There are only like two players left from the Marvin Lewis era...

[Shake n Blake]

(02-03-2022, 08:07 PM)tms Wrote: I think it's a tricky argument to make either way. We're trying to put our finger on the source of the magic. Of course it can't only be Burrow- he plays in one phase of the game. But as a leader and just a guy who serves as the axis of the team (they literally call him "Franchise") it's hard to define how far-reaching and profound his influence really is. 

If you look at the historical data, you'll almost never find a great quarterback who wasn't supplemented by supposedly great drafts, coaches or free agents. Not to say that the importance of those drafts, coaches or free agents can be summarily dismissed on account of the quarterback. But it's hard to ascribe something like that to coincidence. They sort of work together, don't they? The difference is, I think if you move the quarterback to another team, he'll excel there too... as we saw with Peyton in Denver or Brady in Tampa, for example. Whereas I'm not sure you could say the same for the drafts, coaches or free agents that are left behind. 

I think the notion of an elevator is very real, even if it doesn't necessarily make sense. I might even be inclined to use the term "mask" instead of elevator, since they tend to hide weaknesses as much as they reinforce (or give rise to) strengths. One example of that might be our offensive line this year. I mean, this is a putrid line, yet it hasn't slowed down Joe Burrow. We're just a sliver away from having some people argue that you don't need pass protection to win in this league lol, "Look at Joe Burrow!" So not only can franchise players make their teammates look good, they can also challenge our value system as football fans more broadly. It's awfully intriguing to me. 

The Bucs went 7-9 in 2019...so that team was trash till Brady showed up, right? Well, not exactly. They had the 3rd ranked offense in both points and yards. Defense showed potential being 15th in yards, but were 29th in points allowed.

That probably had something to Winston throwing 30 picks. You swap that out for an elite QB? Pretty easy to see how they won a SB. Offense was already amazing without Brady, and the D showed it's true colors when they weren't having to deal with a QB turning it over 2-3 times every week.

Same story with Peyton in Denver. Tim Tebow won a playoff game with that roster. Add in elite QB? Super Bowl.

Of course teams are way better with an elite QB. You almost need one to be in the championship conversation. But you also need a boatload of talent. Brady and Peyton weren't stupid. They picked Tampa and Denver for a reason.

Similar story here. Burrow showed serious potential last year...but the defense was abysmal and on top of a porous o-line, we had no big play explosive players. We went 2-7-1 in his starts. Not because Joey wasn't ready. I think he was.

The team just wasn't there yet. All those players I listed got started this year, pretty much.

TL/DR: I agree an elite QB inspires an entire team and has a tremendous impact on pretty much every aspect of the team. But I also say an elite QB isn't going to lift a cast of scrubs or even mediocre players to anything really. You need an elite QB and a great roster to be where we are.