Is fans in the stands ownerships biggest priority???

[uticabengalfan]

We heard Mike say it when Marvin left. They noticed the empty stadium and heard the fans speaking for a change. I know in this covid year all stadiums have been empty but im holding onto hope that Mike realizes the fans are disgusted with this entire staff and the stadium will continue to sit empty with these coaches in place. Heres to hoping a coaching change is made and a fresh start. This has to be an attractive job with Burrow and some of the playmakers on both sides of the ball.

[THE PISTONS]

With revenue sharing, it doesn't matter a lot. The pandemic may have changed things too.

With Joe Burrow, I think people will go to these games no matter what. We may not be full, but attendance should be better than last year.

That said, the team did spend in free agency this offseason, so management did put some effort in this year. No denying that.

[fredtoast]

(12-11-2020, 11:11 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: With Joe Burrow, I think people will go to these games no matter what. 

I don't think so.  

Maybe if he was playing at an elite level and had the offense among the league leaders in scoring, but through 11 weeks Burrow was the #24 ranked QB and our scoring offense was #25.  No one is going to pay to see that.


Empty seats are the single biggest motivation for our front office.  And if we bring Taylor back next year PBS will be empty.

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-11-2020, 11:11 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: With revenue sharing, it doesn't matter a lot. The pandemic may have changed things too.

With Joe Burrow, I think people will go to these games no matter what. We may not be full, but attendance should be better than last year.

That said, the team did spend in free agency this offseason, so management did put some effort in this year. No denying that.

Revenue sharing is often misunderstood.

National revenue is shared across 32 teams and includes:

-TV deals
-NFL Merchandising:  Fanatics is the lead partner on this
-NFL Network, NFL.com, and NFL Sunday ticket
-Licensing deals:  "Official Sponsors of the NFL"
-Ticket Sales:  40% of Gross

Local Revenue, which goes to the team, consists of:

-Ticket sales 60% of gross
- Concession and Parking
-Corporate Sponsorships with the Team

So, although the largest % of their dollars is shared among 32 teams, when you get 1/32 of it compared to all of the local revenue you can see that ticket revenue, concessions/parking, and local corporate sponsorships are still a potentially very large chunk of change. 

Throw in that if the team sold the naming rights to the stadium that they would get 100% of that, yet they have chosen to stay with the name Paul Brown Stadium in honor of the team's founder, and you have a pretty significant deficit.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(12-11-2020, 11:32 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't think so.  

Maybe if he was playing at an elite level and had the offense among the league leaders in scoring, but through 11 weeks Burrow was the #24 ranked QB and our scoring offense was #25.  No one is going to pay to see that.


Empty seats are the single biggest motivation for our front office.  And if we bring Taylor back next year PBS will be empty.

While I disagree with your assessment that it would be different if the QB was playing at an elite level, bringing back ZT would all but ensure that people won't return.

I all honesty, I think it is REALLY hard to sell tickets to an NFL game.  The at-home experience is so much better now with ridiculously-sized HD TVs that allow you to sit at home in comfort is hard to leave for the so-called stadium experience.  Maybe it would be different if they had a dome as well, but after giving up my season tickets two seasons ago (largely due to divorce), there isn't a lot that makes me want to go back.  And you know I am a perpetual optimist and absolutely love the team.  

Part of that has to do with my father, who owned one ticket (I owned three) and at 87 years young, it was tough on him during the cold weather games.  I couldn't believe it when stadium personnel actually argued with my dad for wanting to take the elevator.  I said I would walk up, but dad's knee was acting up and he would rather take the elevator.  They argued with us every time.  Assholes.

Some will say I am on old man that can't handle the weather.  I don't think it is that at all.  Without blackouts and being able to watch every game from home, we can have a few drinks and cater in a great meal (which is what we do now) and doze off at the end of the game (at least dad does).  

I do miss a lot of the people that sat in our section and I had great times at many games over the years, but the younger generation that are would be customers are more interested in fantasy football and video games.  I mean, if they are under 30 years old, they have never seen the Bengals win a playoff game.  When I graduated from college, I bought season tickets.  It was what I wanted more than anything.  Before I bought a car, a house, or pretty much anything....I bought season tickets.  If someone as in love with the Bengals as I am could care less about being at a game, I think they have a pretty tough sell moving forward.  Even with Joe Burrow and even if they are winning.  

[Wes Mantooth]

It's by far the biggest thing that they can actually control or influence.

TV revenue is their biggest source of income, but that's driven by the strength of the league as a whole. No doubt that this is what allows them to never have to truely worry about making money, but there's still a significant amount that's being left on the table.

Fwiw, I did some half ass math on this a few weeks ago. I think it's safe to assume that they lost out on a minimum of 15 million dollars for their home games in 2019. When you factor in average ticket cost ($70ish???), the amount of unsold tickets (20-35k), empty luxury boxes, the loss in concessions and parking, and the loss in merchandise, it really adds up.

And the biggest thing is that the lack of fan support (empty seats) affects everything else, and serves as indicator for their entire business dealings. Their advertising and sponsor deals won't be as lucrative, they won't sell as many jerseys and other apparel, etc.

This team has had attendace issues for years now, probably going all the way back until 2016. It's not getting any better. I think this year Burrow alone could have improved them somewhat but that opportunity is lost due to Covid.

The team has to be concerned about this, and if they retain Zac Taylor I wouldn't look for these issues to sort themselves out any time soon.

[*bengalfan74*]

(12-11-2020, 11:32 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't think so.  

Maybe if he was playing at an elite level and had the offense among the league leaders in scoring, but through 11 weeks Burrow was the #24 ranked QB and our scoring offense was #25.  No one is going to pay to see that.


Empty seats are the single biggest motivation for our front office.  And if we bring Taylor back next year PBS will be empty.

Agree

It's this simple, winning trumps everything. We could have the all time all Madden team taking the field but with only winning 2 games a year it's not gonna matter !

Burrow certainly helps with both the winning and attendance. But the vast majority of the fans I talk to are fed up with the ZT show and aren't going to go without some serious shaking up.

[*ochocincos*]

If you want to ever get Mike Brown's attention, you have to do one of two things:
- Send a letter through physical mail (no email or social media)
- Don't attend games in person

The latter is what affects his pocketbook and what he also notices during games. He can physically see the fan displeasure by people not being there.

Burrow was the draw for the start of this season (but limited due to COVID restrictions).
But the team didn't get wins even with him there.
This season might be an even bigger disappointment than last given the expectation of improvement.

I think ultimately there will be some skepticism (and thus less fans) if Taylor is kept. However, I think the Bengals might be able to get SOME fans back if they replace Turner and/or Anarumo. But it probably has to be with someone who the fans know has a proven track record.

[bengals67]

(12-11-2020, 11:32 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't think so.  

Maybe if he was playing at an elite level and had the offense among the league leaders in scoring, but through 11 weeks Burrow was the #24 ranked QB and our scoring offense was #25.  No one is going to pay to see that.


Empty seats are the single biggest motivation for our front office.  And if we bring Taylor back next year PBS will be empty.

I hope this is true and I think it is.

[bengals67]

(12-11-2020, 12:24 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If you want to ever get Mike Brown's attention, you have to do one of two things:
- Send a letter through physical mail (no email or social media)
- Don't attend games in person

The latter is what affects his pocketbook and what he also notices during games. He can physically see the fan displeasure by people not being there.

Burrow was the draw for the start of this season (but limited due to COVID restrictions).
But the team didn't get wins even with him there.
This season might be an even bigger disappointment than last given the expectation of improvement.

I think ultimately there will be some skepticism (and thus less fans) if Taylor is kept. However, I think the Bengals might be able to get SOME fans back if they replace Turner and/or Anarumo. But it probably has to be with someone who the fans know has a proven track record.

Failing organizations often hire an expert to audit their performance to get advice on what they are doing wrong.

If reality TV had a show called "NFL Franchise Rescue", the Bengals would be the first show.

The entire organization is rotten. That is a much bigger problem than Zack Taylor who might have succeeded if he had been hired by the Steelers. He was doomed to failure before he started.

[Wes Mantooth]

(12-11-2020, 12:24 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If you want to ever get Mike Brown's attention, you have to do one of two things:
- Send a letter through physical mail (no email or social media)

You used to be able to actually call him up until about 2015.  He'd answer on one of these, until it finally broke...

[*ochocincos*]

(12-11-2020, 02:59 PM)bengals67 Wrote: Failing organizations often hire an expert to audit their performance to get advice on what they are doing wrong.

If reality TV had a show called "NFL Franchise Rescue", the Bengals would be the first show.

The entire organization is rotten. That is a much bigger problem than Zack Taylor who might have succeeded if he had been hired by the Steelers. He was doomed to failure before he started.

So what you're saying is...bring in Jon Taffer to rescue the franchise?! SOLD! 

[*ochocincos*]

(12-11-2020, 03:07 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: You used to be able to actually call him up until about 2015.  He'd answer on one of these, until it finally broke...

My great aunt had this while I was growing up. I doubt she still has it, but I thought it was old back then lol.