Players To Resign or not and all things 2020 Season.

[guyofthetiger]

Here is my list of guys to keep for 2020 and beyond. Iggy at SS, Galvis at 2B, VanMeter at 1B/OF, Senzel at OF, and Aquino at OF. I'm not sure about pitching. The bullpen can be revamped.

[kevin]

(08-26-2019, 04:27 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: For sure 1B and LF are killing us in run production, especially 1B.

But there's two giant hurdles to get over in trading JV. 

1. I'm sure JV has a no trade clause, so he has to agree to it.
2. 25 million a year for 4 more years.

I'm not saying it's impossible I never figured they'd be able to unload Bailey but they did. Votto will turn 36 in a couple weeks. Who's going to pay an aging, slow, clearly in decline 1Bman at a rate of the 6th highest paid position player in MLB ?

If you exclude his 2014 62 game season his career slugging is near .550 the last two years it's about .414 averaging 12 HR's and about 50 RBI's

I'm no where close to a MLB contract/trade expert. But I'd venture to say the only way they're gonna move him (if he agrees, big IF) is to agree to pay a giant chunk of that salary.

You hear about it in football but I don't really recall it much in baseball. But is a contract renegotiation possible ? JV agreeing to a pay cut ?

Reds paid Brandon Phillips while he played with Braves all season.  To me, that is bad business.  

The only reason to dump Votto is to dump the contract.  You don't trade Votto and then keep paying him to play for another team.  That would be bad business.  It's the part of sports now that makes no sense.  Oakland was paying Carson Palmer to play for Arizona, and the new GM said it was something he took over that was killing them.  You don't pay Votto most of the 25 million to play the next 4 years for another team.  

This is why I was for trading Votto after he had the big 2017 season but Reds still in last place.  Maybe they have to wait and hope Votto gets hot again.  The Catch 22 is that then the Reds will say he is too good to trade. 

Hopefully some team with deep pockets wants him, big contract and all.  As you say, they traded Homer Bailey contract.  

The Reds traded 1 big contract to Dodgers for 3 big contracts that were all 1 year.  Reds had no intention of keeping any of those Dodgers past 2019.  Maybe they can do that with Votto.  Trade 1 big 4 year contract for 3 big 1 year contracts a team wants to dump ASAP, just like the Dodger trade.  Deep Pockets are Yankees, Angles, Red Sox, Phillies, Mets, Braves and a few others plus Dodgers.  Any of these teams ready to dump 3 or 4 big 1 year contracts ?

I would trade Votto for nothing in return and maybe throw in some Reds players the team also wants to dump his contract. Again, the idea is not to just trade Votto, the idea is to dump the contract.  Heck, if Reds still have to pay him, he might as well stay with Reds. Reds really can't afford to pay somebody 25 million to play for another team. That would be silly. 

As you say, they traded Homer who went to Dodgers, Royals and Oakland.  Actually Homer and Roark have play-off hopes with Oakland and they have a good pitching staff. Reds might be able to trade Votto and he might go play-offs for some other team. Still, Reds could use that 25 million on other players, meaning more than one.  Reds are small market and need to avoid big money for many years contracts in future. Most players just don't have great seasons every year anymore. Sparky Anderson said, " Give me 25 players with 1 year contracts and we will win the World Series ". It would mean a constant change in players, but look how players like Gennett, Puig, Iggey come in and bust their butts to get a contract with Reds or some other team. The 1999 Reds that had a good season was all players like that under Jack McKeon.

Reds have to be more Money Ball and think outside the box. They did do that on Homer trade. However I don't agree with all Money Ball Movie ideas. Going back to All White era of no base stealing for example. The Negro Leagues of Jackie Robinson showed you can win with Lou Brock and Ricky Henderson. The Big Red Machine of 70's was also called The Running Reds. The Braves in play-offs added Billy Hamilton and why not. In play-offs and World Series he can pinch run and also play some mean late inning defense. ....I also don't agree with the season is a flop if you don't win the World Series. There is nothing wrong with winning most of year and giving Fans reason to be excited all summer. ...Still, players too expensive for a small market team to keep, right, they must be traded. For Reds, that contract to dump is Votto.

[*bengalfan74*]

(08-27-2019, 02:48 AM)guyofthetiger Wrote: Here is my list of guys to keep for 2020 and beyond. Iggy at SS, Galvis at 2B, VanMeter at 1B/OF, Senzel at OF, and Aquino at OF. I'm not sure about pitching. The bullpen can be revamped.

agree

And I'd add:

Suarez 3B He's been one of if not our best bats the last couple seasons and he's a decent 3Bman
Barnhart C He's a very good defensive catcher and has rebounded nicely behind the plate after coming back. No he's not gonna hit 40 HR's or drive in 100 but he can contribute at the plate at or maybe a bit above average C production.

I'm kinda on the fence about Ervin. He's not all of that on defense and although his batting average is still good his power is becoming more and more suspect ? I don't think he has the speed to leadoff or play CF and it hurts to have a low power guy playing a corner OF position.

Winker I'm about thru with, he's to inconsistent ! If they keep him as bench player I'm not opposed. 

I'm not sure I want to totally give up on Peraza ? He's still young (25) and only a year removed from a really nice season at the plate. If they can retain him at a decent rate so be it. 

VanMeter is listed at LF, is he our future LFer ? Does he have the power ?

[*bengalfan74*]

https://www.redreporter.com/2019/8/27/20835545/josh-vanmeter-cincinnati-reds

[Yojimbo]

Wood with another back injury. Definitely gotta let this guy walk in the off-season.