Updated Cap Space 4/9

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-10-2020, 03:36 PM)ochocincos Wrote: What starting gigs are open right now though that would want to give Dalton $20 mill a year?

NE is really the only wide open one.

MIA is likely to take a QB at 5 and has Fitzmagic as a stopgap.
LAC is likely to take a QB at 3 and has Taylor as a stopgap.

Minshew did well for JAX last year (3200 yards, 21 TDs, 6 INTs in 12 starts), so they may not view Dalton worth $20 mill a year. They may be interested in Dalton though in the $8-12 mill range to compete with Minshew.

DEN may be interested in Dalton to compete with Lock, but they may want to roll with Lock as their starter given he ended with a 4-1 record last year.

It's not about what starting jobs are open this year. It's about what starting jobs could be open in 2021.

At this point he's likely going to be a backup, but if he's a backup on a 1 year deal and his starter goes down (or his starter isn't very good) then he is just a couple good starts in a row away from getting that $20m/yr+ in 2021.

Not saying it's going to happen exactly like that, but the possibility isn't outlandish, so I doubt he'd lock himself down for a 3yr deal at $8-10m/yr when he could potentially make the low end of that in 2021 alone if he steps up when called upon by a team in 2020.

(04-10-2020, 04:07 PM)McC Wrote: All those guys are starters and Dalton is not.  Apples to oranges.

If he gets cut and signs somewhere else it will be as a backup and for much less than 20 mil.  No backup QB makes more than 7.5 mil. 

Unless he signs a one year deal as a backup and the starter goes down and Dalton steps in and tears it up and he signs a new deal to be a starter, Dalton will never see anywhere close to 20 mil a year ever again.

You just added "unless" before repeating the ENTIRE point of my post, McC. 

Quote:Dalton is just a hurt starter and a stretch of 3-4 good (not even great) starts away from making at least $20m/yr.

He's a backup for 1 year for someone, steps in and makes 3-4 good starts when they get hurt or suck, and then gets paid for 2021+.

Garoppolo got paid 5yr/$137.5m for 7 starts over a 2 year span while being a backup.
Tannehill got paid 4yr/$118m for 10 starts after being a backup.
Bridgewater got paid 3yr/$63m for 5 starts while being a backup.
Brissett got paid $2yr/$30m for 2 starts while being a backup.

That is just how the NFL is rolling these days.

[McC]

(04-10-2020, 04:27 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: It's not about what starting jobs are open this year. It's about what starting jobs could be open in 2021.

At this point he's likely going to be a backup, but if he's a backup on a 1 year deal and his starter goes down (or his starter isn't very good) then he is just a couple good starts in a row away from getting that $20m/yr+ in 2021.

Not saying it's going to happen exactly like that, but the possibility isn't outlandish, so I doubt he'd lock himself down for a 3yr deal at $8-10m/yr when he could potentially make the low end of that in 2021 alone if he steps up when called upon by a team in 2020.


You just added "unless" before repeating the ENTIRE point of my post, McC. 


He's a backup for 1 year for someone, steps in and makes 3-4 good starts when they get hurt or suck, and then gets paid for 2021+.

Garoppolo got paid 5yr/$137.5m for 7 starts over a 2 year span while being a backup.
Tannehill got paid 4yr/$118m for 10 starts after being a backup.
Bridgewater got paid 3yr/$63m for 5 starts while being a backup.
Brissett got paid $2yr/$30m for 2 starts while being a backup.

That is just how the NFL is rolling these days.

Not sure I see why Dalton would ever sign that deal.


This is what you said, right before you listed a bunch of starters.

It wasn't until your next post that you brought up 2021.

How foolish were we to address what you actually said instead of what you said afterwards that you meant to say.

[*ochocincos*]

(04-10-2020, 04:27 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: It's not about what starting jobs are open this year. It's about what starting jobs could be open in 2021.

At this point he's likely going to be a backup, but if he's a backup on a 1 year deal and his starter goes down (or his starter isn't very good) then he is just a couple good starts in a row away from getting that $20m/yr+ in 2021.

Not saying it's going to happen exactly like that, but the possibility isn't outlandish, so I doubt he'd lock himself down for a 3yr deal at $8-10m/yr when he could potentially make the low end of that in 2021 alone if he steps up when called upon by a team in 2020.


You just added "unless" before repeating the ENTIRE point of my post, McC. 


He's a backup for 1 year for someone, steps in and makes 3-4 good starts when they get hurt or suck, and then gets paid for 2021+.

Garoppolo got paid 5yr/$137.5m for 7 starts over a 2 year span while being a backup.
Tannehill got paid 4yr/$118m for 10 starts after being a backup.
Bridgewater got paid 3yr/$63m for 5 starts while being a backup.
Brissett got paid $2yr/$30m for 2 starts while being a backup.

That is just how the NFL is rolling these days.

I see your point, but that's a gamble Dalton would have to be willing to take, as there's no guarantee an opportunity would open up for Dalton to once again become a starter or him to play well enough to earn it.

EDIT - And most of these backups who became starters spent more than one year as a backup, and they got compensated as a backup. Tannehill was the only one who got paid for one year of backup work, and he led his team on an incredible run to get there. The likelihood of Dalton (or any other QB in such a situation) doing the same thing isn't high.

EDIT 2 - Dalton would also have to compete with Cam Newton and Jameis Winston to get that replacement gig. It's not like he'd be the only QB on the market.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-10-2020, 03:24 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Not sure I see why Dalton would ever sign that deal.

In a world where Carr is making $25m/yr, Tannehill is making $29.5m/yr, Cousins is making $33m/yr, and Dak Prescott is getting $29-30m for 1 year... Dalton is just a hurt starter and a stretch of 3-4 good (not even great) starts away from making at least $20m/yr.

(04-10-2020, 04:48 PM)McC Wrote: Not sure I see why Dalton would ever sign that deal.


This is what you said, right before you listed a bunch of starters.

It wasn't until your next post that you brought up 2021.

How foolish were we to address what you actually said instead of what you said afterwards that you meant to say.

This is my post that YOU quoted. (And apparently didn't read.)

If he's a hurt starter and 3-4 good starts away from making $20m/yr+, how would it be in 2020 that he'd be making $20m/yr+ when 2020 is when he needs to make those 3-4 good starts in order to get the contract? That's just basic logic and reading comprehension, man.

More like how foolish were you to not read a post before you quote and reply to it. I don't know why you keep replying to my posts despite refusing to actually read them and then are a dick about it when called out on it.

[McC]

(04-10-2020, 05:21 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: This is my post that YOU quoted. (And apparently didn't read.)

If he's a hurt starter and 3-4 good starts away from making $20m/yr+, how would it be in 2020 that he'd be making $20m/yr+ when 2020 is when he needs to make those 3-4 good starts in order to get the contract? That's just basic logic and reading comprehension, man.

More like how foolish were you to not read a post before you quote and reply to it. I don't know why you keep replying to my posts despite refusing to actually read them and then are a dick about it when called out on it.

I'm not having another one of these with you.  You were right.  I was wrong.

[Hoofhearted]

(04-10-2020, 04:27 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: It's not about what starting jobs are open this year. It's about what starting jobs could be open in 2021.

At this point he's likely going to be a backup, but if he's a backup on a 1 year deal and his starter goes down (or his starter isn't very good) then he is just a couple good starts in a row away from getting that $20m/yr+ in 2021.

Not saying it's going to happen exactly like that, but the possibility isn't outlandish, so I doubt he'd lock himself down for a 3yr deal at $8-10m/yr when he could potentially make the low end of that in 2021 alone if he steps up when called upon by a team in 2020.


You just added "unless" before repeating the ENTIRE point of my post, McC. 


He's a backup for 1 year for someone, steps in and makes 3-4 good starts when they get hurt or suck, and then gets paid for 2021+.

Garoppolo got paid 5yr/$137.5m for 7 starts over a 2 year span while being a backup.
Tannehill got paid 4yr/$118m for 10 starts after being a backup.
Bridgewater got paid 3yr/$63m for 5 starts while being a backup.
Brissett got paid $2yr/$30m for 2 starts while being a backup.

That is just how the NFL is rolling these days.

Yep. Sorry late to my reply. Went back to school so studying a lot.

Plus I see him wanting fresh scenery on top of that. If he’s cut and forced to take a pay cut to come back, he’ll want to do it on another team. Especially after being benched last year. Just don’t see why he’d do that when he can compete for a different team with a vet QB on last year of deal (Colts next year), teams with average QBs, or as you stated injury. Either way, the ship has all but left the dock for getting something for AD. Doesn’t make sense for him or us to drag this on. Cut bait and move on.

[BengalChris]

(04-09-2020, 12:28 PM)ochocincos Wrote: We finally know the contract details for the rest of the FAs who were signed (woohoo!)
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cincinnati-bengals/cap/

The Bengals now have $8.95 mill in cap space.
The one caveat with that is the draft picks are expected to cost ~$11.5 mill when all is said and done, which could put the Bengals over the cap if no one is cut/traded.

I think the most likely scenario that happens is Dalton is traded/cut during or after the draft, freeing up enough cash for the Bengals to not only sign their draft picks but also extend a guy before the season starts. Maybe WJ3 or AJ Green.

Your thoughts?

Or Mixon, if Mixon can get over the fact that RBs don't get paid top dollar anymore. The team and Mixon have both seen what has transpired with Todd Gurley and Levon Bell. My guess is that the team will not extend anyone and let the season play out.

Dalton will be gone unless he agrees to an extreme pay cut, which is highly unlikely. The team would be better over rolling over extra cap space, if it's allowed to under the new CBA.

 

[*SHRacerX*]

(04-09-2020, 01:05 PM)McC Wrote: While I agree that he would not do anything to be a distraction, I do think his presence there wouldn't be good for anyone, if for no other reason that he'd be where he didn't want to be.

Agreed.  No that Andy was the most vocal leader, he was the starting QB for pretty much every game for every player on the roster (those 3 with Finley don't count... ).  I want Burrow to be able to come in and take the leadership role right away.

While I agree with Truck that Dalton wouldn't do anything to be a distraction or a bad teammate, I think the team would be better off without him here even as a teacher.  I'm sure a lot of guys really like Dalton and they might feel bad for him losing his job to a rookie that has never taken a snap in the NFL.   They also may realize that the team seems a bit more interested in building a good roster around Burrow.

All that being said, it seems that since the cap numbers are public knowledge, the Bengals have been painted in to a corner.  They could keep Dalton but would likely have to cut Shawn Williams or a Bobby Hart.  They wouldn't have to do that until July 15th, though.  But this situation makes it all but impossible to extend Mixon before Dalton would be traded or released.  Green is already an $18 million cap hit and I just can't see him getting $20 per year unless the deal is full of incentives.

[Luvnit2]

(04-12-2020, 11:13 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Agreed.  No that Andy was the most vocal leader, he was the starting QB for pretty much every game for every player on the roster (those 3 with Finley don't count... ).  I want Burrow to be able to come in and take the leadership role right away.

While I agree with Truck that Dalton wouldn't do anything to be a distraction or a bad teammate, I think the team would be better off without him here even as a teacher.  I'm sure a lot of guys really like Dalton and they might feel bad for him losing his job to a rookie that has never taken a snap in the NFL.   They also may realize that the team seems a bit more interested in building a good roster around Burrow.

All that being said, it seems that since the cap numbers are public knowledge, the Bengals have been painted in to a corner.  They could keep Dalton but would likely have to cut Shawn Williams or a Bobby Hart.  They wouldn't have to do that until July 15th, though.  But this situation makes it all but impossible to extend Mixon before Dalton would be traded or released.  Green is already an $18 million cap hit and I just can't see him getting $20 per year unless the deal is full of incentives.

Why would anyone feel bad for AD? If they keep him, he gets paid 17.7 million dollars.

If he is cut, he won't have to sign with anyone for peanuts. He can wait and watch a QB go down and a playoff type team in dire need. He can spend a year with his wife and kids. AD does not seem like the kind of guy driven by money, so he may welcome a year off. He may also land in a broadcast booth, he speaks well and is a very smart football guy.

[*SHRacerX*]

(04-13-2020, 12:03 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Why would anyone feel bad for AD? If they keep him, he gets paid 17.7 million dollars.

If he is cut, he won't have to sign with anyone for peanuts. He can wait and watch a QB go down and a playoff type team in dire need. He can spend a year with his wife and kids. AD does not seem like the kind of guy driven by money, so he may welcome a year off. He may also land in a broadcast booth, he speaks well and is a very smart football guy.

I don't feel bad for him, financially.  But I look at a guy that took over a team that quitter quit on and everyone expects to go 0-16 and make 5 straight playoff appearances.  I will always wonder about that 2015 team, much like our 2005 team.  It isn't the money, but the lack of opportunity.  It is a VERY odd time for FA QBs.  You have two #1 OVERALL draft picks that were released with zero compensation.  You have another first rounder (Mariotta) looking for a starting gig.  It is just the perfect storm for him.

I appreciate the way the guy played, carried himself, and represented his community.  I would just like to see him get a shot somewhere else.  

I disagree about broadcasting...Andy is a bit monotone and bland in his speaking ability, but that could just be what he shows the media.  

[Luvnit2]

(04-13-2020, 01:10 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I don't feel bad for him, financially.  But I look at a guy that took over a team that quitter quit on and everyone expects to go 0-16 and make 5 straight playoff appearances.  I will always wonder about that 2015 team, much like our 2005 team.  It isn't the money, but the lack of opportunity.  It is a VERY odd time for FA QBs.  You have two #1 OVERALL draft picks that were released with zero compensation.  You have another first rounder (Mariotta) looking for a starting gig.  It is just the perfect storm for him.

I appreciate the way the guy played, carried himself, and represented his community.  I would just like to see him get a shot somewhere else.  

I disagree about broadcasting...Andy is a bit monotone and bland in his speaking ability, but that could just be what he shows the media.  

I appreciate AD as well. He became a Bengal board whipping boy, some deserved and some personal attacks absurd.

As far as cap, what will Bengals do with all of their workout bonuses? A technicality, but not one player will earn it. That is millions of dollars in cap space the team could use if they choose, or thay may pay the workout bonuses or a portion of it. Bengals have 2.7 million in workout bonuses.

[*SHRacerX*]

(04-13-2020, 01:24 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I appreciate AD as well. He became a Bengal board whipping boy, some deserved and some personal attacks absurd.

As far as cap, what will Bengals do with all of their workout bonuses? A technicality, but not one player will earn it. That is millions of dollars in cap space the team could use if they choose, or thay may pay the workout bonuses or a portion of it. Bengals have 2.7 million in workout bonuses.

No idea if there is insurance for such a thing, but I don't see how they can't pay them the workout bonuses.