Salary Cap could be around $180-185 mill, per reports

[*ochocincos*]

There's been some debate about what the Bengals can and should do this offseason in FA because the Salary Cap is unknown.
The minimum it can be is $175 mill, but there were some reports back in Dec that it could be closer to $195 mill per PFT.
As we get closer to the start of FA, Tom Pelissero reports it could be close to $185 mill.

Quote:Some team officials believe (and surely hope) the cap will ultimately land closer to $185 million per club - if not a little higher - than the $175 million minimum the sides agreed to last summer as they braced for empty and mostly empty stadiums.

https://bengalswire.usatoday.com/2021/02/04/bengals-2021-salary-cap-higher-than-expected/

ProFootballTalk (PFT) is now reporting that the Salary Cap may not drop to $175 mill, but it may still fall to around $180 mill.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2021/01/19/salary-cap-could-be-in-the-range-of-180-million/

It's worth noting the final number may not be known until just before the start of the new league year on March 17, when FA begins. Hopefully it will be at least a couple weeks sooner.

[J24]

I'll be shocked if the players association agrees to anything less than 198.
New TV Money + the owners pushing for a 17th game will make it hard to convince the players to take a massive pay cut.

[*Synric*]

(02-04-2021, 01:38 PM)J24 Wrote: I'll be shocked if the players association agrees to anything less than 198.
New TV Money + the owners pushing for a 17th game will make it hard to convince the players to take a massive pay cut.

They already agreed to a 175m bottom that happened before they started the season.

[*ochocincos*]

(02-04-2021, 01:38 PM)J24 Wrote: I'll be shocked if the players association agrees to anything less than 198.
New TV Money + the owners pushing for a 17th game will make it hard to convince the players to take a massive pay cut.

(02-04-2021, 02:01 PM)Synric Wrote: They already agreed to a 175m bottom that happened before they started the season.

From my understanding, since NFLPA had already agreed to the cap being as low as $175 mill, they essentially signed off on whatever the NFL wants to put it at as long as it's at least $175 mill.
So if the owners want to set it to $180 mill, they can do that without needing a big negotiation with the NFLPA.

As such, the players may have to deal with contracts being lower for 2021, but likely to go (way) up again in 2022 and beyond.

If so, I would imagine players who get cut or are FAs may either have to take just a 1-year deal and then hit FA again in 2022 in hopes the cap is way bigger again, or they may accept a multi-year deal where the cap hit is lower in 2021 but will (greatly) increase in the following years to help compensate. Also, I would expect guaranteed money will be more important this year if the contracts are going to be smaller.

[J24]

(02-04-2021, 02:01 PM)Synric Wrote: They already agreed to a 175m bottom that happened before they started the season.

That was worse case scenarrio; the NFL is way past that. Plus the owners are going to be asking for an extra 17th game. There is no way in hell the players are going to agree to that along with taking a 23 million dollar pay cut. Especially considering the NFL is about to make a shit ton of money from TV deals.

(02-04-2021, 02:54 PM)ochocincos Wrote: From my understanding, since NFLPA had already agreed to the cap being as low as $175 mill, they essentially signed off on whatever the NFL wants to put it at as long as it's at least $175 mill.
So if the owners want to set it to $180 mill, they can do that without needing a big negotiation with the NFLPA.

As such, the players may have to deal with contracts being lower for 2021, but likely to go (way) up again in 2022 and beyond.

If so, I would imagine players who get cut or are FAs may either have to take just a 1-year deal and then hit FA again in 2022 in hopes the cap is way bigger again, or they may accept a multi-year deal where the cap hit is lower in 2021 but will (greatly) increase in the following years to help compensate. Also, I would expect guaranteed money will be more important this year if the contracts are going to be smaller.

The owners still have to negotiate a 17th game with the players. They will make a trade with the players association 17th game for a Cap freeze.  That's how this is going down and it will probably be messy..

[*ochocincos*]

(02-04-2021, 03:44 PM)J24 Wrote: That was worse case scenarrio; the NFL is way past that. Plus the owners are going to be asking for an extra 17th game. There is no way in hell the players are going to agree to that along with taking a 23 million dollar pay cut. Especially considering the NFL is about to make a shit ton of money from TV deals.

The owners still have to negotiate a 17th game with the players. They will make a trade with the players association 17th game for a Cap freeze.  That's how this is going down and it will probably be messy..

It could be determined that they will add a 17th game once the cap can go back up.

[Whatever]

(02-04-2021, 03:44 PM)J24 Wrote: That was worse case scenarrio; the NFL is way past that. Plus the owners are going to be asking for an extra 17th game. There is no way in hell the players are going to agree to that along with taking a 23 million dollar pay cut. Especially considering the NFL is about to make a shit ton of money from TV deals.

The owners still have to negotiate a 17th game with the players. They will make a trade with the players association 17th game for a Cap freeze.  That's how this is going down and it will probably be messy..

The players are not going to give up their biggest negotiating leverage for the next cba for a 1 year cap freeze.  

[J24]

(02-04-2021, 03:57 PM)ochocincos Wrote: It could be determined that they will add a 17th game once the cap can go back up.

It won't.

(02-04-2021, 04:40 PM)Whatever Wrote: The players are not going to give up their biggest negotiating leverage for the next cba for a 1 year cap freeze.  

Yes they would and there sure as hell not going to take a massive pay cut either. 

The new TV money depends on that 17th game the players and owners both  know this.

[*ochocincos*]

(02-05-2021, 01:20 AM)J24 Wrote: It won't.

Yes they would and there sure as hell not going to take a massive pay cut either. 

The new TV money depends on that 17th game the players and owners both  know this.

No offense, but this sounds more like speculation on your part rather than proof.

[Okeana]

(02-04-2021, 12:31 PM)ochocincos Wrote: There's been some debate about what the Bengals can and should do this offseason in FA because the Salary Cap is unknown.
The minimum it can be is $175 mill, but there were some reports back in Dec that it could be closer to $195 mill per PFT.
As we get closer to the start of FA, Tom Pelissero reports it could be close to $185 mill.

https://bengalswire.usatoday.com/2021/02/04/bengals-2021-salary-cap-higher-than-expected/

ProFootballTalk (PFT) is now reporting that the Salary Cap may not drop to $175 mill, but it may still fall to around $180 mill.
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2021/01/19/salary-cap-could-be-in-the-range-of-180-million/

It's worth noting the final number may not be known until just before the start of the new league year on March 17, when FA begins. Hopefully it will be at least a couple weeks sooner.

How do you even have a free agency with 185. I think Bengals would have an advantage in this market, but I could see a lot of backloaded contracts that are extremely risky.  

[*ochocincos*]

(02-05-2021, 04:40 PM)Okeana Wrote: How do you even have a free agency with 185. I think Bengals would have an advantage in this market, but I could see a lot of backloaded contracts that are extremely risky.  

What do you mean how?
That's not as low as you may think, that was about the salary cap back in just 2019 and is higher than the 2018 salary cap.

2018 - $177.2 mill
2019 - $188.2 mill

[J24]

(02-05-2021, 01:06 PM)ochocincos Wrote: No offense, but this sounds more like speculation on your part rather than proof.

 The PA is ls not going to agree to more games and take a pay cut at the same time.  It doesn't take an insider to figure that out. If it does happen then union has zero meaning.

[Okeana]

(02-05-2021, 05:12 PM)ochocincos Wrote: What do you mean how?
That's not as low as you may think, that was about the salary cap back in just 2019 and is higher than the 2018 salary cap.

2018 - $177.2 mill
2019 - $188.2 mill

so I will explain it to you.  People want their market value and that's based on the year prior.  For example, do you think Dak Prescott is gonna wanna take a discount because people have a more limited cap?  it's not the way it works.  Lawson is gonna wanna be paid as a top edge rusher in this free-agent class, but when only 7 teams project to have any cap space at all, this year's payouts and signing bonuses will be less than what typically would happen. pre covid the cap woulda probably been in the 210 range this year, now its gonna be 185?  25 million dollars off the top of the cap is a huge deal.

So like I said it could happen but I expect there to be a lot of backloaded contracts with more guaranteed money and that's scary for a lot of teams

[Okeana]

(02-05-2021, 06:10 PM)J24 Wrote:  The PA is ls not going to agree to more games and take a pay cut at the same time.  It doesn't take an insider to figure that out. If it does happen then union has zero meaning.

truth.  There could be a strike this year depending on the cap and most players will feel that these teams make enough money to take a hit on the live gate.  

[Whatever]

(02-05-2021, 06:11 PM)Okeana Wrote: so I will explain it to you.  People want their market value and that's based on the year prior.  For example, do you think Dak Prescott is gonna wanna take a discount because people have a more limited cap?  it's not the way it works.  Lawson is gonna wanna be paid as a top edge rusher in this free-agent class, but when only 7 teams project to have any cap space at all, this year's payouts and signing bonuses will be less than what typically would happen. pre covid the cap woulda probably been in the 210 range this year, now its gonna be 185?  25 million dollars off the top of the cap is a huge deal.

So like I said it could happen but I expect there to be a lot of backloaded contracts with more guaranteed money and that's scary for a lot of teams

The problem is only a small minority of the players in the league will be looking at potential big money contracts this off-season.  You think Tee Higgins or Logan Wilson really care if Dak can cash in this off-season when the crowds and cap will be back up when they're elligible for UFA in 3 years?  

[*ochocincos*]

(02-05-2021, 06:11 PM)Okeana Wrote: so I will explain it to you.  People want their market value and that's based on the year prior.  For example, do you think Dak Prescott is gonna wanna take a discount because people have a more limited cap?  it's not the way it works.  Lawson is gonna wanna be paid as a top edge rusher in this free-agent class, but when only 7 teams project to have any cap space at all, this year's payouts and signing bonuses will be less than what typically would happen. pre covid the cap woulda probably been in the 210 range this year, now its gonna be 185?  25 million dollars off the top of the cap is a huge deal.

So like I said it could happen but I expect there to be a lot of backloaded contracts with more guaranteed money and that's scary for a lot of teams

It could be worked in to have a reduced cap hit in 2021 and increasing in the following years as you said.
There are ways to work around lower cap for a single year but still have a good APY.

[*ochocincos*]

(02-05-2021, 06:10 PM)J24 Wrote:  The PA is ls not going to agree to more games and take a pay cut at the same time.  It doesn't take an insider to figure that out. If it does happen then union has zero meaning.

We'll find out what it ends up being. I'm simply posting what the reports are on the cap as of just a couple days ago, I'm not speculating what they could or should be.

EDIT - If I were to speculate, the increase from $175 mill floor to $185 mill might be to account for the extra game. We don't know though.

[J24]

(02-05-2021, 06:41 PM)Whatever Wrote: The problem is only a small minority of the players in the league will be looking at potential big money contracts this off-season.  You think Tee Higgins or Logan Wilson really care if Dak can cash in this off-season when the crowds and cap will be back up when they're elligible for UFA in 3 years?  

You are looking at a bunch of cuts that wouldn't happen normally  and  a smaller cap will have a profound affect on 2nd and third tier free agents. So yeah the players association is going to care a hell of a lot about where the cap lands this season.

[Luvnit2]

(02-05-2021, 07:24 PM)J24 Wrote: You are looking at a bunch of cuts that wouldn't happen normally  and  a smaller cap will have a profound affect on 2nd and third tier free agents. So yeah the players association is going to care a hell of a lot about where the cap lands this season.

You missed the MAJOR POINT, THE PLAYER'S ASSCOCIATION ALREADY AGREED TO A FLOOR OF 175 MILLION ON A 16 GAME SEASON. THAT IS A FACT, SO NO THEY CAN'T STRIKE, THEY ARE LEGALLY BOUND.

If they want it higher than 175 million, only the owners can raise it and they akso would have to vote on it. If owners don't want higher than 175 million, only way it goes up if if a 17th game is agreed upon by both parties.

They can whine, cry and ***** all they want, but again PLAYERS ASSOCIATION AGREED THE FLOOR WOULD BE 175 MILLION SO IT MAY BE 175 MILLION IN 2021 AND TEAMS WILL HAVE TO ADJUST AND PLAYERS WILL HAVE TO ADJUST WHO ARE NOT UNDER CONTRACT.

[J24]

(02-05-2021, 08:09 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: You missed the MAJOR POINT, THE PLAYER'S ASSCOCIATION ALREADY AGREED TO A FLOOR OF 175 MILLION ON A 16 GAME SEASON. THAT IS A FACT, SO NO THEY CAN'T STRIKE, THEY ARE LEGALLY BOUND.

If they want it higher than 175 million, only the owners can raise it and they akso would have to vote on it. If owners don't want higher than 175 million, only way it goes up if if a 17th game is agreed upon by both parties.

They can whine, cry and ***** all they want, but again PLAYERS ASSOCIATION AGREED THE FLOOR WOULD BE 175 MILLION SO IT MAY BE 175 MILLION IN 2021 AND TEAMS WILL HAVE TO ADJUST AND PLAYERS WILL HAVE TO ADJUST WHO ARE NOT UNDER CONTRACT.

The owners have to get to a 17th game for TV deals which they are negotiating right now with networks. There is know way the players association is going to agree to that without at the very least a cap freeze.  The owners do not have a choice  because they can't let down their TV partners.
At the end of the day it will be a trade Cap freeze for the 17th game. Good day sir.