Green talks.....

[Bengalstripes9]

They better get a deal done, in my opinion. He's the best player we have to build a team around. The odds of us drafting a player that can offer more in the draft are not very good. Take the sure thing. He's the best player on our team. We probably would have 2 wins right now. 2-3 and we're still in the hunt.

I do think this injury is lucky in the way that if we were a 2-3 team with AJ healthy, our offensive line would not produce a playoff team. Therefore, a higher draft pick is nice.

[HarleyDog]

(10-10-2019, 12:51 PM)treee Wrote: I love Green but if we're gonna be dropping any serious cash this offseason it needs to be on starting caliber linemen and linebackers in FA. We could shorten the rebuild pretty significantly that way. Dunno if paying a top-10 WR fits in to that financial equation.

I think most of us are in the same opinion. I guess if AJ stays healthy the remainder of the season and comes back and makes a difference, that will say a lot in the direction we need to go. God forbid he gets injured tho, cause that's a lose-lose for both parties. 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-10-2019, 05:42 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I get that too, completely understandable.



Yes sir. If there was a trade to be made I would trade Dalton if we could get anything for him. His pocket awareness just
isn't there and you have to have it with a below average O-line. Heck he finally has a good Center in front of him and he still
panics even when there is decent protection. I would roll with Finley the rest of the season if we lose against the Ratbirds in
a blow out.

Always been a Dalton supporter too, but I think the writing is on the wall.

The more I think about it....the more I think they may roll with Finley. I didn't remember it until just a bit ago, but there are SEVERAL QBs in, or have been in the league out of NC State.

[HarleyDog]

(10-10-2019, 07:01 PM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: They better get a deal done, in my opinion. He's the best player we have to build a team around. The odds of us drafting a player that can offer more in the draft are not very good. Take the sure thing. He's the best player on our team. We probably would have 2 wins right now. 2-3 and we're still in the hunt.

I do think this injury is lucky in the way that if we were a 2-3 team with AJ healthy, our offensive line would not produce a playoff team. Therefore, a higher draft pick is nice.

But your only talking 2-3 wins and that's a big IF? We really dont know. Top that with AJs injury history lately and it's a really scary situation. I'm speaking of the future of course and not totally toward your post. I really got to say I'm on the fence here. I love AJ and that's why I want to see him stay. But I think he could continue contributing for years to come if we get good value for him while traded. I guess its all how you look at it? Many variables.

[Bengalstripes9]

(10-10-2019, 09:22 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: But your only talking 2-3 wins and that's a big IF? We really dont know. Top that with AJs injury history lately and it's a really scary situation. I'm speaking of the future of course and not totally toward your post. I really got to say I'm on the fence here. I love AJ and that's why I want to see him stay. But I think he could continue contributing for years to come if we get good value for him while traded. I guess its all how you look at it? Many variables.

I understand why some of you think trading him makes sense. But i think if you can get 6 more years out of him he changes defenses for you. Our wide receivers haven't been nearly as consistent as AJ. Every game he either gets 100 yards or a TD. Often both. The young wrs show promise. But Boyd/Ross are complimentary WRs. I would look at trading some of the mid teir guys. Not AJ. You fix the Oline and he brings you to the playoffs. You fix the linebackers and you could win in the playoffs. Not sure if there is potential to get a qb upgrade. Mahomes may have been our chance. Is there a QB where we end up drafting that is close to that andrew luck, russell Wilson, patrick mahones level, sure. Otherwise ill take a lineman or linebacker.

[Circleville Guy]

Of course Mike Will now pay him for past numbers instead of projected numbers so he can’t upgrade in other areas.

[treee]

(10-11-2019, 02:29 AM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: I understand why some of you think trading him makes sense. But i think if you can get 6 more years out of him he changes defenses for you. Our wide receivers haven't been nearly as consistent as AJ. Every game he  either gets 100 yards or a TD. Often both. The young wrs show promise. But Boyd/Ross are complimentary WRs. I would look at trading some of the mid teir guys. Not AJ. You fix the Oline and he brings you to the playoffs. You fix the linebackers and you could win in the playoffs. Not sure if there is potential to get a qb upgrade. Mahomes may have been our chance. Is there a QB where we end up drafting that is close to that andrew luck, russell Wilson, patrick mahones level, sure. Otherwise ill take a lineman or linebacker.

You don't rebuild an offense around a WR. We need to add at least 3 solid starting quality lineman for literally any other position on our offense to even matter. You can count on MAYBE adding 1 through the draft this offseason (and that's still a roll of the dice). Bottom line is we are going to have to shell out some cash on this Oline in FA. If we can keep Green and do that, great. Otherwise you gotta pick building the trenches first.

[Bengalstripes9]

(10-11-2019, 06:31 AM)treee Wrote: You don't rebuild an offense around a WR. We need to add at least 3 solid starting quality lineman for literally any other position on our offense to even matter. You can count on MAYBE adding 1 through the draft this offseason (and that's still a roll of the dice). Bottom line is we are going to have to shell out some cash on this Oline in FA. If we can keep Green and do that, great. Otherwise you gotta pick building the trenches first.

It's just difference of opinion, I guess. If you do a good job drafting, you shouldn't let the guys you hit on walk, especially at premier positions like QB, WR, Left Tackle, Defensive End. We should not have let Whit or Zeitler walk. Now everyone is talking about getting rid of another difference maker in Green. Okay, maybe they could have gotten away with letting Zeitler walk. But to be competitive you need a solid left tackle. You can't let that left tackle walk with hopes someone will develop. You take the sure thing. Same with WR. Take the sure thing. If you let Green go with hopes of replacing him, you will get burned. Julio Jones's, AJ Greens, Antonio Browns, they just don't grow on trees. We can't just keep letting difference makers walk with hopes of replacing them in the draft. That's not how to run a winning franchise.

Green changes defenses for you. He makes everyone else better. Why trade that away? He can play another 6 years at least. Get him a franchise Left Tackle and improve the rest of the offensive line. If there is an upgrade at QB make the upgrade. If not, the offensive line and linebacker are where you devote your resources. 

I wouldn't have let Whit walk (a top 5 Left Tackle). I wouldn't let Green walk (a top 5 WR). These are players you can build a team around. Plain and simple. 

[Bengalstripes9]

I will also add that Green makes Dalton a better QB. He makes every playmaker on offense better. Whit made things easier on the rest of the offensive line. You don't let those players walk with hopes you can replace them. It's obviously hard to do, we are witness to that with the loss of Whit. We are seeing what this team looks like right now without AJ, too. These are two key pieces that would significantly improve this team. We have an opportunity in Free Agency and the draft to improve our Oline and Linebacker.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-11-2019, 11:08 AM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: It's just difference of opinion, I guess. If you do a good job drafting, you shouldn't let the guys you hit on walk, especially at premier positions like QB, WR, Left Tackle, Defensive End. We should not have let Whit or Zeitler walk. Now everyone is talking about getting rid of another difference maker in Green. Okay, maybe they could have gotten away with letting Zeitler walk. But to be competitive you need a solid left tackle. You can't let that left tackle walk with hopes someone will develop. You take the sure thing. Same with WR. Take the sure thing. If you let Green go with hopes of replacing him, you will get burned. Julio Jones's, AJ Greens, Antonio Browns, they just don't grow on trees. We can't just keep letting difference makers walk with hopes of replacing them in the draft. That's not how to run a winning franchise.

Green changes defenses for you. He makes everyone else better. Why trade that away? He can play another 6 years at least. Get him a franchise Left Tackle and improve the rest of the offensive line. If there is an upgrade at QB make the upgrade. If not, the offensive line and linebacker are where you devote your resources. 

I wouldn't have let Whit walk (a top 5 Left Tackle). I wouldn't let Green walk (a top 5 WR). These are players you can build a team around. Plain and simple. 

I’d say AJ has more like 3-4 years of high level play left, and is not quite top 5 anymore, but probably still top 10, but other than that, well said. I completely agree.

[treee]

(10-11-2019, 11:08 AM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: It's just difference of opinion, I guess. If you do a good job drafting, you shouldn't let the guys you hit on walk, especially at premier positions like QB, WR, Left Tackle, Defensive End. We should not have let Whit or Zeitler walk. Now everyone is talking about getting rid of another difference maker in Green. Okay, maybe they could have gotten away with letting Zeitler walk. But to be competitive you need a solid left tackle. You can't let that left tackle walk with hopes someone will develop. You take the sure thing. Same with WR. Take the sure thing. If you let Green go with hopes of replacing him, you will get burned. Julio Jones's, AJ Greens, Antonio Browns, they just don't grow on trees. We can't just keep letting difference makers walk with hopes of replacing them in the draft. That's not how to run a winning franchise.

Green changes defenses for you. He makes everyone else better. Why trade that away? He can play another 6 years at least. Get him a franchise Left Tackle and improve the rest of the offensive line. If there is an upgrade at QB make the upgrade. If not, the offensive line and linebacker are where you devote your resources. 

I wouldn't have let Whit walk (a top 5 Left Tackle). I wouldn't let Green walk (a top 5 WR). These are players you can build a team around. Plain and simple. 

What's the point in building a team around a WR when you can only have him run routes that take 2 seconds or less to develop? I get it, he has freakish talent and measurables. That also works against him too. The guys you see in the league for a long time generally have more compact physical builds. Most likely, his best days are behind him and he will only continue to deteriorate and become injured more often. You won't see me chasing him out of town, he's made Bengals football bearable to watch ever since Chad left. But if the FO decides to go another direction I still think that's completely reasonable.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-11-2019, 06:31 AM)treee Wrote: You don't rebuild an offense around a WR. We need to add at least 3 solid starting quality lineman for literally any other position on our offense to even matter. You can count on MAYBE adding 1 through the draft this offseason (and that's still a roll of the dice). Bottom line is we are going to have to shell out some cash on this Oline in FA. If we can keep Green and do that, great. Otherwise you gotta pick building the trenches first.

(10-11-2019, 01:47 PM)treee Wrote: What's the point in building a team around a WR when you can only have him run routes that take 2 seconds or less to develop? I get it, he has freakish talent and measurables. That also works against him too. The guys you see in the league for a long time generally have more compact physical builds. Most likely, his best days are behind him and he will only continue to deteriorate and become injured more often. You won't see me chasing him out of town, he's made Bengals football bearable to watch ever since Chad left. But if the FO decides to go another direction I still think that's completely reasonable.

All great points Treee as usual but I think we have our Center of the future on the roster in Hopkins, Jonah should be our
LT of the future and Price I think will grow into a decent Guard on either side of Hop. A Guard in FA and and early pick on a
RT and we should be muchly improved in the trenches. 

We aren't trading AJ so that is a moot point, Taylor said so.

Extend AJ for a 3 years or so on a reasonable contract citing his injury history as of late and either trade Dalton or move on
completely. If we lose to the Ratbirds big time Sunday, start Finley for the rest of the season who has shown some pocket 
awareness.

[Yojimbo]

Schefter just said Green might be contemplating not playing this year if the team hasn’t improved by the time he returns from injury. Not risking further injury before free agency.

I’m assuming if he gets an extension or the team turns it around and is competitive ok couldn’t type that second condition with a straight face, he would return when healthy.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-11-2019, 04:39 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Schefter just said Green might be contemplating not playing this year if the team hasn’t improved by the time he returns from injury. Not risking further injury before free agency.

I’m assuming if he gets an extension or the team turns it around and is competitive ok couldn’t type that second condition with a straight face, he would return when healthy.

Need a win this Sunday then looks like.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-11-2019, 04:39 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Schefter just said Green might be contemplating not playing this year if the team hasn’t improved by the time he returns from injury. Not risking further injury before free agency.

I’m assuming if he gets an extension or the team turns it around and is competitive ok couldn’t type that second condition with a straight face, he would return when healthy.

In the day and age of Twitter news.... I don't buy that until it comes from AJs mouth. He's already shot down the Rotoworld nonsense....and was just quoted today as saying "it's not about money" per Bengals Wire.

[Yojimbo]

(10-11-2019, 05:19 PM)WychesWarrior Wrote: In the day and age of Twitter news.... I don't buy that until it comes from AJs mouth. He's already shot down the Rotoworld nonsense....and was just quoted today as saying "it's not about money" per Bengals Wire.

I agree with you 99%, but Schefter is the one rumor guy I trust.

[Bengalstripes9]

(10-11-2019, 01:47 PM)treee Wrote: What's the point in building a team around a WR when you can only have him run routes that take 2 seconds or less to develop? I get it, he has freakish talent and measurables. That also works against him too. The guys you see in the league for a long time generally have more compact physical builds. Most likely, his best days are behind him and he will only continue to deteriorate and become injured more often. You won't see me chasing him out of town, he's made Bengals football bearable to watch ever since Chad left. But if the FO decides to go another direction I still think that's completely reasonable.

Get him a starting left tackle and the line suddenly looks much better already, giving Dalton the time to find him, and a great supporting cast of skill players. With such a high draft pick next year we should have a shot at an elite offensive lineman or linebacker.

I disagree that his best football is behind him. His first 3TD game was only last year.