Joe Mixon May Hold Out

[*Synric*]

This is a decent running back class in 2020 that could possibly be pushed down by a heavy WR class.

[BFritz21]

I get people saying that running backs aren't as valuable anymore but I think Mixon needs to be paid and I definitely think he needs to be paid now before he busts out and has a monster year where he's demanding even more money.

A good running game, even in today's NFL, is a quarterback's best friend, and that's especially true for a rookie qb. Mixon will take so much pressure off of Burrow, both mentally by making plays and not requiring him to carry the team and in his play by making teams respect the run.

Personally, I'd pay him while we still can get him relatively cheap because I believe that he's one of the best backs in the league and I can't wait to see him with Burrow.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-15-2020, 08:16 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: I get people saying that running backs aren't as valuable anymore but I think Mixon needs to be paid and I definitely think he needs to be paid now before he busts out and has a monster year where he's demanding even more money.

A good running game, even in today's NFL, is a quarterback's best friend, and that's especially true for a rookie qb.  Mixon will take so much pressure off of Burrow, both mentally by making plays and not requiring him to carry the team and in his play by making teams respect the run.  

Personally, I'd pay him while we still can get him relatively cheap because I believe that he's one of the best backs in the league and I can't wait to see him with Burrow.

Cannot disagree with any of this Brad. Just don't want Mixon to hold out.

Cause you are right, he could blow up the league with Burrow and the O-line improving...

[Whatever]

(04-15-2020, 02:56 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: He’s making $1.2 mil this year and would get $12.5-13 mil next year on the franchise tag? Worst case scenario we/he should be able to add those two numbers up and divide by two on a one year extension to keep him playing. He doesn’t have much leverage past that. This would give him more money today so that’s reason enough to sign. If he sits out he loses value

That would be reasonable, but the issue is both RB's and their agents want to drive their market value up by holding out into the regular season.  I wouldn't see him going for it, plus we'd be in the same boat next year.  Sad to say it, but he has some leverage from the standpoint that we're bringing in a rookie QB and don't have a bell cow behind him.  

I like Joe and understand he wants to get paid, but I also understand paying him long term isn't good for the club.  

[Benton]

Kind of torn.

Wasn't a fan of the pick when we made it (wasn't what I thought we needed), but mixon has performed well. He deserves to get paid more but probably not as much as he thinks he deserves.

I guess if it's front loaded or team friendly, then go for it. But it's tough to justify paying runingbacks like the old days when there's a trend of them getting paid and then going downhill.

[Bengalstripes9]

(04-15-2020, 08:00 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Love Mixon but even a very good that could become great RB like Mixon is not as valuable as they used to be.

We saw that with the 49ers last season with their late round and UDFA's playing so well.

Get the O-line dominant is more important than the RB. Mixon needs to take a team friendly deal with Burrow coming in
or our other RB's will be reaping the fruits down the road. Burrow targets the RB's a lot and this is something Mixon has 
not seen nearly enough of here.

The 49ers have an amazing offensive line and blocking tight ends. We aren't there yet. The 9ers can pretty much put anyone back there.

If we sign Mixon for 4 years, in 3 years hopefully we developed a legit line so he's easier to replace. In 3-4 years we can't afford to pay a back that much because Burrow needs a long-term deal. We can afford to spend the money now, though.

Mixon doesn't have the past injury concerns other backs have had. He's built well for the position. I don't think his injury risk is that high--especially considering we have other backs capable of lightening the load. He's a very valuable player for what he can to in the run and pass game. His vision. His athleticism. His skill. 

I want to see us dole out the money to retain him for 4 years. Draft his replacement in 3 years. If we pay him now before he really breaks out, we will save money that way. If he can run for 1000 behind a crappy offensive line, he can do a lot more once our line develops and we have a passing game to complement him. Invest in him now.

Anyway, that's my take.

[PikesPeakUC]

It really has hit the point where I see the contracts the top end backs get and think "That's a bad deal already." It seems like the long extensions are really hurting teams because they're sitting in the same spot we are, saying that our guy is special and he definitely won't be like the others. Unfortunately, most of these extensions ending up being the same and devolve into an albatross.

Yes, Mixon has played above his contract, but that's the value of the draft and getting talented players in. Eventually you have to make some hard decisions on who you give money to because you can't pay everyone, especially if you want to supplement and build up the offense or defense down the line. I think we're arguing two different sides, but the truth is somewhere in the middle. If Mixon comes back on an affordable contract, that's great! But the threat of a holdout isn't going to help anyone and the last two to do it in Gordon and Bell didn't end up any happier because of it. Gordon got usurped by Austin Ekeler's breakout and Bell had James Conner take his shine.

A Mixon holdout is going to give opportunities to Rodney Anderson and Trayveon Williams, both of whom were held in high regard, but fell for various reasons last year. Anderson, who fell because of injury history, has a chance to make some waves because he's shown the skills to be able to catch the ball out of the backfield. Williams also showed the capability to catch the ball out of the backfield in college.

I would hope that Mixon looks at the market, and then at the possibility that with Burrow in town, there's a chance that the gameplan changes and they move in a different direction without him. If the team succeeds, then both sides will have some interesting choices to make.

I also wonder if Taylor, seeing the struggles of the Gurley contract in Los Angeles front and center will influence the decision to sign a back long term, but who knows.

[Destro]

At least he is not asking to be traded/released.

[*bengalfan74*]

Everybody keeps talking the running game/RB's aren't what they used to be and I'm not disputing that.

But I've seen this play out more often than not in my 45+ years of watching the Bengals/NFL football. September, October, early November in the warm weather part of the season there's high flying aerial passing acrobatics and many teams do well with just an average running game and some not much at all.

However, when you get into the last 1/4 of the season and the playoffs things start changing. Your opponents have more film on you, the weather turns colder, the football gets harder, the wear and tear of the season starts showing. That's when having a top notch running game starts paying off.

Add in having a rookie QB and we need a quality running game. Cut Dalton and pay the man a decent amount. I'm not saying 16 million.

[BFritz21]

(04-15-2020, 08:19 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Cannot disagree with any of this Brad. Just don't want Mixon to hold out.

Cause you are right, he could blow up the league with Burrow and the O-line improving...

Great point and I didn't even consider the improvement of the offensive line.  

That makes it even more likely that he'll blow up and be more expensive next year.

We need to pay him now because he's still hungry and feels like he has something to prove, which some people might say "then he'll lose that the he gets paid," but, given his personality, I think getting paid will only make him work harder and he'll now be focused on becoming the best in the league instead of worrying about his contract. 

[SladeX]

(04-15-2020, 09:00 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Everybody keeps talking the running game/RB's aren't what they used to be and I'm not disputing that.

But I've seen this play out more often than not in my 45+ years of watching the Bengals/NFL football. September, October, early November in the warm weather part of the season there's high flying aerial passing acrobatics and many teams do well with just an average running game and some not much at all.

However, when you get into the last 1/4 of the season and the playoffs things start changing. Your opponents have more film on you, the weather turns colder, the football gets harder, the wear and tear of the season starts showing. That's when having a top notch running game starts paying off.

Add in having a rookie QB and we need a quality running game. Cut Dalton and pay the man a decent amount. I'm not saying 16 million.

I agree with this.
I wish he hadn't threatened holdout from the outset, at least not publicly. Not good...

[*Nately120*]

(04-15-2020, 09:05 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Great point and I didn't even consider the improvement of the offensive line.  

That makes it even more likely that he'll blow up and be more expensive next year.

We need to pay him now because he's still hungry and feels like he has something to prove, which some people might say "then he'll lose that the he gets paid," but, given his personality, I think getting paid will only make him work harder and he'll now be focused on becoming the best in the league instead of worrying about his contract. 

Given his personality I never would have thought he'd hold out.

[McC]

(04-15-2020, 05:53 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: He's young enough that it would be safe to extend him, but not at the price of McCaffrey, Elliot, Bell, Gurley, etc.

That's the true evil of that contract.  Whether they are worth it or not, RBs will all be thinking well hell, I gotta be worth at least ten.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-15-2020, 08:44 PM)Bengalstripes18 Wrote: The 49ers have an amazing offensive line and blocking tight ends. We aren't there yet. The 9ers can pretty much put anyone back there.

If we sign Mixon for 4 years, in 3 years hopefully we developed a legit line so he's easier to replace. In 3-4 years we can't afford to pay a back that much because Burrow needs a long-term deal. We can afford to spend the money now, though.

Mixon doesn't have the past injury concerns other backs have had. He's built well for the position. I don't think his injury risk is that high--especially considering we have other backs capable of lightening the load. He's a very valuable player for what he can to in the run and pass game. His vision. His athleticism. His skill. 

I want to see us dole out the money to retain him for 4 years. Draft his replacement in 3 years. If we pay him now before he really breaks out, we will save money that way. If he can run for 1000 behind a crappy offensive line, he can do a lot more once our line develops and we have a passing game to complement him. Invest in him now.

Anyway, that's my take.

I like your take Bengalstripes18 as usual. Just don't want to break the bank on him and don't want him holding out.

No one does. Mixon is special, always thought so even before we drafted him. Want him here but at the right price.

Mixon needs to look at his numbers, namely TD's from last year and go "I can do much better especially with Burrow here."

I don't think he will regret it if he does this.

[Benton]

(04-15-2020, 09:24 PM)McC Wrote: That's the true evil of that contract.  Whether they are worth it or not, RBs will all be thinking well hell, I gotta be worth at least ten.

The new structure is great, but puts rbs especially at a disadvantage. Their careers are typically shorter. QBs and lbs tend to get better with time and aren't worth big contracts early. Even more so for linemen . And they can have 10+ year careers. Running backs may only get one real contract before they peak or get injured and have to slow down.

[McC]

(04-15-2020, 09:37 PM)Benton Wrote: The new structure is great, but puts rbs especially at a disadvantage. Their careers are typically shorter. QBs and lbs tend to get better with time and aren't worth big contracts early. Even more so for linemen . And they can have 10+ year careers. Running backs may only get one real contract before they peak or get injured and have to slow down.

And since most RBs are drafted after the first round, by the time their four year rookie deal is up, teams are looking at putting them out to pasture.

Play four years, franchise, franchise, see ya.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-15-2020, 04:45 PM)BURROWorBUST Wrote: In all fairness, neither is Joe. 

McCaffrey: 2018 2nd Team All-Pro, 2019 1st Team All-Pro, 2019 Pro Bowler
Mixon:

McCaffrey is like putting Wes Welker's pass catching on top of a Top-3 RB. He has 303 catches in 3 years, on top of his rushing duties. He'd have an even more absurd career so far if he didn't have Newton pulling away rushing yards and TDs. It's not a coincidence that the year Newton is out, McCaffrey has the best year of his career so far including more than doubling his rushing TD total from the previous year.

Almost put up a 1400/1000 season, and held up for over 400 touches in 2019. Hasn't missed a game in his career.

McCaffrey is one of the few RBs I wouldn't mind paying because even if he loses a step as a RB, you know he can still be converted into a 100+ catch possession WR.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(04-15-2020, 09:47 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: McCaffrey: 2018 2nd Team All-Pro, 2019 1st Team All-Pro, 2019 Pro Bowler
Mixon:

McCaffrey is like putting Wes Welker's pass catching on top of a Top-3 RB. He has 303 catches in 3 years, on top of his rushing duties. He'd have an even more absurd career so far if he didn't have Newton pulling away rushing yards and TDs. It's not a coincidence that the year Newton is out, McCaffrey has the best year of his career so far including more than doubling his rushing TD total from the previous year.

Almost put up a 1400/1000 season, and held up for over 400 touches in 2019. Hasn't missed a game in his career.

McCaffrey is one of the few RBs I wouldn't mind paying because even if he loses a step as a RB, you know he can still be converted into a 100+ catch possession WR.

Damn coaches never use Mixon like McCaffrey, drives me nuts.  

Mixon has great hands too BTW and is great after the catch.

[BengalFanInNJ]

Unless he wants huge money like McCaffrey, I think they need to keep him. He's the stud on our offense and is a proven threat. Why take the risk at trying to find another RB who may fail just to save a few bucks? He's young still, so a 5-year contract is not terrible. He will still be under 30 when it expires. Let's not forget, he's had a crappy offensive line blocking for him his whole career and played most of his career without AJ Green taking the focus off of him.

This team gets weaker the second Mixon leaves.

[NATI BENGALS]

Back in the old days when RBs went high Jonathan Taylor would have been a top 5 pick. We can probably get him at 33.

Don’t be a pain in the ass and get replaced Mixon.

Having said that. An extension would have to be team friendly. We bit the bullet and drafted the guy with video of his giant red flag. And we would be paying him a year early. I would gladly give him a team friendly fair extension.