Turner on the O-line

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-15-2020, 03:12 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Didn't I read in an earlier thread that Burrow had the 2nd or 3rd most time before facing pressure in CFB last year?

I mean LSU had 2 OL get drafted in the 3rd, 1 in the 4th round, and another 2 get signed as UDFA.

A lot of that had to do with Burrow's ability to extend plays.

Not saying LSU was not a good O-line, they were very good, just not as good in pass protection as in run blocking.

[fredtoast]

(05-14-2020, 12:48 PM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: My prediction is that this oline is going to cost Turner his job.

(05-14-2020, 02:55 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If he can get them to buy into what he is wanting to accomplish, they could also make his career noteworthy for the right reasons..

(05-14-2020, 07:00 PM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: Its basically make or break I think. This is his hand picked line, if he cant make them into a competent line then he needs to be shit canned. 

I probably complained more about the turner hiring than any other coach, but so far he is the ONLY coach on this new staff who has shown he is capable of fixing anything.  The difference between our run blocking before and after the bye week is like night and day.

And anyone who wants to talk about the "easier schedule" the second half of the season explain to me what happened in the first half of the season when we faced the Seahawks rush defense that ranked 22nd in yards and 28th in yards per carry (34 rush yds, 2.4 avg) or Jacksonville's that ranked 28th in yards and 31st in yards per carry (33 yds, 1.7 avg).

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-15-2020, 04:00 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I probably complained more about the turner hiring than any other coach, but so far he is the ONLY coach on this new staff who has shown he is capable of fixing anything.  The difference between our run blocking before and after the bye week is like night and day.

And anyone who wants to talk about the "easier schedule" the second half of the season explain to me what happened in the first half of the season when we faced the Seahawks rush defense that ranked 22nd in yards and 28th in yards per carry (34 rush yds, 2.4 avg) or Jacksonville's that ranked 28th in yards and 31st in yards per carry (33 yds, 1.7 avg).

Really good points Fred. Actually have a little hope with Turner as he adjusted the scheme and his guys improved big time.

Taylor, Lou and the other coaches really need to step up their game.

[Whodey614]

I still feel that we need at least one upgrade made on the line. Jonah might be that but he'll basically be a rookie at the end of the day so growing pains are expected. You can sell me on MJ's growth at left guard, you can even sell me on Bobby Hart not being the worst RT in the league anymore. I don't think I can be sold on XSF or Price at RG unless Johnson enters that race which he possibly could. That's where Warford comes in. Great run blocker and you help Hopkins out immensely. You instantly feel good about the OL going into the season and there's still the chance Johnson can win RT if Hart is still the same. We have the cap space to do it. Might have to make a cut but it's worth it to fill a crucial hole on the line. Willie Anderson himself has recently said you can't win if you don't have guards that can do their job. I know people will bring up his pressures but honestly I recall that Saints OL always getting blown up in crucial situations, it wasn't just him. His release was purely a cost thing and I think we should take advantage of that.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-15-2020, 04:11 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Really good points Fred. Actually have a little hope with Turner as he adjusted the scheme and his guys improved big time.

Taylor, Lou and the other coaches really need to step up their game.

Hidden behind the ugly specter of "bullygate", Turner was actually putting together a solid, aggressive OL in Miami.  As long as he keeps things on an even keel, our OL could actually be a pleasant surprise this season.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-15-2020, 07:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Hidden behind the ugly specter of "bullygate", Turner was actually putting together a solid, aggressive OL in Miami.  As long as he keeps things on an even keel, our OL could actually be a pleasant surprise this season.

I feel the same and to bring that OL together as the year went on with UDFA's like Hopkins and working with rookies like MJ
gives me even more of that feeling. Sure will be nice to see how Jonah plays and another year for our other guys under him.

I remember that Phin OL back in the day and was wanting our OL to look more like that before that bullygate stuff.

[yellowxdiscipline]

(05-15-2020, 04:00 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I probably complained more about the turner hiring than any other coach, but so far he is the ONLY coach on this new staff who has shown he is capable of fixing anything.  The difference between our run blocking before and after the bye week is like night and day.

And anyone who wants to talk about the "easier schedule" the second half of the season explain to me what happened in the first half of the season when we faced the Seahawks rush defense that ranked 22nd in yards and 28th in yards per carry (34 rush yds, 2.4 avg) or Jacksonville's that ranked 28th in yards and 31st in yards per carry (33 yds, 1.7 avg).

I was never impressed with his hiring. Im giving him this season to put together a decent line, if not then he needs to go. He seems pretty confident that we don't need any outside talent, and he can fix it with what we have already. I have my doubts. 

[fredtoast]

(05-16-2020, 09:15 AM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: I was never impressed with his hiring. Im giving him this season to put together a decent line, if not then he needs to go. He seems pretty confident that we don't need any outside talent, and he can fix it with what we have already. I have my doubts. 

That is what every coach HAS TO SAY when he does not get any help.  he has to get by with what he has and he can't get the most out of players when he is telling the media they are hopeless.  The surest way to get players to fail is to tell them they can't succeed.


Does your oone year limit on success appply to the rest of the coaching staff as well?

Like I said, I complained more about hiring Turner than any other assistant coach, but I also judge coaches on how they perform instead of my original impression.  The turn around in our run game was almost miraculous,  From possibly worst in tem history the first half, to top 10 in the league second half.  Turner has to get a lot of credit for that.  It may not have been his call to change the blocking scheme, but he is the one who coached the players to do it.

[yellowxdiscipline]

(05-16-2020, 10:24 AM)fredtoast Wrote: That is what every coach HAS TO SAY when he does not get any help.  he has to get by with what he has and he can't get the most out of players when he is telling the media they are hopeless.  The surest way to get players to fail is to tell them they can't succeed.


Does your oone year limit on success appply to the rest of the coaching staff as well?

Like I said, I complained more about hiring Turner than any other assistant coach, but I also judge coaches on how they perform instead of my original impression.  The turn around in our run game was almost miraculous,  From possibly worst in tem history the first half, to top 10 in the league second half.  Turner has to get a lot of credit for that.  It may not have been his call to change the blocking scheme, but he is the one who coached the players to do it.

Just Turner, because I already hated the hiring to begin with. So technically he's getting two years. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

Just read an interview with Turner on The Athletic, and a few points I found interesting; he was not big on Alex Redmond when he first arrived here, he said even though Hart is probably the most scrutinized player on the OL its undeniable that he improved his game last season by cutting his sacks and penalties way down and that he had a “good year”, it also sounds like Adeniji really won him over with his character at the senior bowl (he mentioned how much the kid seems to love football) and that he seemed very genuine and didn’t give rehearsed type answers. Turner said last season was probably the most challenging of his career, but he liked how well it ended with the improved running game. And he thinks they’re moving in the right direction.

This was probably my favorite quote though:

I think this group understands that we will bench you. We will sit you down if the guy behind you is better than you. It’s not a big tough guy act or anything. It’s real. We will play the best five guys. And I think we’ve proven that since we’ve been here. They’re going to compete at every position.

I have to admit, Turner is kind of growing on me.

[Bengal Dude]

(05-14-2020, 12:48 PM)yellowxdiscipline Wrote: My prediction is that this oline is going to cost Turner his job.

In my opinion, Turner is here as long as Zac is here. They have a history together and Zac seems to lean on him a lot. If the OL continues to struggle, then I expect the FO would have to step in and force Zac to get rid of Turner.

[Sled21]

(05-19-2020, 12:58 AM)Bengal Dude Wrote: In my opinion, Turner is here as long as Zac is here. They have a history together and Zac seems to lean on him a lot. If the OL continues to struggle, then I expect the FO would have to step in and force Zac to get rid of Turner.

Turner had the only unit to improve during the season last year. I liked it when we hired him, I like it now.

[corpjet]

(05-13-2020, 03:27 PM)fredtoast Wrote: 1.  The comments about Xavier being in great condition and playing as well in the 4th quarter as the first leads me to believe Turner had a problem with the condition of some of our O-linemen last year.

2.  No matter what we think at this time things can change.  At this time last year no one was claiming Hopkins would be our starting Center.  I like Jordan's potential as much as anyone, but I have to see him come in and play well before just giving him a starting position.  The fact that the coaching staff made adjustments last year based on how the guys played in training camp makes me feel they will give everyone a chance to win a starting spot.

Was thinking the same exact thing one or more of the big uglies was out of shape and folded late in the game.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-19-2020, 08:07 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Turner had the only unit to improve during the season last year. I liked it when we hired him, I like it now.

Like I said, he’s growing on me, but just out of curiosity, why did you like the hire right off the bat? I know you love you some Zac Taylor, but between Turner’s past, and a somewhat lackluster resume in general, he was understandably not a very popular choice.

[Sled21]

(05-19-2020, 08:49 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Like I said, he’s growing on me, but just out of curiosity, why did you like the hire right off the bat? I know you love you some Zac Taylor, but between Turner’s past, and a somewhat lackluster resume in general, he was understandably not a very popular choice.

I liked it for the same reason a lot of people evidently didn't like it. They seem to want a big mean nasty offensive line that will just pummel and bully the opposing D-line, but then cringe at the fact Taylor brought in a big mean offensive line coach who's players were bullies. That makes no sense to me...… the coach sets the tone. We already had a concert pianist coaching the line, now I want someone nastier, who will get the most out of our players or bench them. That's Turner to a tee.... I thought Pollack would be that guy as well, turns out he wasn't.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-19-2020, 10:39 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I liked it for the same reason a lot of people evidently didn't like it. They seem to want a big mean nasty offensive line that will just pummel and bully the opposing D-line, but then cringe at the fact Taylor brought in a big mean offensive line coach who's players were bullies. That makes no sense to me...… the coach sets the tone. We already had a concert pianist coaching the line, now I want someone nastier, who will get the most out of our players or bench them. That's Turner to a tee.... I thought Pollack would be that guy as well, turns out he wasn't.

I guess, like yourself, I was one to say "let's give this guy a chance based on what he can do as a football coach", rather than simply passing judgement based on non X's and O's things.  I've made some mistakes, done some things that I'm not proud of in my lifetime.  Doesn't make me a bad person or employee, so I'm typically in favor of allowing people to live past their mistakes.

[*bengalfan74*]

(05-19-2020, 10:44 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I guess, like yourself, I was one to say "let's give this guy a chance based on what he can do as a football coach", rather than simply passing judgement based on non X's and O's things.  I've made some mistakes, done some things that I'm not proud of in my lifetime.  Doesn't make me a bad person or employee, so I'm typically in favor of allowing people to live past their mistakes.

1,000 % agree

Context and circumstances mean everything. I wasn't there in Miami and I won't simply pass judgement on somebody on what was "said".

Words can be easily twisted into what someone's agenda wants them to be. And I'm not trying to say Turner wasn't in any way guilty. Just be careful putting people into this category or that based off one incident. We've all said stuff in the moment that doesn't "define us"

[SunsetBengal]

(05-19-2020, 10:59 AM)bengalfan74 Wrote: 1,000 % agree

Context and circumstances mean everything. I wasn't there in Miami and I won't simply pass judgement on somebody on what was "said".

Words can be easily twisted into what someone's agenda wants them to be. And I'm not trying to say Turner wasn't in any way guilty. Just be careful putting people into this category or that based off one incident. We've all said stuff in the moment that doesn't "define us"

As I remember from around the time of his hiring, there was also an incident involving some sexist attitudes and remarks while he was at Texas A&M.  But, my opinion remains unchanged.  If he can coach up the OL, it'll be worth having him here, I care less about his personal thoughts and opinions.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(05-19-2020, 10:39 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I liked it for the same reason a lot of people evidently didn't like it. They seem to want a big mean nasty offensive line that will just pummel and bully the opposing D-line, but then cringe at the fact Taylor brought in a big mean offensive line coach who's players were bullies. That makes no sense to me...… the coach sets the tone. We already had a concert pianist coaching the line, now I want someone nastier, who will get the most out of our players or bench them. That's Turner to a tee.... I thought Pollack would be that guy as well, turns out he wasn't.

That’s fair.

I actually thought Pollack did a decent job here. Mixon certainly liked him.

[*bengalfan74*]

(05-19-2020, 11:03 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: As I remember from around the time of his hiring, there was also an incident involving some sexist attitudes and remarks while he was at Texas A&M.  But, my opinion remains unchanged.  If he can coach up the OL, it'll be worth having him here, I care less about his personal thoughts and opinions.

Oh for sure. If he can coach up the Oline and get them up to snuff who cares if he enjoys going out burning ants with a can of hairspray in his leisure time ?