What to watch for at the Bengals training camp | PFF

[Bengalholic]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvnDTPRaWno

[SunsetBengal]

Sounds like those guys see the same concerns as us fans do. Personally, I'm a little less concerned about WR than those guys are, as I expect Boyd and Ross to take huge steps forward this season. However, the concerns on the Right Side of the OL and at LB are genuine. On paper, we have a bunch of garbage guys competing for two starting spots on the OL, and when you look at LB? We have VB and Preston Brown, and a host of distant also rans.

[masonbengals fan]

O-line is the key. If we don’t see significant improvement its over before it begins.

[CornerBlitz]

Excellent analysis. These guys are very accurate in their assessment of this squad.

[McC]

Jordan Evans will step up big this year. And Josh Malone will br a factor too.

[*SHRacerX*]

"Andy Dalton was #4 in our accuracy rankings".

[HarleyDog]

(07-25-2018, 08:57 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote:  On paper, we have a bunch of garbage guys competing for two starting spots on the OL

On paper, yes. However the key to all this will be the coaching. Remember the old saying, "one mans trash is another mans treasure?" With a philosophy and coaching style, theirs a possibility this could apply. Only time will tell.

[XenoMorph]

(07-25-2018, 08:57 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Sounds like those guys see the same concerns as us fans do.  Personally, I'm a little less concerned about WR than those guys are, as I expect Boyd and Ross to take huge steps forward this season.  However, the concerns on the Right Side of the OL and at LB are genuine.  On paper, we have a bunch of garbage guys competing for two starting spots on the OL, and when you look at LB?  We have VB and Preston Brown, and a host of distant also rans.

everyone is an unknown till they get a chance to play...  Redmon and westermen looked good to end the year.  If a few years one might be a household name.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(07-26-2018, 09:36 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: "Andy Dalton was #4 in our accuracy rankings".

See? THESE are the types of numbers and facts that PFF is good for, that they scaled back heavily in favour of a predominantly ratings-based website.

Ugh.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

Another nice thread Holic, good job brother. I usually disagree with a lot of PFF's rankings and such but i really
cannot argue with anything these guys said. The right side of the Line is still a question no doubt but bringing in
a new O-line Coach is bigger then anything here. There was a player on that Cowboys Line that used to be bad
and Pollack coached him up, forget his name at the moment but he has done it before.

I think RG will be muchly improved this season with either Westerman or Redmond. Hopkins isn't going to start
or atleast i highly doubt it. These two looked much better then Hopkins last year and Westerman has always
looked good everytime i have seen him.

At RT, one of Fisher, Hart, Redmond, Perkins, Taylor should be serviceable once they get enough snaps and if
none of them are we can move either Boling or Glenn to RT if we really have to.

The SAM position is really the position that i am always uncomfortable with at Linebacker. Vigil did not play well
here at all last year, even if he had a bad knee, it was bad. Evans is also more of a WILL backer, so is Vinny.

One of Worley or Jefferson i hope steps up or Evans gains some muscle and watches more vids of the way our
guy Burfict tackles. He launches from the hips and explodes into the tackle, watch and emulate.

[*Go Cards*]

Video is spot on with my concerns

Although agree with Sunset that there is a really good chance that WR's emerge and Bengals will be fine there.

Still will be a fun competition to watch. Hoping Ross and Malone both step up big.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(07-26-2018, 12:39 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Video is spot on with my concerns

Although agree with Sunset that there is a really good chance that WR's emerge and Bengals will be fine there.

Still will be a fun competition to watch. Hoping Ross and Malone both step up big.

Agree with you and Sunset as well, don't think WR will be a weakness, more of a strength barring injuries this year.

Ross and Malone needed a year, expecting big things from both. Boyd should be solid in the Slot as well for us.

[SunsetBengal]

(07-26-2018, 09:59 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: everyone is an unknown till they get a chance to play...  Redmon and westermen looked good to end the year.  If a few years one might be a household name.

Yes, I get that, and you're right.  Everyone deserves a chance to show what they can do.  I'm genuinely hoping that one, or a couple of those guys step up and take command of their respective spot.  However, until I see evidence of them moving men like Geno Atkins or Carlos Dunlap off the ball, the positions will be up for grabs in my mind.

[*SHRacerX*]

(07-26-2018, 12:33 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Another nice thread Holic, good job brother. I usually disagree with a lot of PFF's rankings and such but i really
cannot argue with anything these guys said. The right side of the Line is still a question no doubt but bringing in
a new O-line Coach is bigger then anything here. There was a player on that Cowboys Line that used to be bad
and Pollack coached him up, forget his name at the moment but he has done it before.

I think RG will be muchly improved this season with either Westerman or Redmond. Hopkins isn't going to start
or atleast i highly doubt it. These two looked much better then Hopkins last year and Westerman has always
looked good everytime i have seen him.

At RT, one of Fisher, Hart, Redmond, Perkins, Taylor should be serviceable once they get enough snaps and if
none of them are we can move either Boling or Glenn to RT if we really have to.

The SAM position is really the position that i am always uncomfortable with at Linebacker. Vigil did not play well
here at all last year, even if he had a bad knee, it was bad. Evans is also more of a WILL backer, so is Vinny.

One of Worley or Jefferson i hope steps up or Evans gains some muscle and watches more vids of the way our
guy Burfict tackles. He launches from the hips and explodes into the tackle, watch and emulate.

Doug Free?  

I think RT has to be our biggest question mark, no doubt.  I am extremely pleased, however, at the drafting of Billy Price.  I feel like the center position was such a weakness that it also impacted the play of the guards to both sides as well as potentially limiting the playbook (even on rushing downs).  Bodine would get shoved backwards so often that pulling guards would not have much of a chance to reach their destination.  I saw it implode a few times and then it seemed as though we didn't go back to it for some time.  I have confidence that if Fisher beats out guys like Redmond for the RT job, it won't be because of his draft position.  They are all under similar timelines for needing their next contract.

One thing I would like to see return for short yardage and the goal line is the "unbalanced line" with the extra lineman lined up as a TE.  I know that it was really designed as a compensation for not having the greatest line to begin with and it was more of a numbers game, but I think having Fisher, Ced, Redmond, or Hart (whoever does not win the RT job) lined up as an extra blocker would make it very difficult on opposing defenses. 

The key to making the formation work (and I would LOVE to roll this shit out against pitt) is to have a couple PASS plays designed out of this formation.  Like where we are lined up on 3rd and 1, have the extra blocker come in, pitt sells out to stop the run, and a guy like John Ross runs a deep route and the Bengals take a shot with him.  It is like when Navy does a fake run option and goes play-action out of their triple option formation.  

They would have to set it up with a couple successful runs out of the formation before taking a deep shot, so they would sell out to stop the run.  

I would love to see that, and I even think a player like Auden Tate could slip out of the formation as a red zone target when lined up for a short yardage gain to move the chains.  

[XenoMorph]

(07-26-2018, 05:57 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yes, I get that, and you're right.  Everyone deserves a chance to show what they can do.  I'm genuinely hoping that one, or a couple of those guys step up and take command of their respective spot.  However, until I see evidence of them moving men like Geno Atkins or Carlos Dunlap off the ball, the positions will be up for grabs in my mind.

Pads don't come on till sunday... Then we will start to get a real idea on the OL

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(07-27-2018, 07:11 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Doug Free?  

I think RT has to be our biggest question mark, no doubt.  I am extremely pleased, however, at the drafting of Billy Price.  I feel like the center position was such a weakness that it also impacted the play of the guards to both sides as well as potentially limiting the playbook (even on rushing downs).  Bodine would get shoved backwards so often that pulling guards would not have much of a chance to reach their destination.  I saw it implode a few times and then it seemed as though we didn't go back to it for some time.  I have confidence that if Fisher beats out guys like Redmond for the RT job, it won't be because of his draft position.  They are all under similar timelines for needing their next contract.

One thing I would like to see return for short yardage and the goal line is the "unbalanced line" with the extra lineman lined up as a TE.  I know that it was really designed as a compensation for not having the greatest line to begin with and it was more of a numbers game, but I think having Fisher, Ced, Redmond, or Hart (whoever does not win the RT job) lined up as an extra blocker would make it very difficult on opposing defenses. 

The key to making the formation work (and I would LOVE to roll this shit out against pitt) is to have a couple PASS plays designed out of this formation.  Like where we are lined up on 3rd and 1, have the extra blocker come in, pitt sells out to stop the run, and a guy like John Ross runs a deep route and the Bengals take a shot with him.  It is like when Navy does a fake run option and goes play-action out of their triple option formation.  

They would have to set it up with a couple successful runs out of the formation before taking a deep shot, so they would sell out to stop the run.  

I would love to see that, and I even think a player like Auden Tate could slip out of the formation as a red zone target when lined up for a short yardage gain to move the chains.  

Yeah, Doug Free thanks SHRacer.   He was not good at all until Pollack got ahold of him. So it is not like all
the guys Pollack worked with were just polished studs coming out of college. We all know how some Lineman
that look really great in college end up being busts. Pollack kept this from happening and even coached up a bad
Lineman in Free. I think he can do the same with talented players like Westerman, Redmond and Fisher.

I wouldn't mind seeing the unbalanced line formation again at times. Not a lot like you said but just to come in
and punish Defenses physically and then like you said have a Play Action pass that comes with it to really throw
Defenses off. Lots of ways to go.

[*ochocincos*]

(07-25-2018, 08:57 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Sounds like those guys see the same concerns as us fans do.  Personally, I'm a little less concerned about WR than those guys are, as I expect Boyd and Ross to take huge steps forward this season.  However, the concerns on the Right Side of the OL and at LB are genuine.  On paper, we have a bunch of garbage guys competing for two starting spots on the OL, and when you look at LB?  We have VB and Preston Brown, and a host of distant also rans.

I don't think Westerman is garbage, but that might be because I put too much stock into his college tape and projection. He was projected to be a Rd 2-3 pick and ended up falling to the 5th. I thought he was a great prospect that was "country strong", athletic, and a technician. My reasoning for why I still hold out a lot of hope for Westerman is probably also the same with Billings. Guys I thought were drafted later than they deserved but should be solid starters at minimum. I guess we'll see.

[*ochocincos*]

(07-26-2018, 12:33 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Another nice thread Holic, good job brother. I usually disagree with a lot of PFF's rankings and such but i really
cannot argue with anything these guys said. The right side of the Line is still a question no doubt but bringing in
a new O-line Coach is bigger then anything here. There was a player on that Cowboys Line that used to be bad
and Pollack coached him up, forget his name at the moment but he has done it before.

I think RG will be muchly improved this season with either Westerman or Redmond. Hopkins isn't going to start
or atleast i highly doubt it. These two looked much better then Hopkins last year and Westerman has always
looked good everytime i have seen him.

At RT, one of Fisher, Hart, Redmond, Perkins, Taylor should be serviceable once they get enough snaps and if
none of them are we can move either Boling or Glenn to RT if we really have to.

The SAM position is really the position that i am always uncomfortable with at Linebacker. Vigil did not play well
here at all last year, even if he had a bad knee, it was bad. Evans is also more of a WILL backer, so is Vinny.

One of Worley or Jefferson i hope steps up or Evans gains some muscle and watches more vids of the way our
guy Burfict tackles. He launches from the hips and explodes into the tackle, watch and emulate.

I always thought Hopkins would make a great backup utility OL. I don't think he's stellar anywhere, but I think his versatility is very useful for if any of the starters go down. He's like the epitome of that OL to claim the last spot on the roster every year.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(07-27-2018, 02:22 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I don't think Westerman is garbage, but that might be because I put too much stock into his college tape and projection. He was projected to be a Rd 2-3 pick and ended up falling to the 5th. I thought he was a great prospect that was "country strong", athletic, and a technician. My reasoning for why I still hold out a lot of hope for Westerman is probably also the same with Billings. Guys I thought were drafted later than they deserved but should be solid starters at minimum. I guess we'll see.

I agree, Westerman has always looked good. His game actually reminds me a lot of Zeitler in that he is a superb
pass blocker but not the best run blocker. But he has even looked better in this aspect last year. Don't get why PA
never gave him a shot, he always looked better then Hopkins to me.

He has some kind of illness right now though, could be why Hopkins was with the starters yesterday.

But still so early cannot take anything from it.

(07-27-2018, 02:25 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I always thought Hopkins would make a great backup utility OL. I don't think he's stellar anywhere, but I think his versatility is very useful for if any of the starters go down. He's like the epitome of that OL to claim the last spot on the roster every year.

Yes, Hopkins is a good versatile backup in case one of the starters goes down.

[XenoMorph]

(07-27-2018, 03:13 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I agree, Westerman has always looked good. His game actually reminds me a lot of Zeitler in that he is a superb
pass blocker but not the best run blocker. But he has even looked better in this aspect last year. Don't get why PA
never gave him a shot, he always looked better then Hopkins to me.

He has some kind of illness right now though, could be why Hopkins was with the starters yesterday.

But still so early cannot take anything from it.


Yes, Hopkins is a good versatile backup in case one of the starters goes down.

yeah until they are full contact in pads....   We aren't gonna no much about the OL other than their footwork