12-07-2023, 02:48 PM
(12-07-2023, 02:56 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: When you're a decent defense and you're winning lots of games, a lot of things are able to get a pass. I was never on the "pay Bates tons of money" train largely because of the things you mentioned. I didn't expect they'd let Bell go too when he got a very reasonable contract.
When you're on arguably the worst defense in the NFL and currently out of the playoffs, things get less of a pass. It's not even the safeties, though, so while I do wish they kept Bell to go with Dax, I don't think the safeties are the only problem. The LBs are playing pretty darn poorly, the DL is pretty disappointing, and they are all guys who got paid.
Completely agree, the Safeties namely Battle have just gotten better and better. It is the vets at LB and on the DL that need to
play much better. Hilton and Chido haven't played great this year either. This along with the youth and the Defense is bound to
not be playing as good as they should.
(12-07-2023, 02:58 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Missed tackles, huh? Looks like Dax has some catching up to do.
Daxton Hill
2022 15 games 2 starts 1 missed tackle
2023 12 starts 7 missed tackles
Jessie Bates III
2018 16 starts 10 missed tackles
2019 16 starts 17 missed tackles
2020 16 starts 16 missed tackles
2021 15 starts 7 missed tackles
2022 16 starts 7 missed tackles
---------------------------------------
2023 12 starts 8 missed tackles
Thanks FSV. Good stuff.
Helps prove my point.
(12-07-2023, 03:15 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I mostly agree with the general point you're making, but please use Missed Tackle % rather than just accumulation. Different safeties have different responsibilities, and different years have different trends.
Guy A might miss 8 tackles and Guy B might miss 10 tackles, but if Guy A made 40 tackles and Guy B made 80 tackles, Guy B is a much better tackler than Guy A (though I guess in this random example both are very bad).
You saying 15 games 2 starts for Daxton last year and putting 1 missed tackle is vastly misleading because he only made 16 tackles all year, which makes any attempts at comparing with that specific year pointless. Bates had over 100 tackles each of his first 3 years.
Dax
2023: 8.0% missed tackle
Bates
2018: 8.3%
2019: 14.5%
2020: 12.8%
2021: 7.4%
2022: 9.0%
2023: 8.0%
Still a better tackler than Bates, but also a more honest comparison.
Thanks for this as well TLL, gives even more information in proving that Dax isn't as bad of a tackler as Bates has been.
Dax is young as well and should get better. Tackling was a strong suit of Dax Hill in college unlike Bates.
(12-07-2023, 11:12 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Basically, you just went and typed up a bunch of shit to say the exact same thing that I said. Except that you were being misleading by leaving out that 1 missed tackle and 16 tackles is a 5.9% missed tackle rate.
(12-07-2023, 11:29 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Basically I went and typed up a bunch of shit to show that using static counting numbers to compare guys is highly flawed.
I also typed that bunch of shit to point out that comparing a 16 tackle rookie season and a 111 tackle rookie season is absolutely pointless at best. That's along the lines of saying Chase Brown has a higher YPC in his rookie season than Barry Sanders did while not mentioning that Chase Brown's sample size is 11 carries and Barry Sanders was 280. There's a reason that comparative qualification minimums exist.
Nah, you guys both gave info to support the truth, don't be so hard on yourselves lol
