SI Article

[THE PISTONS]

(02-18-2019, 04:20 PM)GodFather Wrote: "He still hasn’t watched free agents, but he’ll make time for that soon in a schedule that starts every day at Paul Brown Stadium at 6 a.m., with a film session with Callahan, then meetings with owner Mike Brown and personnel chief Duke Tobin."

For those who think Brown isn't involved...

Great catch. I totally missed that.

[fredtoast]

(02-18-2019, 03:17 PM)Bengalholic Wrote:  I'm honestly not sure what fans are wanting. Are they wanting expediency just for the sake of getting the process over with? Are they wanting Taylor to pick someone he doesn't really want to work with? Are they wanting him to hogtie a guy and force him to take the job?   

The fans just want to be shown that the new coach is competent enough to do something that every other coach/team in the league has been able to do.

When every other team in the league is able to hire a DC faster than us does that mean they all settled for someone they did not want?  I don't think so.  I think they were just better at identifying viable targets and convincing them that the job is desirable. 

[McC]

Look at it this way. At this time of the year, when not much else is really happening, this at least gives all the internet self appointed experts a lot to guess about, opine on, spend conjecture on, complain about.

It's exercise in the winter--jumping to conclusions burns a lot of calories. So look at it as a blessing. And, it's a freaking hoot to witness.

[THE PISTONS]

(02-18-2019, 05:11 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The fans just want to be shown that the new coach is competent enough to do something that every other coach/team in the league has been able to do.

When every other team in the league is able to hire a DC faster than us does that mean they all settled for someone they did not want?  I don't think so.  I think they were just better at identifying viable targets and convincing them that the job is desirable. 

Precisely Fred.

The Bengals are going after guys that make more money now or are in more desireable jobs. Low odds those guys will come here.

[Sled21]

(02-18-2019, 04:20 PM)GodFather Wrote: "He still hasn’t watched free agents, but he’ll make time for that soon in a schedule that starts every day at Paul Brown Stadium at 6 a.m., with a film session with Callahan, then meetings with owner Mike Brown and personnel chief Duke Tobin."

For those who think Brown isn't involved...

That doesn't really mean anything. The meetings could be just for Taylor to let MB know how things are going. MB is still the owner afterall….. he's not going to just not be there.

[Bengalholic]

(02-18-2019, 05:11 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The fans just want to be shown that the new coach is competent enough to do something that every other coach/team in the league has been able to do.

When every other team in the league is able to hire a DC faster than us does that mean they all settled for someone they did not want?  I don't think so.  I think they were just better at identifying viable targets and convincing them that the job is desirable. 

That's the point. Those teams landed a guy that the head coach really wanted and who really wanted to be there. Taylor has yet to find that match, for whatever reason. He was able to assemble his guys on the offensive side pretty quickly once he took over, even though it was reported they had interest in other guys prior (Kubiak, Bevell, Bill Callahan, etc). That process went much smoother for sure, but it don't think it means he's shown a lack of competency when it comes to the DC search. 

[Shake n Blake]

(02-18-2019, 03:17 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: But, that's the thing...there are reasons behind each of those. We turned down Joesph for HC, so can't blame him for not wanting the runner up prize with the same team. Allen was always a serious longshot. There was a conversation with both Del Rio and Capers, but the mutual interest just wasn't there. Grantham chose to go back to UF for a much sweeter deal. Glenn was blocked. Hafley has just signed with OSU a month prior and wanted to honor that. 

We really don't know what did or didn't happen with the likes of Nolan, Pleasant and Manuel because there's been next to no information. However, when you look at the other cases individually (IMO) it doesn't look nearly as bad as when you look at it as a whole. They've looked at different guys, talked to some guys, but to this point...haven't been able to find a match that worked for both sides.

Whoever they end up with...I want it to be a guy that Taylor absolutely wants by his side, and also a guy that absolutely wants the job. I'm honestly not sure what fans are wanting. Are they wanting expediency just for the sake of getting the process over with? Are they wanting Taylor to pick someone he doesn't really want to work with? Are they wanting him to hogtie a guy and force him to take the job? 

The fact is, whatever people's opinion may be of the process, there will eventually be a new DC named...and then we can hopefully start talking about how good or bad he is within seconds of him being hired. 

I don't think I'm being over the top in suggesting that the DC search has been a bit of a mess. I've repeatedly said that this situation can be resolved, and that I'm not saying the Taylor era is a flop. That would be ridiculous. I just feel this DC search looks poorly planned, partly because we didn't talk to Taylor between his 1st interview and the Super Bowl. Because of that, now we appear to be throwing a bunch of coaches against the wall and seeing which one sticks.

I'm not saying we should hire someone just to hire someone. What I'm saying is that we likely wouldn't be having this discussion if the Bengals/Taylor had a clear (and good) plan going into this. Sure, there were reasons why all these coaches didn't work out, but maybe we should've had an idea of who was likely or not going in? 

We had to know Dennis Allen was a long shot. We didn't know anything on Del Rio or Capers before February 4th? Or any of these other guys? Again, I'm not calling for anyone to be hanged. I just think we paid for being "nice guys" and not talking to Taylor until he was hired. Especially with him being young, and perhaps a bit lacking as far as league connections go.

We can still get a good coach...I firmly believe that, but I'm just not buying the narrative that the only reason we're here is because the Bengals/Taylor are being thorough in a search for "his guy".

[Bengalholic]

(02-18-2019, 06:31 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I don't think I'm being over the top in suggesting that the DC search has been a bit of a mess. I've repeatedly said that this situation can be resolved, and that I'm not saying the Taylor era is a flop. That would be ridiculous. I just feel this DC search looks poorly planned, partly because we didn't talk to Taylor between his 1st interview and the Super Bowl. Because of that, now we appear to be throwing a bunch of coaches against the wall and seeing which one sticks.

I'm not saying we should hire someone just to hire someone. What I'm saying is that we likely wouldn't be having this discussion if the Bengals/Taylor had a clear (and good) plan going into this. Sure, there were reasons why all these coaches didn't work out, but maybe we should've had an idea of who was likely or not going in? 

We had to know Dennis Allen was a long shot. We didn't know anything on Del Rio or Capers before February 4th? Or any of these other guys? Again, I'm not calling for anyone to be hanged. I just think we paid for being "nice guys" and not talking to Taylor until he was hired. Especially with him being young, and perhaps a bit lacking as far as league connections go.

We can still get a good coach...I firmly believe that, but I'm just not buying the narrative that the only reason we're here is because the Bengals/Taylor are being thorough in a search for "his guy".

To the bold, I definitely think that has played a part. I think they should have been communicating all during the process. 

[Shake n Blake]

(02-18-2019, 06:36 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: To the bold, I definitely think that has played a part. I think they should have been communicating all during the process. 

Especially given his age and relative lack of connections. You combine that with the dearth of candidates left after the Super Bowl, and that's a recipe for, well...what we've seen. I honestly think Taylor had to settle for a lot of these guys. I think he wanted Kubiak over Brian Callahan. I think he wanted Bill Callahan over Jim Turner, and I think he's going to get his 4th-5th option as DC. I like Taylor, so it's a shame. It can still work out though. We know nothing about how this group will work together.

[jj22]

(02-18-2019, 04:20 PM)GodFather Wrote: "He still hasn’t watched free agents, but he’ll make time for that soon in a schedule that starts every day at Paul Brown Stadium at 6 a.m., with a film session with Callahan, then meetings with owner Mike Brown and personnel chief Duke Tobin."

For those who think Brown isn't involved...

Hopefully he doesn't force ZT to rewatch the game with him on Mondays. As if ZT needs his assistance. Marvin was too nice, but he should have ended that and saved the next coach the foolishness.

[Bengalholic]

(02-18-2019, 06:38 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Especially given his age and relative lack of connections. You combine that with the dearth of candidates left after the Super Bowl, and that's a recipe for, well...what we've seen.

Well, we're not completely alone. The last I saw, the Pat's are still trying to fill their DL, LB, CB and WR coach positions. I think them and the Bengals are the last 2 staffs with multiple openings at this point. Of course, Billy B has been though late openings/additions with his staff many times, so it's second nature. We'll have to wait and see how it turns out for Taylor. Hopefully any future openings get filled much smoother. 

[Shake n Blake]

(02-18-2019, 06:51 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Well, we're not completely alone. The Pat's are still trying to fill their DL, LB, CB and WR coach positions. I think them and the Bengals are the last 2 staffs with multiple openings at this point. Of course, Billy B has been though late openings/additions with his staff many times, so it's second nature. We'll have to wait and see how it turns out for Taylor. Hopefully any future openings get filled much smoother. 

The funny thing is, none of this will matter if we manage to still find a good coach/fit. So since we whiffed on our top 3-4 choices, it makes sense to take time with it now. I doubt the guys they're looking at now were even on the radar 2 weeks ago.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(02-18-2019, 03:17 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: But, that's the thing...there are reasons behind each of those. We turned down Joesph for HC, so can't blame him for not wanting the runner up prize with the same team. Allen was always a serious longshot. There was a conversation with both Del Rio and Capers, but the mutual interest just wasn't there. Grantham chose to go back to UF for a much sweeter deal. Glenn was blocked. Hafley has just signed with OSU a month prior and wanted to honor that. 

We really don't know what did or didn't happen with the likes of Nolan, Pleasant and Manuel because there's been next to no information. However, when you look at the other cases individually (IMO) it doesn't look nearly as bad as when you look at it as a whole. They've looked at different guys, talked to some guys, but to this point...haven't been able to find a match that worked for both sides.

Whoever they end up with...I want it to be a guy that Taylor absolutely wants by his side, and also a guy that absolutely wants the job. I'm honestly not sure what fans are wanting. Are they wanting expediency just for the sake of getting the process over with? Are they wanting Taylor to pick someone he doesn't really want to work with? Are they wanting him to hogtie a guy and force him to take the job? 

The fact is, whatever people's opinion may be of the process, there will eventually be a new DC named...and then we can hopefully start talking about how good or bad he is within seconds of him being hired. 

What Holic said. Don't understand some fans on here panicking.

I like that our new HC is not panicking, that would be the mistake.

[sandwedge]

(02-18-2019, 06:36 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: To the bold, I definitely think that has played a part. I think they should have been communicating all during the process

Were we allowed to talk to Taylor? I thought we could only communicate with him to set up and interview him? Also I remember reading MB saying he wanted to respect Taylor and not interfere with the Rams during the playoffs and SB..

[THE PISTONS]

(02-18-2019, 06:58 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: The funny thing is, none of this will matter if we manage to still find a good coach/fit. So since we whiffed on our top 3-4 choices, it makes sense to take time with it now. I doubt the guys they're looking at now were even on the radar 2 weeks ago.

Maybe this is a George Costanza scenario where every instinct the Bengals have is wrong. The 1st 3-4 guys that they wanted were terrible. Candidate 10 who they don't want...will be some great architect!

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(02-18-2019, 06:36 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: To the bold, I definitely think that has played a part. I think they should have been communicating all during the process. 

That's part of it, the other part is this unit was an absolute SHIT SHOW last season.  So far, it's the same unit.  I think our fans are underestimating the impact that has on landing a guy out of a comfortable situation.  The ramifications of coaching a defense that broke records in futility can be lasting in regards to hopes of being a HC, or even a DC in this league again.  Of course, the gamble would be if you turned it around, you look like a genius.  Let's be honest though, that's a long shot.

Make no mistake, this is not an attractive job when you get right down to it.

I'll be honest, if it were me, I'd go to Del Rio's house with my hat in my hand and blank check, and try to iron this out.  

[grampahol]

Ehhh.. just get out the good old fashioned Cincinnati phone book. Rip all the pages out, tape em to the wall and start throwing darts and making phone calls (That have been long since extinct) to find the next genius DC in Cincinnati.. 

[Hoofhearted]

(02-18-2019, 06:31 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I don't think I'm being over the top in suggesting that the DC search has been a bit of a mess. I've repeatedly said that this situation can be resolved, and that I'm not saying the Taylor era is a flop. That would be ridiculous. I just feel this DC search looks poorly planned, partly because we didn't talk to Taylor between his 1st interview and the Super Bowl. Because of that, now we appear to be throwing a bunch of coaches against the wall and seeing which one sticks.

I'm not saying we should hire someone just to hire someone. What I'm saying is that we likely wouldn't be having this discussion if the Bengals/Taylor had a clear (and good) plan going into this. Sure, there were reasons why all these coaches didn't work out, but maybe we should've had an idea of who was likely or not going in? 

We had to know Dennis Allen was a long shot. We didn't know anything on Del Rio or Capers before February 4th? Or any of these other guys? Again, I'm not calling for anyone to be hanged. I just think we paid for being "nice guys" and not talking to Taylor until he was hired. Especially with him being young, and perhaps a bit lacking as far as league connections go.

We can still get a good coach...I firmly believe that, but I'm just not buying the narrative that the only reason we're here is because the Bengals/Taylor are being thorough in a search for "his guy".

The built-in skepticism the Bengals have earned is combining with the uncertainty of a new coach who’s never done this before to creates the exact feeling many of us are experiencing. 

[Hoofhearted]

(02-19-2019, 10:44 AM)Wyche Wrote: That's part of it, the other part is this unit was an absolute SHIT SHOW last season.  So far, it's the same unit.  I think our fans are underestimating the impact that has on landing a guy out of a comfortable situation.  The ramifications of coaching a defense that broke records in futility can be lasting in regards to hopes of being a HC, or even a DC in this league again.  Of course, the gamble would be if you turned it around, you look like a genius.  Let's be honest though, that's a long shot.

Make no mistake, this is not an attractive job when you get right down to it.

I'll be honest, if it were me, I'd go to Del Rio's house with my hat in my hand and blank check, and try to iron this out.  

This was probably my biggest fear as well. 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(02-19-2019, 11:23 AM)Hoofhearted Wrote: The built-in skepticism the Bengals have earned is combining with the uncertainty of a new coach who’s never done this before to creates the exact feeling many of us are experiencing. 

Very good point.  I feel a bit anxious about the whole mess myself.  That said, I'm not going to spread misinformation about the ordeal, or link to articles touting half truths as facts to make it seem worse than it really is.

The defense was the worst in the NFL last season.  They rarely stopped anyone from scoring....lmao.  I mean, it can't get a helluva lot worse folks.  I guess people forget all of the 4th quarter comebacks our offense had to pull off, scoring nearly 40 points a game early on.

If I'm an established DC somewhere with a mid pack to top 10 unit, making good coin, I'll be damned if I'd take this position for less than double what I am currently making with the same length of contract to boot.  It's just too risky not to, and the Bengals are not going to pay that.  

The Bengals and Taylor had a plan, they just didn't realize how bad their shitty players on defense make this job look.  I realize this unit is truly talented, but they sure as hell didn't play like it last season, and even their former HC said as much in his recent interview.  These guys brought this upon themselves with a half ass effort last season.