need right now:
1. Center
2. Guard
3. Safety

So as much as I love a mauler OG like Hernandez, I think we need to take the biggest need first and then trade up (no guarantee) to get the guard as you have stated,

[*psychdoctor*]

(04-24-2018, 01:38 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: There are lots of experts who think Daniels is better than Ragnow, many believe Daniels is a top 16 player in draft. I don't know, I like all 3 centers and hope Pollack makes right call as he will be the one coaching them.

I think based on pure need right now:
1. Center
2. Guard
3. Safety

So as much as I love a mauler OG like Hernandez, I think we need to take the biggest need first and then trade up (no guarantee) to get the guard as you have stated,

I agree partially with your assessment.  But I feel Westerman and Redmond and Hopkins have shown enough talent for the Front Office to allow one of those three compete for starting RG.  Nevertheless, RT is a need.


If McGlinchey or Miller is there at 21, Bengals will draft their future RT.  I am not a fan of Miller at all.  But I think McGlinchey will play better at the RT position in the NFL.  They may miss out on a top Center but unlikely.  One of the top three centers will be there at 46.  


Another option would be to grab Wynn or Hernandez at 21 (I love both), draft a Center at 46, then grab Crosby or Brown in round 3.


With both of these scenarios the O-Line could look like this:


1-Glenn-Boling-Price/Ragnow/Daniels-Westerman-McGlinchey


2-Glenn-Boiling-Price/Rangow/Daniels-Wynn/Hernandez-Crosby/Brown.  




It comes down to McGlinchey being there at 21.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-24-2018, 01:32 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I've been thinking about this.  If both Wynn and Hernandez are sitting there at #21, you still draft the Center, Frank Ragnow.  The reason being if you really want Wynn or Hernandez, one of them will be there in the top of the 2nd round.  Might have to trade up a few spots, in order to get the specific one you're after, but with all the 5th and 7th round picks the Bengals have it's very doable.

I love this Sunset, grab Ragnow and trade up for Wynn baby.

Like you said, we have the picks to make it happen and we wouldn't be feeling desperate if we already
have Ragnow in the bag. Wynn is just so versatile, he can do whatever Pollack asks.

(04-24-2018, 01:38 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: There are lots of experts who think Daniels is better than Ragnow, many believe Daniels is a top 16 player in draft. I don't know, I like all 3 centers and hope Pollack makes right call as he will be the one coaching them.

I think based on pure need right now:
1. Center
2. Guard
3. Safety

So as much as I love a mauler OG like Hernandez, I think we need to take the biggest need first and then trade up (no guarantee) to get the guard as you have stated,

Well, Daniels may be the better Center for a pass first Offense and that is arguable as Ragnow has never
allowed a sack in his entire college career. Ragnow is a much better run blocker with longer arms, played
in the SEC and was coached by Beliema the same coach that coached Travis Frederick.

Beliema said Ragnow is the best he ever coached, better than Frederick who is currently the best Center
in the NFL. I would take what this expert says over Draft analyst's opinions on Center play.

[kevin]

Here is the thing. This is the draft year of the over rated quarterbacks. There are no Peyton Mannings or Andrew Lucks but there could be as many as 6 quarterbacks taken in Round One. Don't be surprised If Pittsburg and New England go quarterback with Big Ben and Brady getting pretty old. There will also be WR's drafted and RB's. A lot of Defense. A TE. Guards and Tackles on O Line before our second pick in the draft. There is a chance a team does take a center. A slim chance 2 teams take a center. Almost no chance all these 3 centers are gone before our pick in 2. I mean, there are only so many picks before our pick in 2 and few teams are looking for top pick center as we are.

Most mock drafts have these centers still on the board in 2. CBS, Fox, AP, ESPN. If you look at all the QBs, WR's, RB's, DE's, DT's, ILB, OLB, CB, SS, FS, LT, RT, G, TE that will go in One and start of Two, it's hard to imagine 3 top centers gone that early in 2 It's not like we are drafting at the end of 2.

I can see them going center in One, but I've heard Bengals say it may or may not be round One. Bengals have looked at Daniels, Ragnow, Price a few times each and I don't know if one stands out to them. I think any of them will be an upgrade and I'll add Michigan State Center Brian Allen is good also and we could add Shelton of Washington and Bozeman of Alabama.

I can see taking center first as long as Bengals have decided he is the best and don't want to lose him. Now if these 6 centers mentioned don't stand out above each other to Bengals, why not round 2. To those saying we don't need a guard, yes we do. This O Line STINKS. Hernandez or Wynn would quickly be best guard on the team. Ahead of Bolling and way ahead of these others Bengal Fans talk about. We actually may be more solid at RT than RG. I don't think fans understand how powerful we get if we add earth movers like a Hernandez or Wynn at RG and in 2 add an earth mover center such as Ragnow, Price or Daniels to go with Glenn and Boling. The worst O line in NFL gets pretty good. I'll repeat that. The worst O Line in NFL would get pretty good. So if we take center first because they really want a certain one, THAT I CAN SEE, but don't say we don't need a guard. This awful O Line needs Center and the best blocker they can get be it a guard or tackle. We have players that can put on a uniform such as Westerman, but to say we can't get players better is out there. This is the worst O Line in NFL people, and it needs a major upgrade.

The word is Daniels on a lot of mock drafts by media. If Bengals have made up their mind on him, that is fine, we need a center. Some mock drafts do have Bengals taking Hernandez and team sure has looked at him enough. Bengals have looked at Ragnow and Price a lot. I'm hoping 2 Blockers early with one a Center. Don't say we can't use 2 top pick blockers on this sorry excuse for an O Line, because we do. Yes. I'll insult this awful line, but if we get top blockers I'll be ready for play-offs because we will have earth moving blockers.

[Au165]

I'd like to point out they have done due diligence on the next tier of Center as well. They have brought in Corbbett (Nevada) and Morris (TCU), so it seems they do have a back up plan if Center early doesn't fall into place.

[*psychdoctor*]

(04-24-2018, 02:29 PM)kevin Wrote: Here is the thing. This is the draft year of the over rated quarterbacks.  There are no Peyton Mannings or Andrew Lucks but there could be as many as 6 quarterbacks taken in Round One.  Don't be surprised If Pittsburg and New England go quarterback with Big Ben and Brady getting pretty old.  There will also be WR's drafted and RB's. A lot of Defense. A TE. Guards and Tackles on O Line before our second pick in the draft.  There is a chance a team does take a center. A slim chance 2 teams take a center.  Almost no chance all these 3 centers are gone before our pick in 2.   I mean, there are only so many picks before our pick in 2 and few teams are looking for top pick center as we are.

Most mock drafts have these centers still on the board in 2.  CBS, Fox, AP, ESPN.   If you look at all the QBs, WR's, RB's, DE's, DT's, ILB, OLB, CB, SS, FS, LT, RT, G, TE that will go in One and start of Two, it's hard to imagine 3 top centers gone that early in 2  It's not like we are drafting at the end of 2.

I can see them going center in One, but I've heard Bengals say it may or may not be round One.  Bengals have looked at Daniels, Ragnow, Price a few times each and I don't know if one stands out to them.  I think any of them will be an upgrade and I'll add Michigan State Center Brian Allen is good also and we could add Shelton of Washington and Bozeman of Alabama.

I can see taking center first as long as Bengals have decided he is the best and don't want to lose him.  Now if these 6 centers mentioned don't stand out above each other to Bengals, why not round 2.   To those saying we don't need a guard, yes we do.  This O Line STINKS.  Hernandez or Wynn would quickly be best guard on the team.  Ahead of Bolling and way ahead of these others Bengal Fans talk about.  We actually may be more solid at RT than RG.   I don't think fans understand how powerful we get if we add earth movers like a Hernandez or Wynn at RG and in 2 add an earth mover center such as Ragnow, Price or Daniels to go with Glenn and Boling.  The worst O line in NFL gets pretty good.  I'll repeat that. The worst O Line in NFL would get pretty good.  So if we take center first because they really want a certain one, THAT I CAN SEE, but don't say we don't need a guard. This awful O Line needs Center and the best blocker they can get be it a guard or tackle.  We have players that can put on a uniform such as Westerman, but to say we can't get players better is out there.  This is the worst O Line in NFL people, and it needs a major upgrade.

It is hard to assess the guard play on the Cincinnati Bengals because Bodine was horrible and the O-Line works as a single unit in terms of chemistry.

But I think Westerman-Hopkins-Redmond have displayed NFL starting guard skills.  I do not see a starting RT on the team ATM.  Maybe Fisher but i have no faith in either OG or Fisher.  None.  

Braden Smith Guard from Auburn is very good as is Corbett and Tony Adams.  Quality guards can be there later in the draft but not a deep selection of OT this year.  If McGlinchey is there at 21, the Bengals have to take him.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-24-2018, 02:29 PM)kevin Wrote: Here is the thing. This is the draft year of the over rated quarterbacks.  There are no Peyton Mannings or Andrew Lucks but there could be as many as 6 quarterbacks taken in Round One.  Don't be surprised If Pittsburg and New England go quarterback with Big Ben and Brady getting pretty old.  There will also be WR's drafted and RB's. A lot of Defense. A TE. Guards and Tackles on O Line before our second pick in the draft.  There is a chance a team does take a center. A slim chance 2 teams take a center.  Almost no chance all these 3 centers are gone before our pick in 2.   I mean, there are only so many picks before our pick in 2 and few teams are looking for top pick center as we are.

Most mock drafts have these centers still on the board in 2.  CBS, Fox, AP, ESPN.   If you look at all the QBs, WR's, RB's, DE's, DT's, ILB, OLB, CB, SS, FS, LT, RT, G, TE that will go in One and start of Two, it's hard to imagine 3 top centers gone that early in 2  It's not like we are drafting at the end of 2.

I can see them going center in One, but I've heard Bengals say it may or may not be round One.  Bengals have looked at Daniels, Ragnow, Price a few times each and I don't know if one stands out to them.  I think any of them will be an upgrade and I'll add Michigan State Center Brian Allen is good also and we could add Shelton of Washington and Bozeman of Alabama.

I can see taking center first as long as Bengals have decided he is the best and don't want to lose him.  Now if these 6 centers mentioned don't stand out above each other to Bengals, why not round 2.   To those saying we don't need a guard, yes we do.  This O Line STINKS.  Hernandez or Wynn would quickly be best guard on the team.  Ahead of Bolling and way ahead of these others Bengal Fans talk about.  We actually may be more solid at RT than RG.   I don't think fans understand how powerful we get if we add earth movers like a Hernandez or Wynn at RG and in 2 add an earth mover center such as Ragnow, Price or Daniels to go with Glenn and Boling.  The worst O line in NFL gets pretty good.  I'll repeat that. The worst O Line in NFL would get pretty good.  So if we take center first because they really want a certain one, THAT I CAN SEE, but don't say we don't need a guard. This awful O Line needs Center and the best blocker they can get be it a guard or tackle.  We have players that can put on a uniform such as Westerman, but to say we can't get players better is out there.  This is the worst O Line in NFL people, and it needs a major upgrade.

According to La Canfora the Patriots, Panthers, Falcons, Bears and us all are looking for a top Center early.

There are 45 picks before our 2nd rounder. I could easily see all 3 top Centers Drafted before 46 in this Draft.

(04-24-2018, 02:35 PM)Au165 Wrote: I'd like to point out they have done due diligence on the next tier of Center as well. They have brought in Corbbett (Nevada) and Morris (TCU), so it seems they do have a back up plan if Center early doesn't fall into place.

Atleast they have a backup plan which is nice.

Need to know more about Corbett and Morris though so i can be prepared.

Know about all i can about Ragnow, Price and Daniels by now.

[yellowxdiscipline]

I can almost see only one of those three centers possibly being there at 46. To me its a no brainer to pull the trigger on a center at 21. There comes a point when you have to stop with this cycle of drafting guys on Day 3 hoping they'll pan out and just pony up for a day one starter. The talent pool wasnt there last year but its here this year with Daniels, Price or Ragnow. Passing up on one of them in the first and banking one will be there at 46 is a risky move that I wouldnt make. Make the pick, take your center at 21, and move on.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-24-2018, 02:47 PM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: I can almost see only one of those three centers possibly being there at 46. To me its a no brainer to pull the trigger on a center at 21. There comes a point when you have to stop with this cycle of drafting guys on Day 3 hoping they'll pan out and just pony up for a day one starter. The talent pool wasnt there last year but its here this year with Daniels, Price or Ragnow. Passing up on one of them in the first and banking one will be there at 46 is a risky move that I wouldnt make. Make the pick, take your center at 21, and move on.

Thats right, i don't care who it is. Let Frank pick his guy at our biggest area of weakness at 21.

It all starts in the trenches and we are in the perfect position to take the one our O-line coach likes
the best right ahead of the Patriots, Panthers and Falcons that are all interested in Ragnow.

[kevin]

If they really think there is going to be a run on centers, then take center round one. None of the Mock drafts by anybody show such a thing, but if they think there is going to be a run on centers, take the center round one. There will be good blockers on board in 2 at guard or tackle. We need blocking across board except Glenn and Bolling. All these other names are just warm bodies to put on a uniform but not top NFL starting talent. Just warm bodies team has added that other teams didn't want. I don't think we can be content with just filling uniforms if the goal is to get play-off wins. Lets get some real blockers in here. Imagine what Mixon, Dalton, Green could do if we just had quality blocking as opposed to worst O Line in NFL.

Most mock drafts, CBS, FOX, ESPN, AP show most of these centers still on board when we pick in 2, and why I thought Mock Drafts showing us taking Hernandez or Wynn looked pretty good and still grabbing Daniels or Price or Ragnow. It would be awesome to pull it off. This O Line talents up real fast.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-24-2018, 02:59 PM)kevin Wrote: If they really think there is going to be a run on centers, then take center round one.  None of the Mock drafts by anybody show such a thing, but if they think there is going to be a run on centers, take the center round one.  There will be good blockers on board in 2 at guard or tackle. We need blocking across board except Glenn and Bolling.  All these other names are just warm bodies to put on a uniform but not top NFL starting talent. Just warm bodies team has added that other teams didn't want.  I don't think we can be content with just filling uniforms if the goal is to get play-off wins.  Lets get some real blockers in here. Imagine what Mixon, Dalton, Green could do if we just had quality blocking as opposed to worst O Line in NFL.

Most mock drafts, CBS, FOX, ESPN, AP show most of these centers still on board when we pick in 2, and why I thought Mock Drafts showing us taking Hernandez or Wynn looked pretty good and still grabbing Daniels or Price or Ragnow.  It would be awesome to pull it off. This O Line talents up real fast.

Ben Zoo has literally shown atleast 3 mocks with us picking Ragnow at 21 today in the main Ragnow thread.

Ragnow is flying up the boards, have to watch these trends right before Draft, those Mocks are old.

[yellowxdiscipline]

(04-24-2018, 03:04 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Ben Zoo has literally shown atleast 3 mocks with us picking Ragnow at 21 today in the main Ragnow thread.

Ragnow is flying up the boards, have to watch these trends right before Draft, those Mocks are old.

Hard to argue against it, he was the best Center going into last year, injuries cost him a little, but if healthy he may be the best out of the lot.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-24-2018, 03:36 PM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: Hard to argue against it, he was the best Center going into last year, injuries cost him a little, but if healthy he may be the best out of the lot.

I have definately came to the conclusion he is the best of the lot the more i research them.

But i am okay with whoever Pollack wants for Lazor's new scheme. But people acting like Ragnow is still a 2nd to 3rd
round grade are living back in the day when he was still injured and before he had that awesome Pro Day. He is ready
to go right now, this has to be in the decision making. Love Price but it will take a bit before he can gel with the guys.