HOw many blown first round picks have the Bengals had over the years??

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 06:56 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: Dennard was drafted in the lower end of the first round and he produced at that level when he played. He struggled with injuries, so if you want to make that argument then that’s fine, but his production was there.

Smith was considered a top tier RT for several years there, yes. Then injuries caught up to him and he fell off. I am not going to say that he lived up to a 6th overall selection because of his position at RT, but he absolutely gave high level play there for several years. It’s unfortunate he struggled with injuries because he was very good.

How many interceptions did he have? He has 4 career picks. He was a good tackler. Not what I’m looking for in a first round corner. Again, playing solid is not what a first rounder is supposed to be. Especially when you were a unanimous all-American in college.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(10-30-2020, 05:50 PM)swilson3828 Wrote: David Klingler
Akili Smith
John Ross
Billy Price
Big Daddy Dan Wilkinson
Ki Jana Carter
David Pollack
Andre Smith
Dre Kirkpatrick
Darquez Dennard

.......and these are the only ones I can think of, but I know there have got to be others.  I know Pollack had a career ending injury, but still.....

Cincinnati is prob close to being if not being THE #1 team in the NFL in blowing first round picks

There have been a lot lately, but a lot of your list does qualify, IMHO.

As you say, Pollack got injured. So did Carter.

Smith, Dre, Wilkinson, & Denard had decent careers. Starters for a while. Though I agree Dig Daddy did not have a career commensurate with where he was picked.

Klingler & Smith got thrown to the wolves on crap teams.

Ross & Price, those are busts, looks like.

But picks bust all the time. Though a top 10 bust (Ross) certainly hurts more.

Lets look at the last 10 years:

2020: Burrow (1)
2019: J. Williams (11)
2018: Price (21) 
2017: Ross (9) 
2016: Jackson (24)
2015: Ogbuehi (21)
2014: Dennard (24)
2013: Eifert (21)
2012: Kirkpatrick (17), Zeitler (27)
2011: Green (4)

Busts: Ogbuehi, Ross, Price (some hope left)
Hits: Green, Burrow, Eifert (if healthy)
Meh/OK: WJ3, Dennard, Kirkpatrick
Too early: Williams

2/3 in the top 10. Jonah looks passable. Willing to go 3/4 for "lottery" picks (top half). Otside of AJ + healthy Eifert, not a Pro-Bowler in the bunch (too early for Williams) until Burrow.

For fun, do round 2:
2020: Higgins
2019: Sample
2018: Bates
2017: Mixon
2016: Boyd
2015: Fischer
2014: Hill
2013: Bernard, Hunt
2012: Still
2011: Dalton

Busts: Fischer, Still
Hits: Dalton, Bernard, Boyd, Mixon, Bates
Meh: Hunt, Hill (a couple good years)
Too early: Sample, Higgins

[WhodeyRay]

I am not ready to write Price off as a center yet. Really liked his play other than a few snaps in the Browns game. Lets see if he can do it again this week. It amazes me that a lot on here defended Ross for so many years and in year 3 are already giving up on Price. Yes he sucked donkey ass as a guard but hasn't played much center since his rookie year. As a linemen year 3-4 are when they usually start playing well.

[KillerGoose]

(10-30-2020, 07:15 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: How many interceptions did he have? He has 4 career picks. He was a good tackler. Not what I’m looking for in a first round corner. Again, playing solid is not what a first rounder is supposed to be. Especially when you were a unanimous all-American in college.

Interceptions aren’t the end all be all for corners. William Jackson only has 3 but I don’t think any of us are wanting to let him go. We can agree to disagree, because if we can get consistent, solid play out of a guy in the mid-20s, I am happy with that.

[Wes Mantooth]

Dan Wilkinson is an iffy candidate for a complete bust label. He was nowhere near a terrible player. He ended up having an ok career.

That said, he was an absolutely terrible pick. You have to consider his draft position when evaluating the return on investment. Going #1 overall and turning into a pretty average starter is not ideal, especially when you're going with a DT and not a QB.

He was a guy who an absolute freak on paper, that never translated into the monster indicated by his workout numbers.

And making it all the worse, the other player we would have been looking at was none of the Marshall Faulk. Instead we took Big Daddy, and went the RB route the very next year. That pick? Kijani Carter. (Ooof!)

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

Agree that you have to take position into account. Guys taken in the 20s are going to be higher risk.

I would certainly not call the guys who had injury problems busts (Pollack, Carter, Eifert, Warrick).

Wasn't Carter's first carry like an 80 yd TD? Or am I misremembering?

And WE killed Warrick's career. Rushed him back when the knee was not healthy. Never the same again.

[Wes Mantooth]

(10-30-2020, 05:53 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: The bolds are false.

ESPECIALLY Wilkinson.

Always laugh when you chime in on old Bengals.  Big Daddy, Willie Anderson, etc.  You never even saw these guys play.

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 07:25 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: Interceptions aren’t the end all be all for corners. William Jackson only has 3 but I don’t think any of us are wanting to let him go. We can agree to disagree, because if we can get consistent, solid play out of a guy in the mid-20s, I am happy with that.

The big difference there, is you can put Jackson on a teams best WR and it takes home out of the game. You could never do that with Dennard. And I would be ok moving on from Jackson if he’s looking for too much money. He gets hurt too much.

[Yojimbo]

(10-30-2020, 07:33 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Agree that you have to take position into account. Guys taken in the 20s are going to be higher risk.

I would certainly not call the guys who had injury problems busts (Pollack, Carter, Eifert, Warrick).

Wasn't Carter's first carry like an 80 yd TD? Or am I misremembering?

And WE killed Warrick's career. Rushed him back when the knee was not healthy. Never the same again.

I LOVED Peter Warrick, he’s my all time favorite college player, but he never lived up to be the #4 pick even before his knee injury. Turned into a decent punt returner for a bit.

[SunsetBengal]

(10-30-2020, 07:15 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: 2020: Burrow (1)
2019: J. Williams (11)
2018: Price (21) 
2017: Ross (9) 
2016: Jackson (24)
2015: Ogbuehi (21)
2014: Dennard (24)
2013: Eifert (21)
2012: Kirkpatrick (17), Zeitler (27)
2011: Green (4)

Busts: Ogbuehi, Ross, Price (some hope left)
Hits: Green, Burrow, Eifert (if healthy)
Meh/OK: WJ3, Dennard, Kirkpatrick
Too early: Williams

You seem to have left Zeitler off of the "hit" list.  He most definitely was a draft hit, and went on to garner a top level contract in free agency.

The rest of your post, even the parts I chose not to quote, I agree with completely.  Well done.

[BurnsBengal]

How is Keith Rivers getting a pass here? Top 9 pick and best remembered for getting cheap shotted by Hines Ward. The fact no one remembers him is a pretty good metaphor for his career here: forgettable.

How about David Verser? ?

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(10-30-2020, 06:00 PM)MasonDT70 Wrote: I'd also add that pollack wasn't really a blown pick. Had a career ending injury.

Neither was Carter....shredded his knee.

[SunsetBengal]

(10-30-2020, 08:14 PM)BurnsBengal Wrote: How is Keith Rivers getting a pass here? Top 9 pick and best remembered for getting cheap shotted  by Hines Ward. The fact no one remembers him is a pretty good metaphor for his career here: forgettable.

How about David Verser? ?

Meh, who could ever forget the "Chuck Norris doesn't kill people, Keith Rivers does" thread from the old board?

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(10-30-2020, 07:40 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Always laugh when you chime in on old Bengals.  Big Daddy, Willie Anderson, etc.  You never even saw these guys play.

I'm amazed you actually made a post in reply to me that didn't get modded... can't believe I actually live in someone's head on the internet, hilarious.

I already told you a couple of weeks ago; I didn't watch snap after snap, but I watched enough.

Furthermore, as I wrote on the last page, feel how you want about guys, but numbers don't lie.

[BFritz21]

Am I missing something or did no one mention Chris Perry?!

The number 6 pick OVERALL and barely had over a thousand yards COMBINED rushing AND receiving over a four year career, a lot of which was spent injured?!

[BengalsFanRealist2855]

Everyone used to praise our drafting so much,and say marvin really knew how to draft. I never thought we drafted that great. And I agree our 1st round guys that have been good are far and few in between. 1st round picks that I actually liked was palmer, green ,burrow. But even with aj green we havnt won nothing,and julio jones looked like the better wide out that went to a superbowl.

[Isaac Curtis: The Real #85]

(10-30-2020, 08:11 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: You seem to have left Zeitler off of the "hit" list.  He most definitely was a draft hit, and went on to garner a top level contract in free agency.

The rest of your post, even the parts I chose not to quote, I agree with completely.  Well done.

You are 100% right. Brainfart on my part. Absolute hit.

[Murdock2420]

So, just for fun, I went and got a list of every 1st round pick since Mike took over the team in 1991 following Paul Brown's death.
The belief that we missed on a lot of first round picks actually wasn't as true until some of the more recent drafts. Yes, we had some major bust in Akili Smith but what seems much more of a trend early on was disgruntled players wanting out of Cincy and having success elsewhere and just horrible luck due to injury.



1991 - Alfred Williams 1 - time Pro Bowler
1992 - David Klingler (Considered a bust, but his talent was wasted behind terrible lines and just ruined his career)
1992 - Darryl Williams - Very solid career between Cincy and Seattle.
1993 - John Copeland - 7 years, nothing special, but did have a 9 sack season in 1995.
1994 - Dan Wilkinson - Best years came after Cincy (He also called Cincinnati a "racist" city and was upset and misused here.)
1995 - Ki-Jana Carter - (What could have been.... amazing back, lost to injury.)
1996 - Willie Anderson - 4-time Pro Bowler - Stud, should have more then 4 Pro-Bowls
1997 - Reinard Wilson - six seasons, 173 tackles and 24 quarterback sacks. Not great at all, could call this a bust pick.
1998 - Takeo Spikes - 2-time Pro Bowler - Another great player who wanted out of Cincy.
1998 - Brian Simmons - Solid, steady, heart of some bad defenses.
1999 - Akili Smith - Absolute bust.
2000 - Peter Warrick - Underwhelming. Never hit 1000 yards, which is kinda bad for a 1st round WR.
2001 - Justin Smith - 5-time Pro Bowler - Another guy who wasn't happy with how he was used and was excellent after leaving.
2002 - Levi Jones - 6 seasons on the line. Nothing great.
2003 - Carson Palmer - 2-time Pro Bowler - Football Jesus, possibly the greatest QB to ever wear stripes... till the steelers maimed him..dicks.
2004 - Chris Perry - Injured several times, never over-took Rudi and later replaced by Cedric Benson.
2005 - David Pollack - This one hurt... so much potential, and so much heart lost in a freak injury.
2006 - Johnathan Joseph - 2-time Pro Bowler - Great pick.
2007 - Leon Hall - Great Pick.
2008 - Keith Rivers - Bust... no other word for it, getting blindsided by Ward was the final straw for him.
2009 - Andre Smith - Solid, steady, good pick.
2010 - Jermaine Gresham - 2-time Pro Bowler - He is hated by so many fans, but was a 2 time Pro Bowler. Not a bad pick.
2011 - A. J. Green - 7-time Pro Bowler - Yea... great pick.
2012 - Dre Kirkpatrick - Underwhelming stat wise for INTs, but he was steady out there and still in the league.
2012 - Kevin Zeitler - Great pick, should never have been allowed to leave.
2013 - Tyler Eifert - 1-time Pro Bowler - And once again, we visit the injury ward and have to ask, what could have been.
2014 - Darqueze Dennard - Oft injured, but came on near the end. Hard to say it was a bust.
2015 - Cedric Ogbuehi - In the dictionary, under bust it says see Cedric Ogbuehi.
2016 - William Jackson III - Great pick
2017 - John Ross - Waste of a pick. Hard to say it is a bust, because he may perform elsewhere, but should never have been picked here.
2018 - Billy Price - Was a bust, but suddenly showing a glimmer of hope. He gets the season still.
2019 - Jonah Williams - Early signs are good.
2020 - Joe Burrow - Looks like a good pick, just stay healthy.


Feel free to discuss or comment on my opinions but it really isn't as bad as I thought.

[EatonFan]

(10-30-2020, 06:06 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: Agreed. I don’t think career ending injury should qualify as a bust. Just a tragedy. Same goes for Carter.

No no no.  Carter was a bust.  I've never seen an NFL RB go down so easily in my life.  

He went down faster than Madonna in a flop-house.

He was TERRIBLE.  

[*jason*]

(10-30-2020, 05:50 PM)swilson3828 Wrote: David Klingler
Akili Smith
John Ross
Billy Price
Big Daddy Dan Wilkinson
Ki Jana Carter
David Pollack
Andre Smith
Dre Kirkpatrick
Darquez Dennard

.......and these are the only ones I can think of, but I know there have got to be others. I know Pollack had a career ending injury, but still.....

Cincinnati is prob close to being if not being THE #1 team in the NFL in blowing first round picks

The Jets have that many in the last 10 to 12 years... We're not near the top. This list is somewhat suspect too. A couple guys don't belong, while there are more than one notable omissions.