Back to a Wide Zone Blocking Scheme

[Bengalitis]

what the coach wants rather than what the personnel dictates to success. its gonna be a long season.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(01-12-2021, 02:08 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The run game was actually really good and here was the OL that year:
- Glenn
- Boling
- Price
- Redmond
- Hart

It's not like it was a stellar OL. Pollack found a way to make the OL effective with Price, Redmond, and Hart. I don't think a full overhaul is needed. Just better coaching.

The Bengals had the 21st ranked run offense in 2018.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-12-2021, 04:32 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: The Bengals had the 21st ranked run offense in 2018.

I was referring to Mixon's production. 1168 yards with a 4.9 YPC.
Mixon was 4th in NFL in rushing yards, tied for 11th in NFL in terms of YPC.

[XenoMorph]

(01-12-2021, 12:18 PM)JWW1971 Wrote: It will be interesting to see what Pollock makes of the guys on the team but I think its a certainty that we see big changes as Pollock has already said he wants some changes.
Obviously it depends on what we do in FA and the draft but out of the current players I only see Jonah & Hopkins as being safe along with Adeniji due to being a rookie
Redmond & Spain are both FA's, We can cut Sutherland & Johnson for $0 dead cap, Hart for $1m & Su'a-Filo for $700k.
It will be very interesting to see how much input Pollock gets as I remember Marvin saying during the draft recap presser that Pollock wasn't happy that Marv and Duke didn't get a couple of more O-line men in during that draft 

question is if they are willing to go all in and get pollack who he wants?  why did they not do that the first time he was here?

What has changed?  cant be the Bullishness of Zach.

Why would he believe it will be different this time or why would it be? we needed OL in 2018 as well

[Sled21]

(01-12-2021, 05:42 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: question is if they are willing to go all in and get pollack who he wants?  why did they not do that the first time he was here?

What has changed?  cant be the Bullishness of Zach.

Why would he believe it will be different this time or why would it be? we needed OL in 2018 as well

Well, there's a different HC for one thing.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

(01-12-2021, 02:08 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The run game was actually really good and here was the OL that year:
- Glenn
- Boling
- Price
- Redmond
- Hart

It's not like it was a stellar OL. Pollack found a way to make the OL effective with Price, Redmond, and Hart. I don't think a full overhaul is needed. Just better coaching.

You make some excellent points as usual but I wouldn’t characterize the 2018 run game as “really good.” It was better than what we have now by a lot but it was not good; I think somebody mentioned the Bengals being 21st in the league that year. It’s all relative because when you’re pretty much dead last 21st looks darn good in comparison.

I was fascinated the other night watching the Cleveland Browns manhandle the Pittsburgh Steelers up front. That doesn’t happen often. The Browns found a way to open holes and sustain blocks and Nick Chubb certainly took advantage of it. This is what I am hoping for with Cincinnati and Joe Mixon along with Giovani Bernard. Both of these backs are super talented but without a crease they are going nowhere.

[SuperBowlBound!]

(01-12-2021, 11:33 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: so this is what we tried in 2019?  are we gonna overhaul the line we dont seem to have the right guys for this scheme

Apparently we did not have the right guys for the last scheme. Maybe they will be better with this scheme.

[*ochocincos*]

(01-12-2021, 06:01 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: You make some excellent points as usual but I wouldn’t characterize the 2018 run game as “really good.” It was better than what we have now by a lot but it was not good; I think somebody mentioned the Bengals being 21st in the league that year.  It’s all relative because when you’re pretty much dead last 21st looks darn good in comparison.

I was fascinated the other night watching the Cleveland Browns manhandle the Pittsburgh Steelers up front. That doesn’t happen often.  The Browns found a way to open holes and sustain blocks and Nick Chubb certainly took advantage of it. This is what I am hoping for with Cincinnati and Joe Mixon along with Giovani Bernard.   Both of these backs are super talented but without a crease they are going nowhere.

I mislabeled as "the running game" but I was referring to Mixon's performance, as he was the main RB. He was 4th in rushing and tied for 11th in YPC the year Pollack was the OL coach.

In fact, I remember specifically the only thing I was excited about with Zac Taylor coming in was how well Mixon ran in 2018 and then knowing how Gurley was used with the Rams. I was hopeful that Mixon was going to become TG 2.0.

Alas, it did not happen.

[MileHighGrowler]

(01-12-2021, 06:21 PM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: Apparently we did not have the right guys for the last scheme. Maybe they will be better with this scheme.

I don't care if it's this scheme or another scheme.  It should play to the strength of the guys on the line.  Bring in the best talent you can, and then coach them properly and scheme to leverage their skills.  These guys who get so stuck on one scheme or another are kinda missing the point on how to be successful.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-12-2021, 01:49 PM)JWW1971 Wrote: That is a fair point but do you think that a coach would come back to a team if he wasn't happy with what he heard in the meeting.
Also we did spend a hell of a lot in FA last year and with drafting Burrow I expect that to continue this year. As I mentioned in another post, we went heavy in Defence last season and I think we will see the organization doing the same on the Offence this season.
Just my opinion but they will want to keep Burrow happy

Believe the same, hope it works out and Taylor and company improve massively over last season.

Pollack sure is a great addition to keep Burrow happy. This guy knows what he is doing and I like that he is wanting to go to 
a scheme that some of the best running teams in the NFL use. Just need to add the players that fit this scheme and let go the 
ones that don't fit it.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-12-2021, 06:21 PM)SuperBowlBound! Wrote: Apparently we did not have the right guys for the last scheme. Maybe they will be better with this scheme.

A lot of it has to do with who is teaching the players to properly execute the scheme. From what I've been reading about players speaking on Pollack, he seems to be very thorough and detailed with his instruction.  Sometimes yelling "knock that man's dick in the dirt" works, and at other times maybe the player needs a little more detailed advice on exactly how he should go about claiming his position, lowering his pads, finding the precise leverage point and angle to take, and exactly when to drive hard, in order to efficiently move his man off the ball and perhaps put him on his ass. 

[JWW1971]

(01-12-2021, 05:42 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: question is if they are willing to go all in and get pollack who he wants?  why did they not do that the first time he was here?

What has changed?  cant be the Bullishness of Zach.

Why would he believe it will be different this time or why would it be? we needed OL in 2018 as well

The difference this time around is in Who is running the club now, Yes Tobin is still there but during the 2018 FA & Draft we had Old Mike and Marvelous Marv running things.
Old Mike came out after Marv left and before we hired Zac and said that Katie and Troy were now running things and he was "Allowed" to keep the title of President.
Katie & Troy along with Tobin hired Zac and yes there has been a few mistakes like them giving Zac full control of hiring his staff but they won't want to look like they have failed though and that is why Zac hasn't been fired.
Look at the FA signings last year, they went all in and spent a hell of a lot of money rebuilding the defence and yes the O-Line wasn't even good but maybe they took Turner's word that with a couple of new guys in Spain and Su'a-Filo and with Williams coming in that the players we had were ok.
I just expect that we will rebuild the O-Line this time around to help Burrow, I am also really looking forward to seeing Mixon tear it up from behind Pollock's O-Line again

[thompson19osu]

Wasn’t this the scheme the team struggled with mightily? Mixon lead the AFC in rushing I believe but it is because they switched up the scheme halfway through the year. I don’t see this being a good thing. Am i out in right field?

[GreenCornBengal]

I’m not sold on Pollack.

He did really well with an Oline comprised of all pros in Dallas.
Mixed bag of results here
Coached up the Jets who are devoid of talent, but again... nothing spectacular.


He is better than Turner no doubt, but I think he is a bit overrated around here because of the Dallas days.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(01-12-2021, 01:48 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: So far biggest concern has to be his praise of Hart. Sounds like he’ll be sticking around for at least another year :cry:

Ugh. I want them to cut Hart both to shed his salary, and force us to upgrade. The only thing I will say is he’s not as big a problem as the guards are.

(01-12-2021, 09:45 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I’m not sold on Pollack.

He did really well with an Oline comprised of all pros in Dallas.
Mixed bag of results here
Coached up the Jets who are devoid of talent, but again... nothing spectacular.


He is better than Turner no doubt, but I think he is a bit overrated around here because of the Dallas days.

His time in Dallas has nothing to do with it for me. It’s why I was excited about the hire in the first place, but it’s how well Mixon did when Pollack was here that sold me. Yes, a lot of yards came against teams like the Browns, but we couldn’t even run on bad teams this season (other than JAX).

[BengalsFanRealist2855]

(01-12-2021, 09:45 PM)GreenCornBengal Wrote: I’m not sold on Pollack.

He did really well with an Oline comprised of all pros in Dallas.
Mixed bag of results here
Coached up the Jets who are devoid of talent, but again... nothing spectacular.


He is better than Turner no doubt, but I think he is a bit overrated around here because of the Dallas days.

I hate to agree with you but you are right. What has he done besides that one year,and they didnt even win in the playoffs with that good o line. I remember us playing them that year and their o line was much bigger then our d line. 

[Trademark]

(01-12-2021, 01:48 PM)Yojimbo Wrote: So far biggest concern has to be his praise of Hart. Sounds like he’ll be sticking around for at least another year

I'm tired of the Hart hate, dude played solid this season

[TJHoushmandzadeh's Shiny Shoes]

(01-12-2021, 08:14 PM)JWW1971 Wrote: The difference this time around is in Who is running the club now

Was I the only one who read this as Who Dey?

[KillerGoose]

(01-12-2021, 04:32 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: The Bengals had the 21st ranked run offense in 2018.

They were also 9th in YPC. In 2018, Cincinnati had Teryl Austin as the DC. We ranked last in YPG and 30th in PPG. Due to this, the offense had to pass quite a bit to try to keep up. Cincinnati was passing at a 61-39 split. The running game was effective, but wasn’t being used as much.

[XenoMorph]

(01-12-2021, 08:14 PM)JWW1971 Wrote: The difference this time around is in Who is running the club now, Yes Tobin is still there but during the 2018 FA & Draft we had Old Mike and Marvelous Marv running things.
Old Mike came out after Marv left and before we hired Zac and said that Katie and Troy were now running things and he was "Allowed" to keep the title of President.
Katie & Troy along with Tobin hired Zac and yes there has been a few mistakes like them giving Zac full control of hiring his staff but they won't want to look like they have failed though and that is why Zac hasn't been fired.
Look at the FA signings last year, they went all in and spent a hell of a lot of money rebuilding the defence and yes the O-Line wasn't even good but maybe they took Turner's word that with a couple of new guys in Spain and Su'a-Filo and with Williams coming in that the players we had were ok.
I just expect that we will rebuild the O-Line this time around to help Burrow, I am also really looking forward to seeing Mixon tear it up from behind Pollock's O-Line again

so why is everyone still blaming mike brown for things?

Id like to see mixon do well...  but if burrows healthy ZT going be calling 40+ passes a game.