How to fix this mess?

[Luvnit2]

We are getting dominated in the trenches on both offense and defense.

Hire a GM with experience .


Focus on OL and DL in draft and free agency.

Trade AD prior to draft and add more pick(s).

Sign AJ Green to a team friendly deal and then trade him for picks in 2020 and 2021.

Use cap money to fix OL and DL.

[hotweales]

(11-23-2019, 12:09 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Looking at how the Dalton era has petered out post-2015 and we are looking at going into 2020 with Finley/draft?/journeyman? I really wish we had looked at QB before this.

Even going into the 2019 draft it was like...no QB in round 1 because Dalton isn't our biggest issue.  Well, going into 2020 it looks like QB might be our biggest issue and now we are just going to kick the can down the road until the whole team is less awful?  Ehh, ida know.  We need someone dynamic under center to take people's minds off of how terrible everything else is.

I respect your opinion, but have to disagree.
Andy is not so terrible that he is the problem. Andy can win games and can probably win playoff games with the right team and Coach. Marvin never had us prepared for the playoffs. The one year he did, we imploded with poor character.

[grampahol]

Plan: Figure out a new spelling for mess. Instead of spelling it as M E S S use the following instead.. "We should be used to this by now." or some reasonable facsimile..
Starting next season it should be: Ladies and gentlemen, your 2020 Cincinnati "We Should Be Used To It By Now's" 

maybe the WSBUTIBN's..
As long as the Brown criminal cabal owns the team we're never gonna see much more than nothing other than the same old shit.. Who knows? maybe the Brown clan will be indicted for any number of federal crimes and sent off to some federal prison. Raise thy hand if that would break your collective hearts.

[*Nately120*]

(11-23-2019, 11:21 AM)hotweales Wrote: I respect your opinion, but have to disagree.
Andy is not so terrible that he is the problem. Andy can win games and can probably win playoff games with the right team and Coach. Marvin never had us prepared for the playoffs. The one year he did, we imploded with poor character.

I meant it more like QB is the biggest issue because Andy is a decent QB but he's going into his 10th year, he has 0 rings, and we've benched him for the hell of it...the ship has sailed and he clearly wants out and the Bengals want his salary off the books.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-23-2019, 11:00 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: We are getting dominated in the trenches on both offense and defense.

Hire a GM with experience .


Focus on OL and DL in draft and free agency.

Trade AD prior to draft and add more pick(s).

Sign AJ Green to a team friendly deal and then trade him for picks in 2020 and 2021.

Use cap money to fix OL and DL.

That's my template too.

As I've posted, the offensive line COULD be fixed in one year...IF they wanted to spend in free agency. And cutting Glenn would free up a decent chunk of salary to do it.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-23-2019, 03:39 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I meant it more like QB is the biggest issue because Andy is a decent QB but he's going into his 10th year, he has 0 rings, and we've benched him for the hell of it...the ship has sailed and he clearly wants out and the Bengals want his salary off the books.

Yes - They've kind of forced their hand on drafting a QB...but drafting 1 is the perfect opportunity.

[Luvnit2]

(11-23-2019, 06:12 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: That's my template too.

As I've posted, the offensive line COULD be fixed in one year...IF they wanted to spend in free agency. And cutting Glenn would free up a decent chunk of salary to do it.

I am glad Glenn may be back and hopefully play the last 6 games. If he plays well, then why cut/trade him. We add J. Williams, I am hopeful he will be a stud once healthy. Add another couple of pieces via FA or draft and the rebuilding begins for the OL.

After watch Young play, the guy is a stud at 6 foot 6 and 330 lbs and quick and fast. I hope he is there when we draft in round 1.

[TheCincinnatiKid]

(11-22-2019, 06:38 PM)MEBengalsFan Wrote: If ZT goes 0-16 and than 0-4 next year, can him. I like to give the coaches a fair shot but going 0-20 as a coach you better be ready to be let go. Plain and simple. 

Yep if he stays next year and gets off to a poor start, there's no reason to keep him. He's not going to turn this into a Superbowl team in two offseasons, but there need to be signs of life sooner rather than later.

[hotweales]

(11-23-2019, 03:39 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I meant it more like QB is the biggest issue because Andy is a decent QB but he's going into his 10th year, he has 0 rings, and we've benched him for the hell of it...the ship has sailed and he clearly wants out and the Bengals want his salary off the books.

I am fully on board with this. I completely agree that it is time to move on due to his salary. 2 straight drafts with solid choices coming up. Chase Young may be a difference maker. Is he going to be as good as Mack, or Donald? If they see him as this type of player, you have to take him. 

[grampahol]

(11-23-2019, 07:22 PM)hotweales Wrote: I am fully on board with this. I completely agree that it is time to move on due to his salary. 2 straight drafts with solid choices coming up. Chase Young may be a difference maker. Is he going to be as good as Mack, or Donald? If they see him as this type of player, you have to take him. 

Look on the bright side..maybe he'll get injured or beat up a few women so the bengals will pick him.. Ya never know.. Heck, maybe he'll beat up a few kids or something really begalized.. 

[*Nately120*]

(11-23-2019, 07:22 PM)hotweales Wrote: I am fully on board with this. I completely agree that it is time to move on due to his salary. 2 straight drafts with solid choices coming up. Chase Young may be a difference maker. Is he going to be as good as Mack, or Donald? If they see him as this type of player, you have to take him. 

This may sound a little conspiracy theory-ish, but I think we take a QB at #1 overall because ZT doesn't want to be in anything resembling a "win now" situation.  He was given a "win now" team with a vet QB with a winning record in the NFL and he went 0-8 and suddenly it was time to "evaluate Finley" which to me means " put myself in a situation where people aren't expecting wins." A rookie QB overall at #1 is right back to "evaluation more important than W/L record."

Just my take.

[BengalFanInNJ]

(11-23-2019, 06:32 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am glad Glenn may be back and hopefully play the last 6 games. If he plays well, then why cut/trade him. We add J. Williams, I am hopeful he will be a stud once healthy. Add another couple of pieces via FA or draft and the rebuilding begins for the OL.

After watch Young play, the guy is a stud at 6 foot 6 and 330 lbs and quick and fast. I hope he is there when we draft in round 1.

Everyone is going to be there when we draft in round 1. We are going to have the first pick. 

[hotweales]

(11-23-2019, 10:08 PM)Nately120 Wrote: This may sound a little conspiracy theory-ish, but I think we take a QB at #1 overall because ZT doesn't want to be in anything resembling a "win now" situation.  He was given a "win now" team with a vet QB with a winning record in the NFL and he went 0-8 and suddenly it was time to "evaluate Finley" which to me means " put myself in a situation where people aren't expecting wins."  A rookie QB overall at #1 is right back to "evaluation more important than W/L record."

Just my take.

No Coach goes into the season without expectations of winning. There are years, that you understand your talent is not as good, but you approach every game as any given Sunday.  The move to Finley is because they are out of the playoff hunt, they can no longer have any type of a respectable record, so you move on to evaluate the players that will be on team next season. But, I assure you that they are preparing every week with the expectation of winning. If not, they should not be with the team. 

[*Nately120*]

(11-24-2019, 11:26 AM)hotweales Wrote: No Coach goes into the season without expectations of winning. There are years, that you understand your talent is not as good, but you approach every game as any given Sunday.  The move to Finley is because they are out of the playoff hunt, they can no longer have any type of a respectable record, so you move on to evaluate the players that will be on team next season. But, I assure you that they are preparing every week with the expectation of winning. If not, they should not be with the team. 

I rhink ZT might want to be in "evaluation mode" to cover his arse.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-23-2019, 06:32 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am glad Glenn may be back and hopefully play the last 6 games. If he plays well, then why cut/trade him. We add J. Williams, I am hopeful he will be a stud once healthy. Add another couple of pieces via FA or draft and the rebuilding begins for the OL.

After watch Young play, the guy is a stud at 6 foot 6 and 330 lbs and quick and fast. I hope he is there when we draft in round 1.

Glenn has been injured A LOT the past 3-4 years. It's the main reason Buffalo traded him to us. It's caused his play to decline too.

He's basically a 340 lb finesse blocker.

IF we could get rid of him and get a Tackle like Jack Conklin or a Guard like Scherff...that's a major upgrade.

Plus...I just don't think Glenn wants to be here.

We'll see though. Maybe he will surprise me with great play and change my mind.

[THE PISTONS]

(11-24-2019, 12:14 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I rhink ZT might want to be in "evaluation mode" to cover his arse.

Yep. He took a roster that was in win now mode, and through benching's made it a 'Nobody could win with these guys' roster.

Layer that with the Green and Williams injury and Boling retiring and he has an excuse.

Heck IF we win 1 or 2 games, I think some will view Taylor as overachieving...because they expect 0-16.

HOW is that even possible?

[THE PISTONS]

(11-23-2019, 06:56 PM)TheCincinnatiKid Wrote: Yep if he stays next year and gets off to a poor start, there's no reason to keep him. He's not going to turn this into a Superbowl team in two offseasons, but there need to be signs of life sooner rather than later.

IMO you either fire Taylor in the offseason this year or give him through next year. You don't start 0-4 next year and fire him. The season is ruined at that point anyways.

The evaluation at this point should be: Can this guy make players on the roster better and actually build offensive and defensive systems? It shouldn't be...can he win 3 games to save his job.

IF he can't...then you want him nowhere near a #1 overall pick...and that pick is probably the only desireable thing that could lure a HC here.

[THE PISTONS]

Coincidentally, there are a lot of articles out there talking about how Marvin is a hot HC candidate for next year. The dumpster fire here has made him look like a genius.

[TheCincinnatiKid]

(11-24-2019, 12:42 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: IMO you either fire Taylor in the offseason this year or give him through next year. You don't start 0-4 next year and fire him. The season is ruined at that point anyways.

The evaluation at this point should be: Can this guy make players on the roster better and actually build offensive and defensive systems? It shouldn't be...can he win 3 games to save his job.

IF he can't...then you want him nowhere near a #1 overall pick...and that pick is probably the only desireable thing that could lure a HC here.

Yeah I can't argue with sacking him this offseason. The question would be 'look at our young/just drafted players', has ZT shown any ability to have developed them so far? Probably too early to tell, but we need to be confident in him being able to develop players to trust the guy with a high pick.

I think if we go 1-15 and just roll out 0-4 next season... unless we've played the Pats and Steelers in all 4 games or something, then he just wouldn't be showing any sign of life. We're a team in transition though so it depends more how we play than just the result at this point. If we look much improved and dangerous but lose a few close games, that's almost better than fluky wins at this stage. We know we aren't winning anything in the next 2 years so it's all about how we play and whether ZT looks to be the man taking us there. Right now, obviously a hard no.

[I_C_DeadPeople]

(11-24-2019, 12:44 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Coincidentally, there are a lot of articles out there talking about how Marvin is a hot HC candidate for next year. The dumpster fire here has made him look like a genius.

ML can always present the argument that he was essentially handcuffed the whole time here. And it is very believable.