The Con of Hiring a Coach Fired By Another Team

[THE PISTONS]

I do think Jay Gruden would be about the best realistic coach we could get, BUT he's been 4-12, 9-7, 8-7-1, and 6-8 in Washington.

Hue Jackson has been 8-8, 1-15, and 0-14 as HC. His best year, the Raiders started 7-4 and finished 1-4.

You could explain away their poor performances on not having a QB, flawed rosters, etc.

But...they work for teams now that have a lot of scouts and use free agency.

Here...our roster isn't that great and THEY are going to have to be the ones that scout.

What I'm saying in a round about way is that they will have the SAME ISSUES here...maybe even worse. We need to find a coach who can take an average roster and improve it and take it to the next level. Not coaches who fail with an average roster...because our front office is not better than most teams in the league at acquiring talent.

IF we were say the Steelers or Patriots, a guy like Jay Gruden or Jackson could probably win there...but probably not here...at least consistently.

[*pally*]

Coaches who have been fired have gone on to win Super Bowls and coaches that have won Super Bowls have been fired. So in my mind we cannot immediately dismiss a potential coach because of a previous firing There are plenty of situations that insiders are far more likely to have more details about than we fans do. But I do hope we look outside the "family" for a new coach. I think the team needs fresh eyes and ideas.

[lone bengal]

Personally I think we need a coach who is more of a disciplinarian in the mold of a Mike Zimmer or a Tom Coughlin type. One of my biggest issues with Marvin besides his clock management blunders , inability to make in game adjustments among many other things was that his teams lacked discipline and he seemed to cuddle players. When Zimmer was here guys were terrified to make mistakes because they knew Zimmer would chew them out or find a replacement for them who could do the job right. Marvin just claps when we make bone headed plays and whispers into Burfict’s ear and begs him to please clam down. Look at how Coughlin turned around the Jaguars culture. When we played them their star running back Fournette was late to a meeting so he was benched that game. We also need a coach that isn’t afraid to bench underperforming players regardless of their contracts. I’m from New England, Belicheck benched Gillmore one of the highest paid free agents at the beginning of the year because he was playing like crap. I wonder if he coached here how long Kirkpatrick or Bodine would be the starter ? I’m not saying there is gonna be a Coughlin out there just saying I would like a displined coach after watching Marvin for 15 years.

[Pat5775]

Agrees. I wouldn't hate having Gruden but we can and should do better.

I want someone who's never been associated with this organization. A young up-and-comer, someone full of life and optimism... Someone like Marvin Lewis circa 2003

Though preferably someone not from Pittsburgh who grew up a diehard steeler fan. The fact that Marv at one point in his life had a major hard on for the steelers is something that always irked me

[jj22]

Sure we can do better. But that sounds expensive to MB.

These failed coaches will come cheap. And we all know that is the determining factor.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-21-2017, 11:44 AM)pally Wrote: Coaches who have been fired have gone on to win Super Bowls and coaches that have won Super Bowls have been fired. So in my mind we cannot immediately dismiss a potential coach because of a previous firing  There are plenty of situations that insiders are far more likely to have more details about than we fans do.  But I do hope we look outside the "family" for a new coach.  I think the team needs fresh eyes and ideas.

While that's true...my point is that we can't just assume that we'll have a better infrastructure here. Our front office is pretty bad.

We need a coach who can fix things...not hoping the team can fix the coach.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-21-2017, 11:51 AM)Pat5775 Wrote: Agrees. I wouldn't hate having Gruden but we can and should do better.

I want someone who's never been associated with this organization. A young up-and-comer, someone full of life and optimism... Someone like Marvin Lewis circa 2003

Though preferably someone not from Pittsburgh who grew up a diehard steeler fan. The fact that Marv at one point in his life had a major hard on for the steelers is something that always irked me

We're on the same page buddy.

Gruden isn't a bad hire. IF I were a team that had a really good front office and personnel department I'd probably hire him.

He won't have those advantages here.

Lets face it, if the roster doesn't improve drastically...we're likely an under .500 team next year too. Being that the coaches do much of the scouting, we need a coach who can help change that.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-21-2017, 12:10 PM)jj22 Wrote: Sure we can do better. But that sounds expensive to MB.

These failed coaches will come cheap. And we all know that is the determining factor.

AND MB knows that Gruden and Jackson will come in and play by the Bengals rules.

There is a reason they mainly promote from within. It takes alot of the personality variability out of the equation.

[*bengalfan74*]

(12-21-2017, 12:10 PM)jj22 Wrote: Sure we can do better. But that sounds expensive to MB.

These failed coaches will come cheap. And we all know that is the determining factor.

BINGO !

MB isn't going to go out and pay an outsider real money when he can get Gruden for average money. He's most likely the best we can hope for.

[BengalsRocker]

(12-21-2017, 11:51 AM)lone bengal Wrote: Personally I think we need a coach who is more of a disciplinarian in the mold of a Mike Zimmer or a Tom Coughlin type. One of my biggest issues with Marvin besides his clock management blunders , inability to make in game adjustments among many other things was that his teams lacked discipline and he seemed to cuddle players. When Zimmer was here guys were terrified to make mistakes because they knew Zimmer would chew them out or find a replacement for them who could do the job right. Marvin just claps when we make bone headed plays and whispers into Burfict’s ear and begs him to please clam down.  Look at how Coughlin turned around the Jaguars culture. When we played them their star running back Fournette was late to a meeting so he was benched that game. We also need a coach that isn’t afraid to bench underperforming players regardless of their contracts. I’m from New England, Belicheck benched Gillmore one of the highest paid free agents at the beginning of the year because he was playing like crap. I wonder if he coached here how long Kirkpatrick or Bodine would be the starter ? I’m not saying there is gonna be a Coughlin out there just saying I would like a displined coach after watching Marvin for 15 years.

Oh Marvin.  He'll yell and scream at a nobody, and not say a damn word to his "stars".

I just love it when people/posters claim that you don't need to get emotional or angry to be a leader in defense of Marvin's style.

Yet we have seen him do it to younger and backup players.

So why the double standard?

Yeah he usually sits there with a blank stare and mouth agape.

Then blamo there it is.  Him chewing out a nobody!

He's soft.  He can be a leader without screaming.  Anyone can for that matter.

So what message is he sending as far as discipline.  It's okay to act a fool if you are his "star"?

If you're one of Marvelous Marvin's buds you can blow the game for the team.

Yeah I know.  Player status determines practice and loosening of other rules...  but when gameday comes around he needs to command control of ALL players.

Marvin sucks at this.  Always has.  Always will.

[grampahol]

Hire me and I'll tell em the game is fixed and the team owner is in on the fix so play out your contracts and go play elsewhere! Yey team!  

Come to think about it perhaps that's exactly what Marvin told them all.. 

[Rattler]

(12-21-2017, 12:39 PM)grampahol Wrote: Hire me and I'll tell em the game is fixed and the team owner is in on the fix so play out your contracts and go play elsewhere! Yey team!  

Come to think about it perhaps that's exactly what Marvin told them all.. 

If any owner (gutless money-loving lawyer) would volunteer to bend over for profit...it's this douche bag.

[GreenCornBengal]

What if we fire Marvin, and then bring him back!

Maybe we can wait until like week 6 and bring him back like a Chris Crocker or Winston!

[THE PISTONS]

'There could be a dispute brewing between Brown and his daughter and heir apparent, Bengals executive vice president Katie Blackburn, about who should be the franchise's ninth head coach. Brown apparently is sold on Coughlin; Blackburn is believed to be pushing Lewis, the Washington Redskins' defensive coordinator.'

http://bengals.enquirer.com/2003/01/09/bengals09.html

[Sled21]

You guys are acting like Gruden being fired is a done deal. He's under contract until 2020.... and if Cousins re-signs, there's no way they can him...

[McC]

Coaches who were fired and then coached again--(off the top of my head)--

Tom Coughlin, Andy Reid, Tony Dungy, Bill Belichick, Doug Marrone, Paul Brown.

Yeah, never hire a guy who was fired by someone else.

[corpjet]

We need a HARD NOSED disciplinarian as others have said end of story.

The inmates cant run the asylum, leadership starts at the top, heck we need a Dictatorship as our Head Coach!

Wonder if Benito Mussolini is available?

[HarleyDog]

(12-21-2017, 03:51 PM)McC Wrote: Coaches who were fired and then coached again--(off the top of my head)--

Tom Coughlin, Andy Reid, Tony Dungy, Bill Belichick, Doug Marrone, Paul Brown.

Yeah, never hire a guy who was fired by someone else.

Pretty impressive list there.

[THE PISTONS]

(12-21-2017, 04:48 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: Pretty impressive list there.

Yeah how about the Jim Mora's? John Fox's? Hue Jackson's? Mike Mularkey's?

Any coach will only go as far as the front office takes them here.

[*PhilHos*]

(12-21-2017, 10:32 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: But...they work for teams now that have a lot of scouts and use free agency. Here...our roster isn't that great and THEY are going to have to be the ones that scout. What I'm saying in a round about way is that they will have the SAME ISSUES here...maybe even worse. We need to find a coach who can take an average roster and improve it and take it to the next level

This is why I think it would be to our benefit to hire someone who has college HC experience.