Secondary Regression

[THE PISTONS]

So we know that Lou was a secondary coach with the Giants. Let's look at our secondary ratings through 4 games:

Webb - 52.9
Jackson - 57.4
Kirkpatrick - 57.6
Bates - 42.1
Williams 53.7

Kind of shocking. Jackson and Bates looked like budding Pro Bowl players last year...now they look lost. And the rankings prove it.

Under bad coaching, players regress.

[*PhilHos*]

Man, you reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally don't like our coaching staff, do you?

[THE PISTONS]

(10-03-2019, 11:40 AM)PhilHos Wrote: Man, you reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally don't like our coaching staff, do you?

What else would explain guys like Jackson and Bates who were budding Pro Bowl DB's...now looking terrible and lost?

Honestly, do YOU like this staff?

[THE PISTONS]

This is a staff that drops Billings back into coverage though...WHO wouldn't like that? (If they were an opponent.)

[KillerGoose]

This is one area where I am not that surprised. I didn’t expect anything from Lou and I thought it was more of a desperation hire than anything. The Giants defense was not very good last year and their pass defense was bottom 10.

The defense had a high probability of being bad under him.

[*PhilHos*]

(10-03-2019, 11:45 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: What else would explain guys like Jackson and Bates who were budding Pro Bowl DB's...now looking terrible and lost?

Honestly, do YOU like this staff?

I haven't made up my mind yet. I've seen some positives as well as negatives. I'm waiting to see if they can improve to the point where their positives outweigh their negatives. Anyone who knows anything about football knows you don't judge rookies (players or coaches) on their first 4 games.

[THE PISTONS]

(10-03-2019, 12:55 PM)PhilHos Wrote: I haven't made up my mind yet. I've seen some positives as well as negatives. I'm waiting to see if they can improve to the point where their positives outweigh their negatives. Anyone who knows anything about football knows you don't judge rookies (players or coaches) on their first 4 games.

Let's hear your case for the positives that you've seen so far. I'm willing to listen. Sway me.

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-03-2019, 01:05 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Let's hear your case for the positives that you've seen so far. I'm willing to listen. Sway me.

I know it is in distant memory but the Seattle Bengals looked good with these coaches  and played fast.  But the players now  appear to play in slow motion.  I understand your concern.  I question the Players decision making with new schemes.  It seems at times they are in position but either do not make the tackle or take bad angles to make the tackle.  

I said early in the season the way to exploit this defense would be throws to the flat and screens.  I am not sold on Sweet Lou however.  I don't really know the secondary coaches and I have no clue what they are teaching the players at this point.  

[THE PISTONS]

(10-03-2019, 01:16 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I know it is in distant memory but the Seattle Bengals looked good with these coaches  and played fast.  But the players now  appear to play in slow motion.  I understand your concern.  I question the Players decision making with new schemes.  It seems at times they are in position but either do not make the tackle or take bad angles to make the tackle.  

I said early in the season the way to exploit this defense would be throws to the flat and screens.  I am not sold on Sweet Lou however.  I don't really know the secondary coaches and I have no clue what they are teaching the players at this point.  

Honestly, we had trouble scoring. Better playcalling and that's a win.

Plus, there was no tape on us of our system for Seattle to prepare for.

The Steelers don't run the Wildcat, but against us they specifically did...Teams know how to attack us already.

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-03-2019, 01:42 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Honestly, we had trouble scoring. Better playcalling and that's a win.

Plus, there was no tape on us of our system for Seattle to prepare for.

The Steelers don't run the Wildcat, but against us they specifically did...Teams know how to attack us already.

If it just didn't rain at a critical time...
Remember, Randy missed that kick, Erickson for some reason took a poor angle away from the side line back into the field and fumbled.  I think Dalton fumbled...

[*bfine32*]

To be fair I think it's been 2 years since WJIII has looked like a "budding Pro Bowl Player" and he only played 5 games that year.

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-03-2019, 11:27 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: So we know that Lou was a secondary coach with the Giants. Let's look at our secondary ratings through 4 games:

Webb - 52.9
Jackson - 57.4
Kirkpatrick - 57.6
Bates - 42.1
Williams 53.7

Kind of shocking. Jackson and Bates looked like budding Pro Bowl players last year...now they look lost. And the rankings prove it.

Under bad coaching, players regress.

WJ3 and Shawn Williams both had green grades in the pitt game and Bates was 63.6

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-03-2019, 02:02 PM)bfine32 Wrote: To be fair I think it's been 2 years since WJIII has looked like a "budding Pro Bowl Player" and he only played 5 games that year.

That is a good point. It seems like the secondary have a lot of injuries.   Dennard has played in 68 games and is in his 6th year as a Bengal.  Dennard started in 19 of those games as a first rounder.   

[THE PISTONS]

(10-03-2019, 02:10 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: WJ3 and Shawn Williams both had green grades in the pitt game and Bates was 63.6

Pittsburgh essentially only threw a handful of passes over 5 yards in the air. They essentially ran it nearly every down against us...but the runs were statistically shown as passes.

[*psychdoctor*]

I guess the bigger question is why is there miscommunication on the field?

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-03-2019, 11:45 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: What else would explain guys like Jackson and Bates who were budding Pro Bowl DB's...now looking terrible and lost?

Honestly, do YOU like this staff?

Jackson has terrible games @Seattle and against SF (in the 40s). Last 2 games he's graded out 69.8 and 75.6

[*psychdoctor*]

(10-03-2019, 02:11 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Pittsburgh essentially only threw a handful of passes over 5 yards in the air. They essentially ran it nearly every down against us...but the runs were statistically shown as passes.

My understanding was the Steelers had Rudolph on 1-read plays so that he would succeed against the Bengals physical D-Line.  They did not want him taking hits.  

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-03-2019, 02:11 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Pittsburgh essentially only threw a handful of passes over 5 yards in the air. They essentially ran it nearly every down against us...but the runs were statistically shown as passes.

Oh. So it doesn't count because they were just standing around in the defensive backfield waiting all night for plays to come their way.  

[*rfaulk34*]

(10-03-2019, 02:22 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Oh. So it doesn't count because they were just standing around in the defensive backfield waiting all night for plays to come their way.  

No. They, as a trio, were targeted just as much in the Pitt game as they were in every other game this year--8 to 10 times. 

[fortyyearfan]

(10-03-2019, 01:16 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: I know it is in distant memory but the Seattle Bengals looked good with these coaches  and played fast.  But the players now  appear to play in slow motion.  I understand your concern.  I question the Players decision making with new schemes.  It seems at times they are in position but either do not make the tackle or take bad angles to make the tackle.  

I said early in the season the way to exploit this defense would be throws to the flat and screens.  I am not sold on Sweet Lou however.  I don't really know the secondary coaches and I have no clue what they are teaching the players at this point.  

Hello to all of you long long suffering Bengal fans and I am one of them. To me,this coaching staff has been outcoached every game,and for real,the players on this team are not that good,everywhere. And the HC KEEPS saying he believes in all these guys and I believe he keeps saying that so they will at least try for him.And know,Mr.Mike Brown will not fire him the first season.Its going to take a long time for this franchise can compete for real and being in this tough division,they may never win it all.The steelers have a very good qb that is going to take Bens job.He is the real deal.Six foot 5 inches and 237 pounds,and he can sling it and is accurate.Our O- line is just terrible and is not going to get better because they want to,and Bobby Hart is horrible.He is not big enough and does not know how to use his hands correctly.We need O-line help everywhere. :paul: :paul: :paul: :paul: :paul: