TJ on John Ross: 'They took his confidence'

[Destro]

If they took his confidence, just wait until a trash talking DB makes him take his jersey off and run into the stands. Was years ago, he still got back on the field and had drops, quit on a route. Those were on him. Maybe he is starting to find he isn't as good at this as he thought. Not built for the NFL.

[*SHRacerX*]

(04-18-2020, 04:19 PM)JerseyDD09 Wrote: That's an absolutely false statement. 2 years ago, Ross made a catch in the end zone against the tightest coverage of the year said by ESPN. It had the lowest % of catch probability all year in the league, and Ross made the catch against Baltimore. 

And then against Seattle, he's the one who caught yet another under thrown ball by Dalton. The 2 Seattle defenders misjudged it, but not Ross. 

Go back 2 years ago and see how many balls Dalton and Driskel under threw Ross on bombs where he was 2-3 steps ahead of the defenders and gave him no chance for the catch. He should've had at least 4 more TDs that year if the Bengals had competent QBs who could throw deep balls. 

Honestly, he needs to go to a team like Seattle and Russell Wilson, best deep ball thrower in the league. It would be a fresh new start for Ross and you'd see how a real deep ball is thrown for TD's. 

I wish the Bengals would just trade him for whatever pick or player they could get for him and move on. 

Liked everything here until the last line....Why sell a stock at its lowest value?  

[SunsetBengal]

They took his confidence?

Antonio Brown on Vontaze Burfict: "He took my innocence"

[*SHRacerX*]

(04-18-2020, 05:33 PM)Destro Wrote: I didn't put a crown on AJs head. Never excused anything about him. He has been out for 24 games in a row and who has stepped up when the #1 receiver was down? It was there for the taking.

Receivers are impacted by poor line play as much as a QB

[*SHRacerX*]

(04-18-2020, 08:00 PM)impactplaya Wrote: John Ross has like 4 rushing attempts in his career 
Various OCs and HCs 3 years in still have no idea how to get the ball in his hands 
When you send a WR in motion , it gets the eyes of the defense 
To follow him. 
He's ideal for jet sweeps jet motion etc 
If Tyreek Hill was a Bengal he wouldn't be used proper here either 

To be fair (and the Ross haters, sharpen your pens for the counterattack), Ross was not what Marvin wanted at all.  Marvin wanted Reuben Foster.  He didn't want a speedy WR with some injury history.  He simply doesn't fit Marvin's mold.  Say what you will about how Ross prepared and didn't stay healthy, but everything from the benching after his fumble to the "healthy scratch" video showed there was a contentious relationship there. 

I loved Marvin for what he did here, but was well over him as too conservative and predictable for our future.  Enter Zac Taylor.  A new chance for a guy like Ross.  However, it took the Bengals so long to assemble his staff and put together their game plan....only to see it go to crap when their LT goes down and their LG retires.  Then, for good measure, AJ Green never plays a snap.

Let's give the coaches, the new QB, and the entire team this year before we make up our mind on them....especially a guy like Ross. 

Sure, you can say "HE'S HAD SO MANY CHANCES" and other rants...that is fine.  I am giving the guy this year.  I still believe he is an amazing talent.

[Destro]

(04-19-2020, 09:36 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Receivers are impacted by poor line play as much as a QB

OK, but what does this have to do with my post about someone stepping up into the #1 WR spot?

[*SHRacerX*]

(04-19-2020, 10:14 AM)Destro Wrote: OK, but what does this have to do with my post about someone stepping up into the #1 WR spot?

You wanted Ross to (or insinuated that he did not) "step up" in light of Green's injury.  I explained that the WRs are impacted every bit as much as the QB by poor line play as the QB can't hold the ball and let routes develop (number one problem with our offense last year).  Ross started off really well, against some good defenses, but the Bengal's line struggled as teams adapted and everyone on the offense suffered for it. 

Dalton had his absolute worst year as a pro.  You think he really is that bad or his line play was that awful?  If Dalton couldn't overcome the line, how was Ross supposed to do it?  Help the offensive line block?

[*bengalfan74*]

(04-19-2020, 09:48 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: To be fair (and the Ross haters, sharpen your pens for the counterattack), Ross was not what Marvin wanted at all.  Marvin wanted Reuben Foster.  He didn't want a speedy WR with some injury history.  He simply doesn't fit Marvin's mold.  Say what you will about how Ross prepared and didn't stay healthy, but everything from the benching after his fumble to the "healthy scratch" video showed there was a contentious relationship there. 

I loved Marvin for what he did here, but was well over him as too conservative and predictable for our future.  Enter Zac Taylor.  A new chance for a guy like Ross.  However, it took the Bengals so long to assemble his staff and put together their game plan....only to see it go to crap when their LT goes down and their LG retires.  Then, for good measure, AJ Green never plays a snap.

Let's give the coaches, the new QB, and the entire team this year before we make up our mind on them....especially a guy like Ross. 

Sure, you can say "HE'S HAD SO MANY CHANCES" and other rants...that is fine.  I am giving the guy this year.  I still believe he is an amazing talent.

Agree,

I don't think ML ever had any interest in featuring Ross in the offense. I believe JR was force fed to ML and he resented it. Perhaps Ross was a Duke pick ? a brain trust pick ? A MB pick ? Maybe that pick was the opening crack in the parting of ML and MB ?

I'll be honest, I'm not filled with optimism that Ross is gonna stay consistent enough to ever be a #1 or even a #2. However, I'm willing to see what he can do with Burrow/new offense/better use.

[Gamma Ray Tan]

To this point, Ross is a bust. For a #9 overall pick they took before Patrick Mahomes was taken .....yes he is most definitely a bust. It doesn’t mean that he can’t still produce some decent seasons in his career, but for where he was drafted....... he is not where you would expect him to be. If he were a 3-4 rd pick..the “Bust” label wouldn’t really apply. You expect 1st round players to have a significant impact and Ross just hasn’t to this point. I’m more concerned with..Ross (Bust), Ced (Bust), Price (Bust), Williams (TBD)......this is what needs to change...NOW.

[fredtoast]

Ross was not ready to play. The reason he was used on a reverse is probably because he did not know the routes.

Marvin has a long history of starting rookies when they are ready. All this talk of Marvin being petty and refusing to play Ross because he was "forced on him" is just make believe pretend BS made up out of thin air.

Ross just was not ready to play. Marvin was desperate to win and would have played anyone who could have helped.

[Destro]

(04-19-2020, 10:31 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: You wanted Ross to (or insinuated that he did not) "step up" in light of Green's injury.  I explained that the WRs are impacted every bit as much as the QB by poor line play as the QB can't hold the ball and let routes develop (number one problem with our offense last year).  Ross started off really well, against some good defenses, but the Bengal's line struggled as teams adapted and everyone on the offense suffered for it. 

Dalton had his absolute worst year as a pro.  You think he really is that bad or his line play was that awful?  If Dalton couldn't overcome the line, how was Ross supposed to do it?  Help the offensive line block?

Didn't say being #1 WR in the NFL or anything. No matter how bad the QB or line is, the TEAM will still have a #1 WR and #2, #3, #4. AJ was number one receiver with Dalton and with the O-line. Green went out. No comparing Ross to Tyreek Hill or Davante Adams, who are on different teams. Every Bengal receiver played with the same line and QB. Ross did not become the #1 WR in the 2019 season. Doesn't matter if the Bengals were the #32 offense in the league, they would still have their #1 pass catcher and he was not that. The mention of the QB position or O-line is a cop out. It is the same one every other player on the field dealt with. Ross is supposed to do just as well as the others. 

[SunsetBengal]

(04-19-2020, 09:36 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Receivers are impacted by poor line play as much as a QB

Agreed, just as RBs are impacted by poor WR blocking the same as poor line play. 

[TSwigZ]

This is Deja vu bc I’m pretty sure I heard the confidence excuse a year ago too

[impactplaya]

(04-19-2020, 10:46 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Ross was not ready to play.  The reason he was used on a  reverse is probably because he did not know the routes.

Marvin has a long history of starting rookies when they are ready.  All this talk of Marvin being petty and refusing to play Ross because he was "forced on him" is just make believe pretend BS made up out of thin air.

Ross just was not ready to play.  Marvin was desperate to win and would have played anyone who could have helped.

Hardy Nickerson wasnt ready to play.yet he got snaps
Jordan Willis wasn't ready either. 
I just don't think ML really took to him for whatever 
Reason.
As far as we know Ross never missed meetings 
He was a exceptional teammate 
A player with his talents doesn't get better watching 
Wearing a hoodie from the sidelines 

[J24]

(04-19-2020, 02:12 PM)impactplaya Wrote: Hardy Nickerson wasnt ready to play.yet he got snaps
Jordan Willis wasn't ready either. 
I just don't think ML really took to him for whatever 
Reason.
As far as we know Ross never missed meetings 
He was a exceptional teammate 
A player with his talents doesn't get better watching 
Wearing a hoodie from the sidelines 

He missed all of OTAs and half of training camp his rookie season. + He got injured in the final preseason game against the colts that year.  So I get why it was hard for Ross to get ready to play during his rookie season and I get why Marvin didn't play him. Maybe Marvin could have been more creative with him and packaged some reverses and screens for him but other than that Ross wasn't ready to play.
I like what he has done though when he has played. With him being a 3rd or 4th receiving option were in a good spot at WR this season.

[samhain]

Wasn't he hurt or at least not fully recovered from an injury? They can't just run a guy out there to get snaps if he's hurt all the time.

[*Nately120*]

If Ross doesn't look good in 2020 are we going to blame ZT or Burrow?

[Nicomo Cosca]

(04-19-2020, 07:35 PM)Nately120 Wrote: If Ross doesn't look good in 2020 are we going to blame ZT or Burrow?

Just stop. If Ross still sucks even with Burrow he’s clearly a lost cause.

[*Nately120*]

(04-19-2020, 07:39 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Just stop. If Ross still sucks even with Burrow he’s clearly a lost cause.

So if Ross doesn't look good in 2020 we are finally sure he just flat-out sucks?  You sure we aren't going to need an OC who knows how to use him or something?

[*bengalfan74*]

(04-19-2020, 10:46 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Ross was not ready to play.  The reason he was used on a  reverse is probably because he did not know the routes.

Marvin has a long history of starting rookies when they are ready.  All this talk of Marvin being petty and refusing to play Ross because he was "forced on him" is just make believe pretend BS made up out of thin air.

Ross just was not ready to play.  Marvin was desperate to win and would have played anyone who could have helped.

The instances of people/bosses/Military officers etc. putting personal feelings about another in front of what's good for the group, team, business would fill volumes. 

Would you like me to provide the first 10,000 examples ?