Gotta Keep Building through FA

[NATI BENGALS]

(10-06-2020, 08:08 PM)Wire22Wire Wrote: Unrelated to topic, can someone who has been on here for a while explain why this thread I started has a 1 star next to it? Is it due to my newness?

I am trying to figure some of the site features out, like reps etc.  Thanks!

Someone being an A hole. On threads you did not start you can select 1-5 stars and rank them. Not too many people do it. Someone likes to give out 1 star when they get their feelings hurt or disagree or something. I put in a 5 star and it jumped up to a 3. 

[Wire22Wire]

(10-06-2020, 08:22 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Someone being an A hole. On threads you did not start you can select 1-5 stars and rank them. Not too many people do it. Someone likes to give out 1 star when they get their feelings hurt or disagree or something. I put in a 5 star and it jumped up to a 3. 

Lol. Thanks.

Yeah who knew saying the bengals should continue to get better via FA would be such a point of contention

Thanks for the explanation, I know who got sad and ran home, mcCc or something like that

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(10-05-2020, 08:19 PM)Wire22Wire Wrote: Next year is even more critical than this year.  The 2021 cap is projected at 175M, down nearly 33M due to revenue loss.

They have 36 players under contract next year.

Spending 198M this year on a 208 M Cap

Teams are going to struggle mightily getting under the cap

This is good for teams like the Bengals because there should be less competition for prime FAs

Teams may have to cut mid-high priced players to get under the new number


Prime Cut Candidates:

Dunlap
Gio
Uzomah
Hart

Those alone free up 25M
AJ Green saves another 18

198-43 = Get Bengals to 155

I love Dunlap but he is looking like he is falling off this year, so yeah, he could definitely be a prime cut to go along with your 
other guys especially with the way Mixon and Sample look to be coming on and in their prime. Of course move on from AJ as 
he is looking like he has lost it. We should have a lot of dough to spend once again and should concentrate on the trenches.

We should be able to replace Hart pretty easily, same with Uzomah. Get a Guard or two an elite type of TE and just keep
replacing the guys we let go, we can definitely do this. Treat the Offense like you did the Defense the last FA and give the
Joe's a great OL and some more weapons.

[schroomytunes]

Depending on the cap next year I think the Bengals are in good shape IMO. We have some big contracts coming off the books next year and some guys that will be getting paid. Here is my take on our FA's.

Losses: (big contracts)

1) AJ- 18.1 million
2) S.Williams- 4.9
3) J.Ross- 4.3
4) A.Ericson- 2

- that's @ 30 million from the guys that are over 2million

Cuts:

1) Billy Price- take the 1.6 dead space, and save @ 2.1 million

Re-sign:

1) Carl Lawson-DE
2) WJ111-CB
3) M. Alexander -CB
4) Randy Bullock-K
5) Kevin Huber-P
6) Clark Harris-LS
7) Leshaun Sims-CB

-The first 3 will command some $$$ but the rest will not cost as much

Maybe re-sign:  (if $$ is right)

1) Mike Thomas-WR
2) Brandon Wilson-KR
3) Cethan Carter-TE
4) Josh Bynes-LB
5) Josh Tupou-DT
6) Alex Redmond-G

-I let the rest of our FA's walk, and look to restock in the draft.

Draft: (needs)

1) O-line- RG/RT
2) RG/RT
3) WR
4) DT/DE
5) CB
6) TE
7) QB/ LB/ D-line

Free Agency Outside:

1) O-Line- Preferably a Guard to open up RD 2 for BPA

2) TE- get someone who can be more of a passing threat ( Cameron Brate type)

[Mike M (the other one)]

(10-06-2020, 12:35 AM)McC Wrote: Sign a RG or RT, or both, draft one or both.  Boom, line fixed in one offseason.  Multiple years?  Are you loco? 

You can finish off a team through FA but you can't build it that way.  How the **** is that not crystal clear?

Not that simple.

First we need to figure out market value of our own if we wish to keep any, then we need to see what's available in FA, then guestimate what will be the deepest positions in the draft? Last year was WR and we got a good one in round 2, LB's as well.

This year? Not sure with the wacky NCAACF season what is out there. Some might stay to get in a better year of tape for higher draft position, others come out early and barely get drafted. 

This past season was one of the worst for UDFA's. Tons of guys never even got a chance to try out.

And after the draft try to fill what ever holes we have left. 


It's not as simple as draft OL and boom done, those guys might not pan out, so need options. 

[Wire22Wire]

(10-07-2020, 08:43 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Not that simple.

First we need to figure out market value of our own if we wish to keep any, then we need to see what's available in FA, then guestimate what will be the deepest positions in the draft? Last year was WR and we got a good one in round 2, LB's as well.

This year? Not sure with the wacky NCAACF season what is out there. Some might stay to get in a better year of tape for higher draft position, others come out early and barely get drafted. 

This past season was one of the worst for UDFA's. Tons of guys never even got a chance to try out.

And after the draft try to fill what ever holes we have left. 


It's not as simple as draft OL and boom done, those guys might not pan out, so need options. 

He acts like ogbuehi, fisher and price don’t exist/havent happened.

[Geno_Can_Dunk]

I didn't read every post in this thread because I just now noticed it, but a few thoughts.

Debating the semantics of "build and supplement" versus "you do both" is pretty silly. Might be different expressions for the same thing, might not be, who knows without context.

I gotta admit, not sure why everybody is so down on Uzomah around here. Because his PFF scores aren't such and such and PFF scores are end-all and be-all? His injury was early enough in the season that he can recover by next season (didn't Leon Hall recover from like two of those?). Seems to me we'll be talking about Geno before we're talking about Uzomah.

175M is what the league and NFLPA set as the floor, so yes it's set in stone. It's not a "projection." You can bet the NFL is looking for ways to make up lost revenue, so I do think it'll be higher than that. How much, who knows.

[ah5]

Building through FA is a recipe for disaster.

Sent from my BV9600 using Tapatalk

[Wire22Wire]

(10-08-2020, 01:57 AM)ah5 Wrote: Building through FA is a recipe for disaster.

Sent from my BV9600 using Tapatalk

Thanks mike brown for stopping In

Building parts of the team through free agency doesn’t mean you forego or void your draft picks.

This is not like choosing how to get to your vacation, driving or flying.


I would also not advise tanking your draft pics intentionally because you feel you might have been too successful upgrading parts of your team via FA. Lol

[Hammerstripes]

(10-08-2020, 05:10 AM)Wire22Wire Wrote: Thanks mike brown for stopping In

Building parts of the team through free agency doesn’t mean you forego or void your draft picks.  

This is not like choosing how to get to your vacation, driving or flying.  


I would also not advise tanking your draft pics intentionally because you feel you might have been too successful upgrading parts of your team via FA.  Lol

He's right.  The teams that spend big money generally don't end up being the best teams during the season.

I  have no problem bringing in a guy to stablilize a position (RT or another interior lineman), but it's not practical to build a team through free agency.

[QueenCity]

(10-08-2020, 07:41 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: He's right.  The teams that spend big money generally don't end up being the best teams during the season.

I  have no problem bringing in a guy to stablilize a position (RT or another interior lineman), but it's not practical to build a team through free agency.

True if a player reaches Free agency in the NFL its typically b/c they are getting old and their current team doesn't trust they are worth the contract.

[Wire22Wire]

(10-08-2020, 07:41 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: He's right.  The teams that spend big money generally don't end up being the best teams during the season.

I  have no problem bringing in a guy to stablilize a position (RT or another interior lineman), but it's not practical to build a team through free agency.

Who is saying they should only build via free agency?

You goons are bengal brain washed

[Hammerstripes]

(10-08-2020, 08:51 PM)Wire22Wire Wrote: Who is saying they should only build via free agency?

You goons are bengal brain washed

The title of the thread.  

[Essex Johnson]

(10-05-2020, 09:43 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: 1.) It's 100% a yes, unless they let loyalty get in the way.  Why on Earth would pay a guy 5 mil dollars, with his history, coming off an achilies injury.  IMHO, he was an obvious cut before he got hurt.  Now it's almost unforgiveable to keep him on the books.

2.) You can definitely find an upgrade over Bobby Hart with his cap savings.  The guys is currently making about 4 times his actual worth.

Tackles are over paid, how many people were rooting to sign Peter's, now on IR.. have to draft better to fix the oline..

[Wire22Wire]

(10-08-2020, 11:51 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: The title of the thread.  

Lolol

You’re obtuse. Sorry I didn’t spell out they wouldn’t surrender all their draft picks.

[Wes Mantooth]

(10-08-2020, 11:51 PM)Hammerstripes Wrote: The title of the thread.  

I don't understand how so many of you are taking the title to mean only building through free agency.

Just because the word "build" is used does not mean it's a singular act or approach.  It doesn't mean we start neglecting the draft or not trying as hard to identify young talent.

Free agrency and the draft can all be the part of one build.  Shocking, I know.

[Wes Mantooth]

(10-08-2020, 11:52 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: how many people were rooting to sign Peter's, now on IR.. have to draft better to fix the oline..

People who wanted to go cheap, and find some ancient veteran once the better talent was all inked.

We need to fill a couple holes with high end, proven talent.  Not guys who are 40, or guys who signing 2 mil dollar deals.  We need to sign a couple guys that would start for a lot of other teams across the league.

Jason Peters is a terrible example of what OP is referring to.  That's a bargain bin, dumpster diving signing, and it is exactly what we need to get away from.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-08-2020, 11:52 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Tackles are over paid, how many people were rooting to sign Peter's, now on IR.. have to draft better to fix the oline..

Whit has been worth every penny LA spent on him.

[kevin]

(10-09-2020, 12:29 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: People who wanted to go cheap, and find some ancient veteran once the better talent was all inked.

We need to fill a couple holes with high end, proven talent.  Not guys who are 40, or guys who signing 2 mil dollar deals.  We need to sign a couple guys that would start for a lot of other teams across the league.

Jason Peters is a terrible example of what OP is referring to.  That's a bargain bin, dumpster diving signing, and it is exactly what we need to get away from.

The problem is most teams do not let go of top O Linemen.  Except the Bengals, but most teams do not.  This is why Paul Brown from Cleveland to Cincinnati was into the guys out of college.   You really don't see the best blockers going from team to team like players jumping around the NBA.  In the NFL, teams rarely part with the best blockers, so you do look more to college help.  Of course the Bengals could use a 1st Round Pick in the Defensive Front 6 also.  I say Front 6, because Zac plays 5 DBs 80 % of the time. A Real Monster on Defense would help also.  Depends who is on the board when Bengals pick, D or O Line.  8 or 6 wins would be an improvement from 2019, but should still bring a Stud to Defense or O Line. The D needs a rookie Stud, Bengals still one of worst defenses. Who was the last Bengals Front 7 taken in Round 1, it's been so long ago, and why D Front including LB's needs addressed ASAP in 2021. Any Stud at D Line or LB in draft is welcome.

[Wire22Wire]

(10-09-2020, 06:02 AM)kevin Wrote: The problem is most teams do not let go of top O Linemen.  Except the Bengals, but most teams do not.  This is why Paul Brown from Cleveland to Cincinnati was into the guys out of college.   You really don't see the best blockers going from team to team like players jumping around the NBA.  In the NFL, teams rarely part with the best blockers, so you do look more to college help.  Of course the Bengals could use a 1st Round Pick in the Defensive Front 6 also.  I say Front 6, because Zac plays 5 DBs 80 % of the time. A Real Monster on Defense would help also.  Depends who is on the board when Bengals pick, D or O Line.  8 or 6 wins would be an improvement from 2019, but should still bring a Stud to Defense or O Line.  The D needs a rookie Stud, Bengals still one of worst defenses. Who was the last Bengals Front 7 taken in Round 1, it's been so long ago, and why D Front including LB's needs addressed ASAP in 2021.  Any Stud at D Line or LB in draft is welcome.

This is Bungle Fan stockholm syndrome at it's finest.   Mike has conditioned you guys to really buy in that it's IMPOSSIBLE to better key parts of he team via high end FA (Or just good FAs).  

Last year:

Anthony Castonzo
Jack Conklin*
Bryan Bulaga*
Daryl Williams*
Grahm Glasnow*

Were all OT/G Prime Free Agents that were available, and 4 of the 5 founds new teams (*).  

I know this is a WILD thing to have to comprehend after 30 years of being a model on 'how not to run a NFL Franchise' but if the Bengals bought a premier T or G, then....hang on here cause this may shock you, they can then spend their 1st round pick on OTHER POSITIONS OF NEED. 

I know these concepts are hard to learn.  It may take a few more years for the Bengals to also learn (Then Burrow can by in NY, Chi, or LA). They made some strides las year with Reader, Waynes, Alexander, Bell....but, the OL is the biggest need on the team. Hopefully they prioritize it this FA period with Hart/AJ/Gio/Dunlap freed up cash, then draft BDPA in the top 10-15.