Was the Defense Really Good Versus the Texans?

[Nicomo Cosca]

(09-15-2017, 11:26 AM)PhilHos Wrote: Think about this: if the defense doesn't give up that TD, all things remaining the same, we win the game last night.

I can play this game too:

If Eifert doesn't step out of bounds in the end zone we win the game. The defense played far better than the offense. How this is even debatable is ridiculous. 

[Au165]

(09-15-2017, 11:30 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: You're right -- but I'm trying to come up with bright spots.  Anything....

Our special teams units have played really well.

[3wt]

(09-15-2017, 11:30 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: You're right -- but I'm trying to come up with bright spots.  Anything....

And I'm usually right there with you.  But I have really bad Bengals hangover today and I'm in boot mode.

[redwood]

(09-15-2017, 11:03 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I keep hearing that the defense played great vs the Texans because they only gave up 13 points. Atkins was fantastic.

This was a Texans team with a QB making their 1st start. Missing their starting Tackle to holdout. With 3 TE's injured starting a practice squad guy starting. And only 3 WR's with their #2 out.

They allowed Watson to run for a 49 yard TD with perhaps the least amount of effort to tackle a guy and shed blocks that I've ever seen our defense display.

They also allowed the Texans to go on a long drive at the end of the game eating the clock to kick a fg.

While the Texans didn't score 49 points, I saw plenty of missed tackles. I saw plenty of missed sacks.

Geno Atkins seemed to be the only guy that played great. Where was Dunlap?

Cosidering how Jacksonville had raised havoc, we did not  quite dominate. It WAS a low points game.  Our offense ....floundered enough that the D had to be on the field a lot. Geno....abused mediocre linemen but I wanted OTHERS to also dominate.  Often we ALMOST got a big play.
On watson's run.......Houston's blockers, mostly WR's  negated MANY Bengal defenders. Refs ain't picky THIS year about holding..it seems, but even so...we had guys in an open field, tied up or.. simply  unable to react well.  Had the Bengals scored a TD, the D would probably get praise but... in a game where offense was minimal, our d could not quite win it.

CLEARLY....the spotlight is now on the OFFENSE.   In 2 home games vs teams NOT outstanding.. ZERO touchdowns and 9 points.   THAT.... is something that makes some coaches look EXPENDABLE.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(09-15-2017, 11:32 AM)Au165 Wrote: Our special teams units have played really well.

They really did. Huber was on his game, Bullock made his FGs, Erickson and Pacman both had nice returns. 

[THE PISTONS]

(09-15-2017, 11:26 AM)PhilHos Wrote: Think about this: if the defense doesn't give up that TD, all things remaining the same, we win the game last night.

That's basically my point. And that TD had extremely sloppy play and tackling.

Then in the 4th quarter, they allowed the Texans to drive down the field and eat clock for a FG. You know they're running. Yet we couldn't stop it.

[sandwedge]

The 1 thing I didn't understand was the Texans last drive and we couldn't stop them from getting into FG range? We knew they were just going to go to Hopkins the whole time, why not shade a safety or another corner over to that side and let Pac cover him deep and whoever get underneath him? It was continually an out route with the option to go deep if Pac tried to undercut it... They never looked Dre's side of the field?
Yeah letting Watson score was bad also...

[THE PISTONS]

(09-15-2017, 11:32 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I can play this game too:

If Eifert doesn't step out of bounds in the end zone we win the game. The defense played far better than the offense. How this is even debatable is ridiculous. 

Eifert stepping out of bounds was inexcusable and should be scrutinized more. It was quite the Bengals play.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-15-2017, 11:32 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: I can play this game too:

If Eifert doesn't step out of bounds in the end zone we win the game. The defense played far better than the offense. How this is even debatable is ridiculous. 

I'm not debating that. The point is that the defense's worse play gave up the winning points. This is not a defense of the offense. Just pointing out something I found interesting ... and disheartening.

[THE PISTONS]

(09-15-2017, 11:37 AM)sandwedge Wrote: The 1 thing I didn't understand was the Texans last drive and we couldn't stop them from getting into FG range? We knew they were just going to go to Hopkins the whole time, why not shade a safety or another corner over to that side and let Pac cover him deep and whoever get underneath him? It was continually an out route with the option to go deep if Pac tried to undercut it... They never looked Dre's side of the field?
Yeah letting Watson score was bad also...

Another good point. I think a great defense stops that team from killing the clock and kicking a FG there. We couldn't.

I also think a great defense stops that Watson run. We had a couple missed tackles early and then our guys just didn't fight through blocks.

[THE PISTONS]

(09-15-2017, 11:29 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: No they didn't. Plenty of people here didn't like those picks. Especially Ross. 

A few didn't, but a lot of people were talking about how we'd be unstoppable with our speed. How Mixon could run with no offensive line. How Dalton would have too many weapons to cover.

[sonofstat]

(09-15-2017, 11:03 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I keep hearing that the defense played great vs the Texans because they only gave up 13 points. Atkins was fantastic.

This was a Texans team with a QB making their 1st start. Missing their starting Tackle to holdout. With 3 TE's injured starting a practice squad guy starting. And only 3 WR's with their #2 out.

They allowed Watson to run for a 49 yard TD with perhaps the least amount of effort to tackle a guy and shed blocks that I've ever seen our defense display.

They also allowed the Texans to go on a long drive at the end of the game eating the clock to kick a fg.

While the Texans didn't score 49 points, I saw plenty of missed tackles. I saw plenty of missed sacks.

Geno Atkins seemed to be the only guy that played great. Where was Dunlap?

I think it's valid to question the offenses they have played...both had injury problems and doubts at QB, and both played VERY conservatively because they simply did not believe our offense would score points and force them to chase the game.

However,  i don't want to overthink it - they pretty much did their job over the past two games and of the top 5 issues right now no one on defense is on that list.

Pre season my biggest concern was the run defense up the middle...Burfict will help tremendously with that when he returns.

I also trust Guenther.  even when the defense has a bad run like at the start of last year he shows he can adapt and right the ship. Also the defensive draft choices look promising (which again might point to the coaching staff on that side of the ball knowing what the hell they want and drafting to fit that)

[Interceptor]

The Texans offense sputtered less than the Bengals offense.

[Millhouse]

The defense was good enough to win, if the offense could have got a TD at some point. But it wasn't great or elite either.

The one play that disturbs me the most was the Pacman pass interference on that last drive. It was 2nd and 20 as they got a flag, and for whatever reason PaulieG decided to not have any safeties at all. Against the Ravens he did the same thing and they got a long TD out of it. Last night Pacman got beat and to save a possible TD, he had to commit pi. All because there was no safety help. To me that falls into the inexcusable category at that point in the game. Being aggressive is one thing, but being stupid about it is another. And that was being stupid which ended up allowing that drive to happen.

[*bfine32*]

I've also heard the deck chairs on the Titanic needed rearranging.

[rezolve11]

(09-15-2017, 11:41 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Another good point. I think a great defense stops that team from killing the clock and kicking a FG there. We couldn't.

I also think a great defense stops that Watson run. We had a couple missed tackles early and then our guys just didn't fight through blocks.

Even the Broncos great defense gave up an 80 yard TD to none other than our very own Jeremy Hill. Many years ago. We still call them great. Lol

[Bengalsrob]

(09-15-2017, 11:30 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: You're right -- but I'm trying to come up with bright spots.  Anything....

Hey I got one: we had an equal number of plays run (62) and had more yards per play (4.8) to their 4.3. We won the total yards 295 to 266, won the passing yards by almost 2 to 1, but they had almost double the rushing yards we had. We averaged 3.4 yards/rush to their 4.8. My "Fred" stats here (which are accurate) makes our offense look almost passable. We lost the turnover battle 1 to zip, yes; it sounds like the offense wasn't so bad.....but then you watch the game. 

[THE PISTONS]

Jim O and Paul D talked after the game and they basically said that while the defense seemed to play well...they couldn't get a stop at the end of the game when they needed it and the big Watson run must be stopped.

[TKUHL]

(09-15-2017, 11:03 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I keep hearing that the defense played great vs the Texans because they only gave up 13 points. Atkins was fantastic.

This was a Texans team with a QB making their 1st start. Missing their starting Tackle to holdout. With 3 TE's injured starting a practice squad guy starting. And only 3 WR's with their #2 out.

They allowed Watson to run for a 49 yard TD with perhaps the least amount of effort to tackle a guy and shed blocks that I've ever seen our defense display.

They also allowed the Texans to go on a long drive at the end of the game eating the clock to kick a fg.

While the Texans didn't score 49 points, I saw plenty of missed tackles. I saw plenty of missed sacks.

Geno Atkins seemed to be the only guy that played great. Where was Dunlap?

Exactly, everyone wants a silver lining but trust me this defense is not it. We probably played the worst offenses these past two weeks other than Indy and of course ours. This whole team is garbage. Wait till we play an actual offense and it's going to look worse than it is now. If this team ever needed to clean house of all coaches it's now. We still have talent on this team, Please MB show us you want to win, show us your just as pissed, show us you do hold coaches responsible, show us you at least have a freakin pulse and do something. Prove to us fans that you actually give a shit.

[sandwedge]

(09-15-2017, 01:27 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Jim O and Paul D talked after the game and they basically said that while the defense seemed to play well...they couldn't get a stop at the end of the game when they needed it and the big Watson run must be stopped.

Yeah like the 2nd and 20 and we let them convert in that drive.....