Peppers?

[Burma]

So much nonsense here. Would you take Peppers in the 2nd? Might as well as ask if you would take Barnett or Charlton in the 2nd. It's a thoughtless no brainer. But a moot point since odds are slim he makes it past 16 in round 1. You use him just like the Steelers used Polamalu. As a safety who can play in the box and has the instincts and skills to rush the passer, cover the slot, play the run, or bail and cover the deep center.

[Jpoore]

(03-05-2017, 06:07 PM)Burma Wrote: So much nonsense here.  Would you take Peppers in the 2nd?  Might as well as ask if you would take Barnett or Charlton in the 2nd.  It's a thoughtless no brainer. But a moot point since odds are slim he makes it past 16 in round 1.  You use him just like the Steelers used Polamalu.  As a safety who can play in the box and has the instincts and skills to rush the passer, cover the slot, play the run, or bail and cover the deep center.

Difference is polamalu actually had hands. He had 1 pick that came off a tipped pass. Thats it. People look at his veraatility and while it is commmendable, hes not a good defender. His coverage skills are below average, as are his ball hawking skills. 

[Burma]

(03-05-2017, 06:29 PM)Jpoore Wrote: Difference is polamalu actually had hands. He had 1 pick that came off a tipped pass. Thats it. People look at his veraatility and while it is commmendable, hes not a good defender. His coverage skills are below average, as are his ball hawking skills. 

Polamalu had only 6 int his entire career at USC and only 32 for his entire 12 year nfl career, and 14 of those came in 2 seasons. That leaves him averaging 1.8 int per year. Compare that to a guy who really had hands, Ed Reed who had 64 int in 12 nfl seasons.  Polamalu ended with 12 sacks to Ed Reeds 6, and 47 stuffs to Ed reeds 32, which helps illustrates my point. You use Peppers like Polamalu, and not like Ed Reed and your probably going to see some significant rewards. 

And as to coverage skills being below average and lack of ball hawking; In his 1 year at Safety Peppers had more PD than Polamalu did in any 1 season at USC (10 vs 7).  granted the sample size is not large, but when your coaches keep moving you for the benefit of the team you don't get a lot of time to pad stats or to even maximize your position specific skill set.


Stat Sources:
http://www.usctrojans.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/troy_polamalu_787.html

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/jabrill-peppers-1.html
http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/4474/troy-polamalu
http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/3552/ed-reed

[TKUHL]

(03-05-2017, 06:07 PM)Burma Wrote: So much nonsense here. Would you take Peppers in the 2nd? Might as well as ask if you would take Barnett or Charlton in the 2nd. It's a thoughtless no brainer. But a moot point since odds are slim he makes it past 16 in round 1. You use him just like the Steelers used Polamalu. As a safety who can play in the box and has the instincts and skills to rush the passer, cover the slot, play the run, or bail and cover the deep center.

There is no guarantee that he will be taken before our 2nd pick. Every year there is always a player or two that slide. Who would have thought we would get Maulauga or Billings when we did. I think if anyone had to pick which player that is in the top 15 on most big boards was to slide it would be Peppers.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-05-2017, 08:35 PM)TKUHL Wrote: There is no guarantee that he will be taken before our 2nd pick. Every year there is always a player or two that slide. Who would have thought we would get Maulauga or Billings when we did. I think if anyone had to pick which player that is in the top 15 on most big boards was to slide it would be Peppers.

I agree with this, who knows? Plus Peppers is small and has trouble in coverage.

Just a couple reasons he could fall to the 2nd.

[SunsetBengal]

(03-05-2017, 07:28 PM)Burma Wrote: Polamalu had only 6 int his entire career at USC and only 32 for his entire 12 year nfl career, and 14 of those came in 2 seasons. That leaves him averaging 1.8 int per year. Compare that to a guy who really had hands, Ed Reed who had 64 int in 12 nfl seasons.  Polamalu ended with 12 sacks to Ed Reeds 6, and 47 stuffs to Ed reeds 32, which helps illustrates my point. You use Peppers like Polamalu, and not like Ed Reed and your probably going to see some significant rewards. 

And as to coverage skills being below average and lack of ball hawking; In his 1 year at Safety Peppers had more PD than Polamalu did in any 1 season at USC (10 vs 7).  granted the sample size is not large, but when your coaches keep moving you for the benefit of the team you don't get a lot of time to pad stats or to even maximize your position specific skill set.


Stat Sources:
http://www.usctrojans.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/troy_polamalu_787.html

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/jabrill-peppers-1.html
http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/4474/troy-polamalu
http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/stats/_/id/3552/ed-reed

Any way you slice it, Polamolu had 2.67 ints/year average for his professional career.  I see that you chose not to include numbers on Polamolus's PDs per year in the NFL.  As much as I hate it, Bengals drafted the wrong defensive player from that USC class.  Peppers is in no way a good comparison to Polamolu.  Sure, you can say that Peppers had great offensive stats, but on that USC team, they didn't need to pull a defensive player to the offensive side of the ball.

[Burma]

(03-05-2017, 09:37 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Any way you slice it, Polamolu had 2.67 ints/year average for his professional career.  I see that you chose not to include numbers on Polamolus's PDs per year in the NFL.  As much as I hate it, Bengals drafted the wrong defensive player from that USC class.  Peppers is in no way a good comparison to Polamolu.  Sure, you can say that Peppers had great offensive stats, but on that USC team, they didn't need to pull a defensive player to the offensive side of the ball.

Yeah, that got off track.  The whole point was that utilizing Peppers like Polamalu, up close, and not counting on him to be an over the top ballhawk was the clear way to go.

[Yojimbo]

This reminds me of the Landon Collins argument from 2 years ago. "He can't cover and he'll have to be an in the box safety or nickel LB." How has Collins turned out as a pro?

[bonesaw]

i'd switch to the Delaware Wing T and play him at Wingback

[*ochocincos*]

I say no to Peppers. He has practically the same measurements and combine performance as Shawn Williams, but less defensive production in college. I don't see Peppers being better than Williams at safety. I think they'd both succeed as nickel LB, but you don't draft a nickel LB in the first 1-2 rounds.

If the Bengals take a safety, I hope it's because Adams or Hooker fell to #9 and therefore push Williams to nickel LB. Williams has the speed, size, and tackling prowess to succeed in that role.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-06-2017, 01:18 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I say no to Peppers. He has practically the same measurements and combine performance as Shawn Williams, but less defensive production in college. I don't see Peppers being better than Williams at safety. I think they'd both succeed as nickel LB, but you don't draft a nickel LB in the first 1-2 rounds.

If the Bengals take a safety, I hope it's because Adams or Hooker fell to #9 and therefore push Williams to nickel LB. Williams has the speed, size, and tackling prowess to succeed in that role.

I agree with this Melifonwu is another Safety i would not be against and i feel our Safeties are better than some say.

I like our depth guys, especially Derron Smith if Shawn does not improve. Have Derron at FS and move Shawn to nickel LB.